RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (Full Version)

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Owner59 -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 4:27:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet

All this vitriol about the Romney's dressage horse is making many of my fellow liberals sound as stupid and ill informed as Tea Partiers, and I didn't think that was possible. I am no Romney fan, but this isn't any better than the whole birther debate.

The equine tax credit that the Romneys took has been in the code for many years, and was intended to help the racing industry. I don't recall anyone complaining about it before. If you find it so offensive, call your Congressman, but don't blame the Romneys for taking advantage of a perfectly legal loophole. They aren't required to arrange their affairs in the stupidest way possible so that they have to pay the most tax.

People are also outraged, rather stupidly, on Romney's statement that dressage is possible on a normal budget. I have competed in dressage, at a very low level, off and on for years, and I am far from rich. My horse is rather run of the mill, but it has made me a better rider and improved our relationship. I see plenty of people driving down the road in huge motor homes and with big boats. Are they elitist pricks too? People are willing to make sacrifices for what they enjoy. I don't have a fancy car, or a big boat, but I do have a horse. So what.

While it is true that competing at the Olympic level requires a far better and more expensive horse and more money than I could ever put into the sport, but what's so odd about that? Many of those athletes, or their parents, have sacrificed time and substantial money to get them to wear they are. Coaching competing, and travel is expensive for them too. So, are all elite athletes elitist pricks?

Bitching about the fucking horse just makes one look like they hate the Romneys simply because they are rich. I hate the way they earned their money, and I hate what they believe, but resenting someone for the sole fact that they have money is bullshit.



Not an issue anymore......Mitt NOW says he doesn`t like dressage......it`s all good.[8|]




LadyHibiscus -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 4:34:45 PM)

Well dressage is boring as FUCK, really. I mean DOING it is boring, watching it is right up there with drying paint.




tj444 -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 4:56:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Well dressage is boring as FUCK, really. I mean DOING it is boring, watching it is right up there with drying paint.

I think horse races are pretty boring too.. Thats why I like gigi jumping,... its much more interesting, especially on a good course.. biting your nails when you hear the clunk of hooves hit the bar and see it shake,.. tetter, ready to fall,.. or maybe not.. I would watch jumping events held at Spruce Meadows (Calgary) on TV quite a bit.. horses from around the world would attend some of the tournaments there.. its one of the few sports I would watch.. [:)]




Owner59 -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 5:01:57 PM)

Colbert was able to make it interesting....


"Dressage is as American as baseball.....only baseball has more horse testosterone."

"there is no better way to dispel the myth that Romney is a detached patrician elite than competitive horse prancing....it`s basically NASCAR with a velvet top hat."



http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/415570/june-19-2012/mitt-romney-s-champion-horse---stephen-s-dressage-contribution


The Gladstone Dressagers saw this and did a "Budweiser and red foam finger" tribute to Stephen.At least they have a sense of humor.It`s toward the end of the clip.





LadyHibiscus -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 5:26:34 PM)

Show jumping and steeplechasing I love!

I will say that dressage does get you working with the horse very closely, and that's a good skill. And it's way more interesting than nascar!




Owner59 -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 5:39:15 PM)

Watching grass grow is way more interesting that watching paint dry....IMHO...[;)]



Question, aren`t Olympic sports supposed to be between athletes.....I mean human ones....?


While I`m sure the riders are fit.....the horses are doing the competitive part.




ExquisiteStings -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 5:54:07 PM)

 I have to agree with Lady Hibiscus about dressage. Whoop de do. It's like watching poodles jumping through hoops.  And I liked her allusion to the drying paint. Couldn't have said it better myself. Horse racing is grand if you like to place bets on who will win, but if you're crappy at gambling such as yours truly, won't do a damn thing for you. Now show jumping on the other hand, that has me riveted. I always wondered how they knew ahead of time which obstacles to jump over and in what order. But nothing beats the puissance. When I used to live  in NY, I went to Madison Square Garden with one of the most famous riders, a Michael (last name also started with M but I can't remember) and we had seats rather close to the wall of the arena so we got to see the puissance upclose and personal. Some of those jumps exceeded MY height fo 72.5". A lot of the horses made it over but there was one point where they all refused. Imagine running full speed at a tall wall that you know already you have a snowball's chance in hell of getting over. Nothing beats the speed jumping competition and the Puissance. Nuttin' honey.




LookieNoNookie -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 5:55:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

Nobody cares that Mitt Romney is rich. It's Romney's inability to understand the institutional advantage that he gains from the government's tax code largesse, that's a little offensive to people, especially considering Romney's view on anyone else who looks to the government for things like, I don't know, food and medicine.


I don't know...it's a gut feel, and I'm going with it but....something tells me Mitt fully grasps that he pays fewer taxes than many.

(And all within the law).

Now, the bigger question is....

1) Why doesn't everyone pay something (disregard SSI, state unemployment, etc.).

SSI should be paid by everyone...not "up to" whatever is the stupid low limit...but on all income.

2) All income should be the same....you earn a buck...you pay X in taxes. No differential between "earned" and "unearned".

90% of my income is called "unearned" income which allows me to pay taxes at between 0 and 19% max. Usually about 14%.

That ain't fair.

Problem solved.




ExquisiteStings -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:06:30 PM)

To owner 59: Do you think that the rider sits on the horse and lets horsie do all the work? Have you never been riding? Do you not know that horsie must be given instruction as to when to lengthen or shorten his stride so as not to incur any faults. The rider lets horsie know how to approach obstacles with various signals and movements from his/her body. You have to have strong thigh, leg, and glute muscles to keep control of your seat on the horse and give it signals as to how it should proceed. You should have your reins just right in your hands (gloved or you're asking for the blisters from hell) so that if horsie chances to spook for whatever reason you can regain control of the situation and not have to hang on to the main for dear life or risk falling off. Horsie feels every part of you move and in what direction. If you turn your head left, it will know you wish to go in that directin. Same if you turn your head to the right. But horsie must be given signals it understands. And U must keep your seat and stay on the correct  diagonal while posting and trotting. There is a lot more human involvement than you realize owner 59. Pick up a book and read all about it sometime. You will get yourself a true education of just how involved in the movements the rider is. And if you don't want to read about it, than cease and desist with the ignorant comments.




SternSkipper -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:06:54 PM)

quote:

Nah, Skipper, he prefers blondes!!

And I did say that they were pricks, didn't I? LA TI DA and all that there.


Hahahaha ... sorry I couldn't resist ... I hardly think Mark's one of the actual trolls around here.
Hope you're having a nice summer.




LadyHibiscus -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:07:56 PM)

I know it, had to go along with the giggle![:D]




Owner59 -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:14:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExquisiteStings

To owner 59: Do you think that the rider sits on the horse and lets horsie do all the work? Have you never been riding? Do you not know that horsie must be given instruction as to when to lengthen or shorten his stride so as not to incur any faults. The rider lets horsie know how to approach obstacles with various signals and movements from his/her body. You have to have strong thigh, leg, and glute muscles to keep control of your seat on the horse and give it signals as to how it should proceed. You should have your reins just right in your hands (gloved or you're asking for the blisters from hell) so that if horsie chances to spook for whatever reason you can regain control of the situation and not have to hang on to the main for dear life or risk falling off. Horsie feels every part of you move and in what direction. If you turn your head left, it will know you wish to go in that directin. Same if you turn your head to the right. But horsie must be given signals it understands. And U must keep your seat and stay on the correct  diagonal while posting and trotting. There is a lot more human involvement than you realize owner 59. Pick up a book and read all about it sometime. You will get yourself a true education of just how involved in the movements the rider is. And if you don't want to read about it, than cease and desist with the ignorant comments.


With that said... if you`re saying a fitter,more skilled rider will do better than a slightly less skilled/fit rider on the same horse.....I`d have to see the study.

The bottom line is the horses are the athletes and the horses are the ones competing.



I`ve ridden enough to know it`s a great workout.Some of the best times I`ve ever had.



So is quad riding and dirt-biking.Still....it`s the machine that`s doing all the work and carrying me.




dcnovice -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:17:19 PM)

FR

God damn it, I just wrote a long post that got zapped when the fucking cat flicked his tail onto the keyboard. He dies tonight.

I'm too lazy to retype it all, but my point was twofold:

(a) People focus on shit like this because it's easier than addressing thorny, complex issues.

(b) This sort of nonsense is nothing new. Check out the Martin Van Buren images (fourth from the top) at http://library.syr.edu/digital/exhibits/c/cartoonists/johnston.htm.

Goddamn cat.




SternSkipper -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:19:49 PM)

quote:

Show jumping and steeplechasing I love!


Personally I have a liking for Derby Jumping , but a disdain for dressage. The International Jumping Derby We had the first one in our home town and My Mom was always the Derby Secretary there.
But Dressage represents a darker side of my life... I was always getting busted by my girlfriend for "going nappy time" during her routines. It wasn't pleasant to listen to.




SternSkipper -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:25:26 PM)

quote:


2) All income should be the same....you earn a buck...you pay X in taxes. No differential between "earned" and "unearned".

90% of my income is called "unearned" income which allows me to pay taxes at between 0 and 19% max. Usually about 14%.

That ain't fair.

Problem solved.


Hahahahahahahaha ... wake me when that one gets passed by the current house.
I'm not saying it's not a good idea. I'm saying you won't find an elected republican of any consequence who will even come close to putting that one down on paper.




LadyHibiscus -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:26:01 PM)

I love horses, but they are not rocket scientists. They're also stubborn, skittish, and often loony. It's why so many show jumpers have a lot of warmblood in them, so they'll chill.

A good rider can get more out of a horse than a lousy one. The horse KNOWS if you're at all tentative. That said, it's the horse doing the work, sure, with the guidance of the rider telling it what to do when. It's a team effort.




SternSkipper -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:34:19 PM)

quote:

To owner 59: Do you think that the rider sits on the horse and lets horsie do all the work? Have you never been riding? Do you not know that horsie must be given instruction as to when to lengthen or shorten his stride so as not to incur any faults. The rider lets horsie know how to approach obstacles with various signals and movements from his/her body. You have to have strong thigh, leg, and glute muscles to keep control of your seat on the horse and give it signals as to how it should proceed.


Yeah ... okay and then there's animals like my highschool girlfriend's line that were so 'push button' they could make Romney look good on horseback. I remember walking down to the ring with some of those animals and having to take the headphones off long enough to make out what some dweeb stable owner would say about 'pushbutton ponies' long enough to get in my standard "If you have something worth actually pondering, I''l be over in the trailer area listening to the Dead really loud". Anyway it was a major gripe that whomever bought one of their horses tended to clear everyone's clock so long as they were at least passable equestrians.




SternSkipper -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 6:38:17 PM)

quote:

Not an issue anymore......Mitt NOW says he doesn`t like dressage......it`s all good.


No politician I have ever seen has had more in common with the tide than this guy. And what's with the way he moves his head? Is he doing a Reagan imitation? Or does every one who's per-alzheimer's do that?
I wish we were to the debates already. The guy is going to come completely unglued.




erieangel -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 7:00:38 PM)

To answer the OP:

I don't think it is not so much that much that Willard took a $77,000 deduction out on the horse; it is that he claimed prior to that deduction being found that Mrs. Romney got into dressage as therapy for her MS. Several disconnects with that statement alone, mostly though is that the average MS sufferer can not afford anything like dressage for therapy; plus dressage is not a proven for the disease.

But logic would dictate that if Mrs. Romney really got into dressage for therapeutic reasons, wouldn't the horse be listed as a medical expense on their taxes? It isn't. It is listed as a business loss, being the sole property of a business owned by the Romneys and the horse's trainer.

There is a huge difference between therapeutic animals and animals used in competitions. The Romney horse has always been a competitive animal; hence the Olympics. Anything Willard had said concerning the horse prior has been a major lie.

Willard's obvious lies is what has people angry.




Iamsemisweet -> RE: I don't get all the hysteria about the goddamn horse (7/30/2012 7:20:46 PM)

See, this is the kind of thing I am talking about. There isn't a "Romney horse" , there are "Romney horses". She got into horses as therapy for her MS. Whether the average MS sufferer can afford something like dressage or not isn't the point. There is certainly at least andecdotal evidence that riding is therapeutic for things like MS. More importantly, do you honestly believe this horse is the same one she originally bought for her MS? This horse is owned with other people and professionally ridden. A Google search, rather than relying on misinformation, would have shown that. hopefully, that answers your tax question.

Hate on Romney for being a racist asshole instead.
quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

To answer the OP:

I don't think it is not so much that much that Willard took a $77,000 deduction out on the horse; it is that he claimed prior to that deduction being found that Mrs. Romney got into dressage as therapy for her MS. Several disconnects with that statement alone, mostly though is that the average MS sufferer can not afford anything like dressage for therapy; plus dressage is not a proven for the disease.

But logic would dictate that if Mrs. Romney really got into dressage for therapeutic reasons, wouldn't the horse be listed as a medical expense on their taxes? It isn't. It is listed as a business loss, being the sole property of a business owned by the Romneys and the horse's trainer.

There is a huge difference between therapeutic animals and animals used in competitions. The Romney horse has always been a competitive animal; hence the Olympics. Anything Willard had said concerning the horse prior has been a major lie.

Willard's obvious lies is what has people angry.






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