RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle

Page: << < prev 7 8 9 [10] 11 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 6:30:13 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Welcome to the sisterhood! You are also related to GreedyTop and Daddysredhead, just so you know.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to sexyred1)

Profile

Post #: 181

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 6:32:37 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

Goody!! I love them too!!

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Profile

Post #: 182

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 6:37:35 PM

Duskypearls

Posts: 3561
Joined: 8/21/2011
Status: offline

Regardless of the nature/dynamics of a relationship, whether with oneself, another, a pet or a hobby, I see it as an energy exchange, be it mental, emotional, spiritual, sexual and/or physical. We're all trying to find our fit in the right person who will fulfill (as much as possible) our needs, desires and urges, whether it is those who need to give to feel good, or those who need to receive to feel good, and/or both. Either way, both are giving and receiving all the time, so it is always an exchange.

Perhaps those that see it as a gift do so because they are grateful they found their fit in someone, or are hoping to do so. Perhaps they do it to self-aggrandize as they lack a strong, positive sense of self. Perhaps they do it because they'd like to feel recognized and highly valued by another. Perhaps they do it because they think highly of, and value, themselves. Perhaps they do it for all the reasons folks here have mentioned, or more.

In spite of the inwardly troubling times I'm presently going through, I personally believe I have much to offer the one who recognizes and will honor my value. That is why I do not, willy nilly, give it away. Some day, someone out there will see, value and want it, and be very grateful for it, whether they call it a gift or just plain old good fortune we finally found each other.

(in reply to sexyred1)

Profile

Post #: 183

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 6:40:12 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Well said, Dusky!

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to Duskypearls)

Profile

Post #: 184

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 6:52:43 PM

JeffBC

Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Duskypearls
Some day, someone out there will see, value and want it, and be very grateful for it, whether they call it a gift or just plain old good fortune we finally found each other.

My impression of the whole "gift" thing when someone is actually in a relationship referring to a specific individual is an ENTIRELY different thing. Carol... all of her not simply her submission... is a gift from the universe to me. I try hard daily not to squander that gift. The only other interpretation is that I am somehow deserving of her and frankly, that just seems implausible to me.

_____________________________

I'm a lover of "what is", not because I'm a spiritual person, but because it hurts when I argue with reality. -- Bryon Katie
"You're humbly arrogant" -- sunshinemiss
officially a member of the K Crowd

(in reply to Duskypearls)

Profile

Post #: 185

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 7:01:28 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Duskypearls
Perhaps those that see it as a gift do so because they are grateful they found their fit in someone, or are hoping to do so. Perhaps they do it to self-aggrandize as they lack a strong, positive sense of self. Perhaps they do it because they'd like to feel recognized and highly valued by another. Perhaps they do it because they think highly of, and value, themselves. Perhaps they do it for all the reasons folks here have mentioned, or more.

Or perhaps they see it as a gift because they genuinely want to give a big, unselfish gift, and do it out of what is largely generosity. You kind of forgot by far the most searingly obvious example there, DP - in favour of a lot of psychological guesses. Seems odd to me.

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 8/21/2012 7:03:27 PM >

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com

(in reply to Duskypearls)

Profile

Post #: 186

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 8:18:59 PM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline

It always cracks me up when people argue of terminology. That thread was such a train wreck. I'm glad you are here to put a positive spin on things. Each and every one of us can make something meaningful in our own way whether it be "true dominance," "true submission," or the "gift of submission." These don't have to be arrogant, universal standards -- and I didn't think the beleaguered OP over there meant them as such.

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Profile

Post #: 187

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 8:31:27 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

I simply enjoy spreading cheer and good will during the holidays. It makes my heart happy.

So yes, some people DO give without needing to be reciprocated. The fact that they are doing it to feel good with themselves and feel as if they are making the world a better place is all that is needed by some people.

Exactly my point. You get something out of it.... they are people in your life that give something to you - even if it is that you feel good doing it, filial piety, momma bear love, etc.

I'm thinking this is a semantics thing again...

I am getting something out of it but there is no expectation of getting something out of it. I would still do these things even if I got nothing from it because it's based on my moral system and faith that it's a duty and an obligation to your fellow man.

But for a relationship it's different...there IS an expectation of something in return. When I chose to submit to him, I was doing so under the assumption I would get a long term, loving relationship with a dominant personality man.

_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Profile

Post #: 188

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 8:33:49 PM

Duskypearls

Posts: 3561
Joined: 8/21/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Duskypearls
Perhaps those that see it as a gift do so because they are grateful they found their fit in someone, or are hoping to do so. Perhaps they do it to self-aggrandize as they lack a strong, positive sense of self. Perhaps they do it because they'd like to feel recognized and highly valued by another. Perhaps they do it because they think highly of, and value, themselves. Perhaps they do it for all the reasons folks here have mentioned, or more.

Or perhaps they see it as a gift because they genuinely want to give a big, unselfish gift, and do it out of what is largely generosity. You kind of forgot by far the most searingly obvious example there, DP - in favour of a lot of psychological guesses. Seems odd to me.

Don't think I did, dear one, as you can see by what I've bolded. Please note the "...or more." part. That's there because I know I cannot think, know or have experienced everything.

I belive we are very emotional, mental, psychological beings (among other things), and are prompted by different needs and desires, whether they be balanced or neurotic. As others have intimated, many give or are generous as it makes them feel balanced and/or good (for whatever reason), so they are getting something out of it...an emotional payoff. It can be related to what they think others think of them, or just what they think of themselves, and the standards to which they perceive and hold themselves (their identity). Only each individual can define what it is they give and why. Although it is only my opinion, which is worth no more than anyone elses, I have yet to meet a human that was otherwise, not that I have met and assesed all humans, or that I would be right in my assessments.

I am generous because I have an investment in that perception of myself, so when I give, the giving to another "feeds" me and my sense of self, goodness and purpose, which is very self-soothing. That is my payoff.

< Message edited by Duskypearls -- 8/21/2012 8:35:30 PM >

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Profile

Post #: 189

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/21/2012 11:32:10 PM

NuevaVida

Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline

Hey sunny,

A couple of things in your post I wanted to comment on...

quote:

“Following one’s personality does not equal giving a gift”
I guess I’m a little new agey and all, but I *do* see it as a gift. I see it as some universey thing that I’ve been given. *FOR ME* it is perhaps even a bit of a mind fuck. This difficult “opportunity for growth” is actually a lesson from the universe to make my life better. That or G*d is just slapping me around. I’m gonna go for a gift of growth every time.

I'm more than a little new-agey, lol. At least by some people's standards. I see it that the Universe gave him to me, and gave me to him, and pretty much gives us everything we need (whether we recognize, like, accept it or not). So in that line of thinking, I'm a gift to him - but *I* didn't give him that gift. God, Goddess, the Universe (whatever anyone believes in) gave me to him. He is a gift to me, from the universe.

But it's me - the complete whole woman - who is a gift to him. Not a singling out of one aspect of me (submission).

My ability to live being true to myself is my own gift to myself (I see it this way after having denied myself the freedom of being "me" for a very long time).

So yeah, we're gifts, but I'm not giving him me as a gift; the universe is. Just as the universe gave him everything else in his life, and gave me everything else in my life.

quote:

Gratitude is a regular, daily part of my life. I heard a woman once praying who thanked G*d for a cold glass of water on a hot day. I remember how shocking it was that she was grateful for such a simple thing. I was a kid when I heard her pray that prayer. Since then I’ve often faltered, but I’ve tried to see the good in things, tried to appreciate even the worst of circumstances, tried to find the gift in everything. Perhaps, in actuality, this has been a double edged sword. While I don’t take things as much for granted – perhaps I ought to? - I’ve also been taken for granted more than I ought to have allowed.

I would be worried if my perspective were that I, SUNSHINE, AM SO SPECIAL. But that’s not it. For me, it’s that the people in my life are really amazing and wondrous. I feel so lucky to have them there. Their friendship is a gift to me.

Gratitude is amazing, and makes me see life much differently. I have a really good friend and we talk about gratitude all the time. I'm grateful for my life. And on those really hard days, yeah I focus on being grateful for even the "little" things (which are actually pretty big things, when you think about it) - like having water to drink, a bed to sleep in, and so on.

I do tend to think, though, that the "gift of submission" idea is more like the "I AM SO SPECIAL" concept you referred to. You never hear about the gift of mastery, eh? The problem I have with the "gift of submission" is it's too focused on the submission. I mean, I have friends who are stay at home moms and they are grateful to their husbands, and see their husbands as a gift to them. But they don't say "The gift of his income", they see their complete existence as a gift from God (or whomever).

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to sunshinemiss)

Profile

Post #: 190

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 8:35:54 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

And now you see why Cali is my sister. Though I do not laugh, not as such. There is some appalled pearl clutching,

That is hysterically funny.

Ok, I want to be your sister too; anyone who says there is some appalled pearl clutching is a heroine of mine.

I love you woman.

Indeed!

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to sexyred1)

Profile

Post #: 191

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 8:39:12 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

I really stay here to keep in touch with my fanbase.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Profile

Post #: 192

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 8:46:23 AM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline

I am here mainly to be a fan to several people....

(oh, and also to whinge, moan, and laugh)

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Profile

Post #: 193

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 12:45:13 PM

myotherself

Posts: 7157
Joined: 3/9/2006
From: The cold bit of the UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

And now you see why Cali is my sister. Though I do not laugh, not as such. There is some appalled pearl clutching,

I will admit to a triple-take at the phrase 'pearl clutching'.

I think I have a dirty mind, cos the phrase 'pearl necklace' came to mind, and not the kind a nice lady would wear to lunch

_____________________________

There's nowt so queer as folk

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Profile

Post #: 194

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 1:53:36 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

I admit that as usual, the BUNNY IS HAVING MORE FUN THAN ME.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to myotherself)

Profile

Post #: 195

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 1:57:30 PM

PeonForHer

Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline

I completely missed the 'pearl' analogy, I'm ashamed to say. I had no idea that it was to do with lady parts, silly old sausage that I am!

_____________________________

http://www.domme-chronicles.com

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Profile

Post #: 196

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 1:58:53 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Because it hasn't, darling. I worry about you, sometimes.

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Profile

Post #: 197

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 1:58:56 PM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline

I think that the Bunny needs a spanking.

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to PeonForHer)

Profile

Post #: 198

RE: The dreaded "Gift of Submission" debacle - 8/22/2012 1:59:51 PM

myotherself

Posts: 7157
Joined: 3/9/2006
From: The cold bit of the UK
Status: offline