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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 8:42:41 AM   
sunshinemiss


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Delighted to go in other locations is still willing to go, sunny. You're not brandishing the "all lifestyle people are <fill in the blank> attitude. There really is a difference.

As an aside, do you really think incestuous is the best word for kink groups where most people find dating and/or sexual partners within the group, even when the last partner from the group didn't work out? I've heard other people use the term for those situations where it seems like everybody within the group has been with everybody else at one time or another, but in locations like yours and Mine there may not be a ton of kinky folks locally that can be found except within the group. Might make for interesting conversation.



It is an interesting question. For me, I use it to try to capture all the he said / she said / I'm not speaking to kind of drama that goes with what I would call an incestuous group. Too many bruised egos and broken hearts. Again, they are perfectly lovely people - and frankly I was as kookie and dramafied when I was that age.

As for the All Lifestyle People Are X... I didn't realize that was an attitude that prevailed. I always wonder more about people being too nervous to go. Hmmm. Interesting.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 8:46:20 AM   
LadyHibiscus


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I am done with munches and the public scene generally. I still DO go to parties, and the OH NO NEVER reaction puts me off, too. What exactly are they afraid of?



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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 8:58:35 AM   
sunshinemiss


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What are they afraid of?
Themselves - if I do this, if I go there, it's real for me. I have to completely redefine who I am.
If I go there, someone might know me. I'm not really sure I dig this, but dang, it could totally ruin my reputation... for nothing!
What if I don't do this the right way?

Other People - who is gonna be there? Will my someone I know be there? Will people expect me to X when I show up? What are the rules anyway? What does one wear to these things? Is it ok to talk to a Z kind of person (married, dom, poly, whatever). Will I have to X if someone tells me to?

And then there are the generally "nervous in groups people" who could be in a group of gardeners or at a first book club meeting or going to mass for the first time and are nervous.

There is plenty to be afraid of when you don't know the norms.


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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 9:10:08 AM   
LadyHibiscus


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I hear what you're saying, Sunny. And I DO understand basic social anxiety stuff, I have been the escort/shield for many many people over the years. Personally, groups of more than six are pushing the envelope of No Fun these days.

I am harsh, because I have always been the one that's alone. I started hooking up with other pervs and leatherfolk before the internet. On my own. Knowing no one. So, when someone gets flibberty about a public meet in a coffeehouse... they get the hairy eyeball.

I keep saying this is the deep end of the pool. If someone is not even willing to walk there from the shallow end, wellll....they are not Hib Material. That doesn't mean that they won't do great with someone else.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 10:27:54 AM   
Lucifyre


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

I just want to respond to this:
quote:


Various reasons for not being willing to attend lifestyle events.
To extend what CP said above, that's those who are over zealous in their concern about being outed, the 'all lifestyle people are <insert complaint here>' issues, and related topics. You don't have to be the type who plays at public events, but if you can't go to a restaurant to a munch, there's a problem somewhere.


Honestly, LadyPact, I have zero interest in going to a munch here. All the people are half my age, and there is an awful lot of incestuous drama. I went to one. That was PAHLENTY. No thanks. They are perfectly fine people, but I have nothing in common with them. When I'm in the States (or other places) with people my own age, I'm delighted to go. For the most part, though, I would rather read a good book and drink a cup of tea at home.



I am also one who isn't fond of munches. The ones we went to when we lived up north were good stuf. There was usually a topic and a speaker and then a round table type discussion in the second half of the time frame then socializing later on...a typical munch was 3-5 hours depending on how long folks decided to stay and socialize. That's where you met folks, got party invites, hooked up with people, even found occassional dates.
The munches we have been to here are far less organized. Mostly they are just meet and greet, with no education or real discussion...not very group involved, more just eat something and introduce youself around and hope to find someone to talk to that seems interesting.
It seems they fall back on the local public dungeon for the everything else stuff. That kind of causes issues in itself since when people are paying gas money plus tolls plus entrance fee to go, less of the kinky public as a whole chooses to go AND you want to get your moneys worth when you do and you tend to stay involved in doing your own thing rather than worrying about meeting or talking to anyone else.

We have probably just gotten unlucky with the couple of groups we have tried with. Of course trying again is going to have to wait a few more weeks but whatever the munches aren't going anywhere.

I'm going to put a ps at the end of this discussing a very sensative topic. If you're feeling argumentive or snarky I suggest you don't read it.

Lucifyre









p.s. Another problem we have found here in the south is SO many people that obviously have "let themselves go" so to speak. I'm not talking only about 90% of the *out* kink populatin being extremely overwieght (mostly submissive women) either. For the record, it IS entirely possibe to be heavy and have it be apparent that you DO give a damn are are concious of yourself, so being "fat" is not really the only problem. Morbidly obese however is an entirely seperate subject and there's a metric ton (pun intended) of that going on down here as well. Not everyone can claim they have thyroid problems. (and yes the pendulum can swing the other way as well i.e. way too skinny, as in anorexic looking) But, I'm mainly talking about I can count on one hand the people we have met since we began going back out in public last April who look like they try to take care if themselves or how well they present themselves in public.
Hygene seems to escape quite a few folks as well regardless of thier place on the scale. Unwashed hair, unbrushed teeth, forgotten deodorant, unwashed or very sloppy clothing etc. It's quite shocking actually.
It seems to us that the only ones trying to make a decent impression happen to be the Pro Dommes that use the dungeon for thier clients every weekend OR the girls that are under age 25 (way too young for us) and <maybe> a very short list of select few tat attempt to make an effort. And I'm not talking about the crowd that's been there since 8 pm and it's now 3 am and they've been playing on and off for hours and just happen to have that "I've gotten a workout" look about them. I'm talking about people at 10 pm who just got there and already look like shit.

Now, Mr and I being poly with no "third" in the house right now that really presents a problem since the local *out* crowd just doesn't impress us in the least. I promise you I am not being overly picky either. That leaves us pretty much with seeking what we are looking for online...and that feels like either we get criticized for looking in the first place, or it's a crap shoot about who it is we might meet....MOST people aren't entirely honest about themselves before the first face to face. Very frustrating and a problem I have yet to figure out how to solve. While I don't expect to meet a unicorn, I had hoped before we came back out that we might just find it in the local scene...it's not looking like that's going to happen.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 10:46:28 AM   
LadyPact


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss
It is an interesting question. For me, I use it to try to capture all the he said / she said / I'm not speaking to kind of drama that goes with what I would call an incestuous group. Too many bruised egos and broken hearts. Again, they are perfectly lovely people - and frankly I was as kookie and dramafied when I was that age.

As for the All Lifestyle People Are X... I didn't realize that was an attitude that prevailed. I always wonder more about people being too nervous to go. Hmmm. Interesting.

I think the highlighted above is My forming an opinion from those who are on the net. I often see "all the people at the local munch are too young/old/unfriendly," etc. I've seen posters who have been in the same location that I've been in prior come on the boards to say how cliquish certain groups are when we never had that reception. There's one poster that's still here who said numerous times that the people at her local munch were mean and then we heard the real story about why she wasn't received well (from multiple sources). When I hear that any group (or even sometimes just certain individuals) are too judgmental, I look to the person complaining more than
I do the group.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 11:04:26 AM   
UllrsIshtar


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Personally I HATE munches. They don't do them In Belgium, so I had never been to one before coming to the USA.

To be fair, I've only done a couple so far, but I think they absolutely suck. I think the atmosphere is bad, the groups and up being weirds, and I so far haven't been able to figure out what you're supposed to gain from going to them.
Now play parties, or dungeons/clubs that's a whole different thing. I love those, and the only bad one I've even been to was Sin Center which was really sad/disappointing, because they've got one of the best facilities (and just under 8000 square feet) that I've ever seen.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 1:02:46 PM   
whantsonlyu


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Well I'm new, that being said my red flags in general are:
1. Someone not respecting no. I try to be polite, but if that don't work then it's a HELl NO.
2. If in the first email or two you want my yahoo or other, sorry but that's not happening till I feel comfortable.
3. Not respecting limits/ instant anything.
4. At any point if I'm not comfortable and hes still being pushy.
I understand not telling it all,but if asked relationship status and I get told I'm single. Only to find out I'm lied to, when I was open and up front. What else are you lying about? The whole what do you want to eat, well I'm not so picky I will try a new dish at a restaurant. I am a firm believer in actions speak louder than words.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 2:30:23 PM   
GreedyTop


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

No, because you I can just drag to the munch with Me.




*puddles*

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/25/2012 5:20:06 PM   
kalikshama


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quote:

And then there are the generally "nervous in groups people" who could be in a group of gardeners or at a first book club meeting or going to mass for the first time and are nervous.


My ex and I went to munches and events together, and that was fine. In FL, I dragged my ex and his current. I think I paid for their meals. M and I went to munches here. At this point, I've been to enough that I'd be comfortable, but if going to a new munch might check profiles from the fetlife RSVP and if I feel rapport with anyone email them about meeting ahead of time and going together or meeting there.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/27/2012 11:19:15 AM   
DaddysGentleHand


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For me, certain behaviours are huge red flags, and rate "Do not pass Go, do not collect $200"

Victim mentality - we have all seen it, and it is never good.

Financial disarray - I understand teaching good money management skills, but some people just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again. When you make $100, you cannot spend $200 - only the government can do that!

Drug or alcohol problems - Addictive behaviour or dependency issues almost always end bad.

Quick-change moods - When you have moments when you just are not sure which personality you are facing at any given moment, it is time to cut bait.

That's my two cents.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/27/2012 4:49:49 PM   
MercTech


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Munches... the good, the bad, the indifferent....

The good munches I've attended were simply a place to discuss lifestyle issues where you didn't have to edit the topic of conversation. A bit above a meet and greet but a good place for a novice to get input from those more experienced.

The bad were the ones treated like a hookup session where you were expected to pick the meat of the moment and go somewhere private to play.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/27/2012 4:52:56 PM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

Munches... the good, the bad, the indifferent....

The good munches I've attended were simply a place to discuss lifestyle issues where you didn't have to edit the topic of conversation. A bit above a meet and greet but a good place for a novice to get input from those more experienced.

The bad were the ones treated like a hookup session where you were expected to pick the meat of the moment and go somewhere private to play.


Oh man, the LA social used to be epic. It would easily have 200 people during the summer months. Out by the pool of a nice hotel with cocktails and food. It was a blast.


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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/27/2012 5:00:50 PM   
Lucifyre


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

Oh man, the LA social used to be epic. It would easily have 200 people during the summer months. Out by the pool of a nice hotel with cocktails and food. It was a blast.



This sounds like it would be fun ;)

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/28/2012 7:03:40 PM   
DesFIP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

the groups and up being weirds, and I so far haven't been able to figure out what you're supposed to gain from going to them.



What you get from them is being found to be trustworthy enough to be invited to someone's home where a play party is being held.

I don't know about you, but I want to vet people before I invite them into my home. Not just give my address out to strangers on the net.


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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/29/2012 6:58:59 AM   
culareD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

Munches... the good, the bad, the indifferent....

The good munches I've attended were simply a place to discuss lifestyle issues where you didn't have to edit the topic of conversation. A bit above a meet and greet but a good place for a novice to get input from those more experienced.

The bad were the ones treated like a hookup session where you were expected to pick the meat of the moment and go somewhere private to play.




That does not sound like so much fun...

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/29/2012 7:02:08 AM   
GreedyTop


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

Munches... the good, the bad, the indifferent....

The good munches I've attended were simply a place to discuss lifestyle issues where you didn't have to edit the topic of conversation. A bit above a meet and greet but a good place for a novice to get input from those more experienced.

The bad were the ones treated like a hookup session where you were expected to pick the meat of the moment and go somewhere private to play.


Oh man, the LA social used to be epic. It would easily have 200 people during the summer months. Out by the pool of a nice hotel with cocktails and food. It was a blast.




Sportsmans, yeah?

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/29/2012 7:02:42 AM   
culareD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddysGentleHand

For me, certain behaviours are huge red flags, and rate "Do not pass Go, do not collect $200"

Victim mentality - we have all seen it, and it is never good.

Financial disarray - I understand teaching good money management skills, but some people just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again. When you make $100, you cannot spend $200 - only the government can do that!

Drug or alcohol problems - Addictive behaviour or dependency issues almost always end bad.

Quick-change moods - When you have moments when you just are not sure which personality you are facing at any given moment, it is time to cut bait.

That's my two cents.


I completely agree with this, however there is a flip side too.

Too sickly sweet...

Too "financially" put together, and trying to offer the world (Christian Grey syndrome)

Doesn't allow me to drink a glass of wine...or a shot of Patron *licking lips*

No personality what-so-ever.

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/29/2012 7:05:36 AM   
GreedyTop


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obviously, you are an alcoholic, and not on his radar... just sayin' LOL

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RE: Red Flag attitudes... - 8/29/2012 7:26:52 AM   
culareD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

obviously, you are an alcoholic, and not on his radar... just sayin' LOL


I've read so much about the evils of drinking and smoking, that I've given up reading.

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