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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 11:42:09 AM   
LadyConstanze


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I read that article in Times or Newsweek too, and thought it was a bunch of baloney.

You do understand that the castration happened 2 days ago, even the vet agrees it is not enough time to change the cat, plain and simple. 2 days to flush all the testosterone out of the system? Ain't going to happen unless we change the laws of biology.

I know cats and most pets want security, but you seem to forget that cats usually don't cannibalize each other and the cat wasn't attacking the dogs as prey but simply was highly territorial, possibly because it didn't have enough of a shelter and viewed everything else as a danger, the idea of a cat seeing humans and dogs as food is a bit absurd. Of course if you'd shrink me to mouse size, yes, I would be prey.

The old myth of cats being solitary beings seems to persist, though cats are actually quite happy in a pack and hunt in a pack (lions for example, though I've seen my house cats do it) and they do form packs with humans and dogs, we even have dumbo rat in the pack. By your reasoning the rat would have been eaten ages ago, well for 3 years said rats happily steals the cat food and the cats complain about it. It's not that my cats don't hunt mice or rats (and bring them home) I think when they do grow up with another animal, the animal becomes part of the family (or rather pack) and things shift. I'm under no illusions that if Mr Slinky would run around outside, the cats would hunt him down, however in the pack he has his place and he has dog guardians. Last year we had a blackbird with a broken wing that healed up in our house, once it was established that we feed the bird and it belongs to the monkeys who can open tins (I guess that is how they view us), they showed zero interest in it and we had a hard time keeping Ms Blackie away from the wet food of the cats.

The whole issue is simply that 2 days don't seem to be enough for a cat to change the personality even after a castration, it's not just that he's mellow, I sat outside for a while in the sun and read a book and all of a sudden Greebo snuggled up on my lap. I still got a bite when I applied the eye drops (he's got a bad eye infection and the vet gave me some drops and said while she has not much hope that I get near enough, but in case I can...).

What I think is the case here is, it's the first time he possibly was not sleeping rough, somebody didn't just give him food but petted him and gave him affection, so yes, security. The vet also deflead and dewormed him (sorely needed, he was full of parasites), if I do that to my pets they are usually sick for a bit, but needs must. A cat who possibly never had that is scared shitless what's going on, somebody being nice to it...
But still a shy, feral cat doesn't turn into the big love monster over night or 2 days after a castration and I'm not going to delude myself that I have the magic touch, cats and dogs seem to like me, but still, a feral cat is not going to change literally overnight.

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 12:35:58 PM   
angelikaJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

But still a shy, feral cat doesn't turn into the big love monster over night or 2 days after a castration and I'm not going to delude myself that I have the magic touch, cats and dogs seem to like me, but still, a feral cat is not going to change literally overnight.


LC,

He may not have always been feral.

He could have been an extra cat that someone dumped and then he found a food source.

< Message edited by angelikaJ -- 8/18/2012 12:37:09 PM >


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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 12:49:44 PM   
LadyConstanze


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True but once a cat is that shy and quasi feral, it's not much difference, and it takes them a lot longer to trust humans again. I tried to pick him up to wash a few drained abscesses (he was in pretty bad shape when the vet got to him and they sedated him rather than using a local anesthetic, he was that aggressive) with a mild saline solution, and picking him up seems to be a bad thing, he gave me a few really nasty scratches...

I let him into the garage and gave him a few cat treats and then coaxed him to lay on his side so I could wash it out, he seems to be OK with it when it's luke warm and I let him smell the sponge I'm using. I'm seriously feeling so sorry for him, he's a very big cat but undernourished, vet said has little to do with the food he got, more with all the parasites he had in him. H is grumbling that of course I have to find the ugliest cat on the planet, which is a bit of an exaggeration, while not exactly handsome, he does have some rugged charms. I'm dreading having to give him his worm pills in 4 weeks (he's so bad the vet thinks we should repeat it then), even my quite placid boys turn into snarling monsters when it comes to deworming...

Oh and I got him a pillow that has catnip in it, he really digs that one...

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 12:52:04 PM   
GreedyTop


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*nods* many of my outdoor kittes are "previously homed".

Bibby will hopefuly become a household kity.. the whole spay/shots/etc will decide that, CASHIE is SOOOOOOOOOOOOO not happy with the idea (he hissssed/growled/swattted at her this morning when I accidently left the back door cracked open and BIBS TRIED to peek in..

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 1:41:48 PM   
QueenRah


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

But still a shy, feral cat doesn't turn into the big love monster over night...and I'm not going to delude myself that I have the magic touch, cats and dogs seem to like me, but still, a feral cat is not going to change literally overnight.


But, that may, very well, have been the case. When he was at his most vulnerable, you gave him comfort and safety. You may be the only person who has done that for him and he may be responding to you accordingly.

Nine years ago, I fostered a semi-feral kitten for over a month. I fed him, talked to him, and kept him company, whenever I could. But, he never allowed me to touch him. He hissed at me, if I dared come too close. The animal adoption agency, for whom I was fostering him, got him adopted out. The fool they adopted him to forced herself on him and was bitten by him. She returned him and they asked me to take him back, permanently, because he would never be adoptable. For two weeks after I got him back, whenever I was home, he snuggled with me at every opportunity. I still have my strange, sweet, semi-feral Eddie.

Welcome to the world of the "sucker" stamp. It's on your forehead, in infrared and strays see it. I have one, too.


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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 2:36:56 PM   
LadyConstanze


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Mine pointedly ignore Greebo and tart with the dogs (aka mark them as theirs) and Greebo pretends he can't see my cats...

I think I might as well give up and accept that he decided to move in

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 3:56:09 PM   
nameonhold


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quote:

when the vet got to him and they sedated him rather than using a local anesthetic, he was that aggressive



Undoubtedly !!! The vet doesn't want to get mauled.

I had a cat once with such bad table manners the vet would come in to examine the cat wearing falconry gloves. The vets assistant would be standing there with a fire blanket to throw on the cat if the cat got away in the examination room.

The vet was taking NO CHANCES.

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 4:51:43 PM   
Phoenixpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

The whole problem is that we are dealing with the logistics of moving with 5 animals so far, we don't really want to add a number 6, because the whole pet passports and all that is quite expensive and it does complicate things. We want to do up the house, sell it and get the hell out of Britain, it's complicated enough with the animals we have, airlines really have you over a barrel when it comes to transporting animals...


oh yeah, I can relate to that...now...I didnt even need the airline as we could use the eurotunnel but in my case the almost 500 bucks for my 5 pet passports was completely unneccessary as of course nobody checked it anyway

On top of that a colleague came over from ireland and she didnt have to pay a cent for their passport itself....

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 4:55:14 PM   
Phoenixpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: nameonhold

quote:

He actually goes home to his owner to check if she put food out, scoff it and then comes back, he takes occasional strolls but usually camps out...

While it's summer I'm sure that he's fine in the little shelter I made him, but when it starts getting colder, I might just crack and let him in because I feel sorry for him...



This is exactly the set of circumstances this cat is constantly evaluating. "Where do I get the better deal ? Here, or the house next door ?"

It's really simple. If you're giving him a better deal, he will appear to be loyal to you. If the cat gets a better deal next door, he will appear loyal to next door.


Yeah, thats why I am now hunting for my missing cat

Cause he prefers to be an only cat (I had 5 before he walked off) and now having to get up and down 38 steps each time he gets out and in at my new place....he wasn't impressed

Though...I still want him back

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RE: New cat problem - 8/18/2012 4:56:31 PM   
Phoenixpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I read that article in Times or Newsweek too, and thought it was a bunch of baloney.

You do understand that the castration happened 2 days ago, even the vet agrees it is not enough time to change the cat, plain and simple. 2 days to flush all the testosterone out of the system? Ain't going to happen unless we change the laws of biology.


Yep, my vet told me that Urmel could have still caused pregnancies for a certain time after he got castrated....

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 6:28:14 AM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
We want to do up the house, sell it and get the hell out of Britain,

where are you wanting to move to & why there? have you lived in that country before?

A few years ago i chatted with a guy that sold his house in the UK and moved to France, the money he got he was able to buy a castle or something along those lines, it had a turret! The thought of having a place in France has intrigued me, especially after seeing Tina Turners place in the south of France & the amazing view from her infinity pool (saw that on the Oprah show).. (drool, drool)

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 8:33:15 AM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

The old myth of cats being solitary beings seems to persist, though cats are actually quite happy in a pack and hunt in a pack


Yeah, a couple of cats took out a sheep around these parts.

I've also seen a couple of cats "talking" together on the porch in one of the first apartments I had. Went on for quite some time with these various melodies over the general theme of meaow, both quite friendly with each other. Lots of cats will seek people out, despite being fully aware that it won't lead to food. If our queen accidentally does something to make us sad (like missing a jump so something falls off the table and breaks), she sulks until we're happy again. Etc.

No idea how "needs some personal space and occasional alone time" turns into "solitary".

quote:

(I guess that is how they view us)


You need to read Tailchaser's Song.

quote:

they showed zero interest in it


This seems to be part of how they show "I'm comfortable with this creature being around."

quote:

What I think is the case here is, it's the first time he possibly was not sleeping rough, somebody didn't just give him food but petted him and gave him affection, so yes, security.


Well, you did have him by the balls and then let him live. Maye that counts for something.

IWYW,
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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 9:12:27 AM   
LadyConstanze


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
We want to do up the house, sell it and get the hell out of Britain,

where are you wanting to move to & why there? have you lived in that country before?

A few years ago i chatted with a guy that sold his house in the UK and moved to France, the money he got he was able to buy a castle or something along those lines, it had a turret! The thought of having a place in France has intrigued me, especially after seeing Tina Turners place in the south of France & the amazing view from her infinity pool (saw that on the Oprah show).. (drool, drool)


Actually because I lived in other places before and the quality of life is so much better there, also economy wise for both of us, and frankly the state of the NHS is more than just a factor, it's so bad that there is basically no point in seeing a doctor, I have an old gall bladder issue that tends to flare up from time to time, years ago in another country the recommended surgery as they said it will always come back and said once I get it regularly, I need surgery or else there will be scaring. Same symptoms, same pain, they tell me to take pain killers and since they can't see stones nothing to be done... The doctors here are more of a health risk, so yeah, that is the main factor, along with a lot of other factors. I don't want a castle and nope, France definitely not, Switzerland, Germany, Northern Italy and Austria are currently in discussion and I'm seriously contemplating a job offer from the US.

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 9:15:58 AM   
LadyConstanze


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad



Well, you did have him by the balls and then let him live. Maye that counts for something.

IWYW,
— Aswad.





LOL, well, minus the balls kinda... And yeah I gave up, I am letting him live in the tiny shed with occasional supervised trips to the garage, first attempt to mark or attack cats and dogs, he loses garage privileges, if he behaves I'll add his chip to the programming of the cat flap but I will wait with that for a while...

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 9:33:43 AM   
Phoenixpower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze


quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
We want to do up the house, sell it and get the hell out of Britain,

where are you wanting to move to & why there? have you lived in that country before?

A few years ago i chatted with a guy that sold his house in the UK and moved to France, the money he got he was able to buy a castle or something along those lines, it had a turret! The thought of having a place in France has intrigued me, especially after seeing Tina Turners place in the south of France & the amazing view from her infinity pool (saw that on the Oprah show).. (drool, drool)


Actually because I lived in other places before and the quality of life is so much better there, also economy wise for both of us, and frankly the state of the NHS is more than just a factor, it's so bad that there is basically no point in seeing a doctor, I have an old gall bladder issue that tends to flare up from time to time, years ago in another country the recommended surgery as they said it will always come back and said once I get it regularly, I need surgery or else there will be scaring. Same symptoms, same pain, they tell me to take pain killers and since they can't see stones nothing to be done... The doctors here are more of a health risk, so yeah, that is the main factor, along with a lot of other factors. I don't want a castle and nope, France definitely not, Switzerland, Germany, Northern Italy and Austria are currently in discussion and I'm seriously contemplating a job offer from the US.


*grin* and there I thought I was always seeing everything wrong.... though my last GP was awesome in the UK but I know what you mean...

anyhow...I wish you lots of success in making the right decision to where you will be moving to...

I'm currently 30 mins away from austria....I like it here with the alps

And I am happy for your new slave...I am sure he will do his very best to avoid displeasing you...

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 9:38:00 AM   
LadyConstanze


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The cat is more like adding a new demanding master to the house... In case I don't check regularly on him he does make a hell lot of noise outside. But he goes back to his old home and eats the food, which is more or less what he did before, so I am sure she won't miss him or think anything is wrong, she might be pleasantly surprised that nobody complains anymore about being scratched by him, or have their own cats beaten up badly. She's possibly convincing herself that she was right to not neuter him and that the problem would go away, and I'm not going to enlighten her.

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 10:18:40 AM   
GreedyTop


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Aswad.... Tailchasers Song is a great book! (I need to find my copy again...)

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 10:33:40 AM   
ResidentSadist


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quote:

surely a castration doesn't work that quick on calming him down?


Try castrating a male sub and watch how quickly he finds a new set of manners too.

Just sayin'

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 12:47:33 PM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
We want to do up the house, sell it and get the hell out of Britain,

where are you wanting to move to & why there? have you lived in that country before?

A few years ago i chatted with a guy that sold his house in the UK and moved to France, the money he got he was able to buy a castle or something along those lines, it had a turret! The thought of having a place in France has intrigued me, especially after seeing Tina Turners place in the south of France & the amazing view from her infinity pool (saw that on the Oprah show).. (drool, drool)


Actually because I lived in other places before and the quality of life is so much better there, also economy wise for both of us, and frankly the state of the NHS is more than just a factor, it's so bad that there is basically no point in seeing a doctor, I have an old gall bladder issue that tends to flare up from time to time, years ago in another country the recommended surgery as they said it will always come back and said once I get it regularly, I need surgery or else there will be scaring. Same symptoms, same pain, they tell me to take pain killers and since they can't see stones nothing to be done... The doctors here are more of a health risk, so yeah, that is the main factor, along with a lot of other factors. I don't want a castle and nope, France definitely not, Switzerland, Germany, Northern Italy and Austria are currently in discussion and I'm seriously contemplating a job offer from the US.

Sorry to hear that you need surgery and that situation.. I can understand moving to where you would get the best health care you can get.. I have scoliosis and there is a specific exercise treatment (invented in Germany) that i would like to try but only a handfull of practioners of that technique in the US..

That is quite a selection of countries under consideration.. it will be interesting to hear which one you, your hubby & fur babies finally decide on..

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RE: New cat problem - 8/19/2012 4:36:24 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad
Yeah, a couple of cats took out a sheep around these parts.


Well, that's Viking cats for you! I'm sure that we're all aware that cats are no namby-pambies in your neck of the woods, Aswad. Tell me, were the cats in question wearing little helmets with horns on them? And did any of them look like Kirk Douglas?

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