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KaleidoKenlyn -> Craving more of a specific type of play (8/26/2012 1:04:46 PM)

In the "Changing Styles" forum, I noted that my dom doesn't do breath play as much as I would like.
My question to doms is why? He knows that it's my favorite. I've been wondering about it on my own for a while now. Maybe it's precisely because it IS my favorite that he won't give it to me as often as I would like. I've also thought it might scare him a bit, but I'm not sure. There was one time when he thought he'd made me pass out. The only other thing I could think of was the possibility that he does do it pretty often, or at least as often as any other form of play. Maybe it just seems to me that it's not happening enough because.. well .. it can't happen "enough" for me. Haha.
My question to other subs is does this ever happen with you? Where your dom holds out on a specific type of play?

EDIT: I've read over the post so far, and I'm not sure if I phrased this whole thing very well or not. If I didn't, I'm sorry. Kinda low on zzz's right now.



AthenaSurrenders -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/26/2012 1:13:42 PM)

I suppose there could be lots of reasons.

Like you said, he might be worried about the safety aspect. It's undeniably one of the most dangerous types of play out there.
He might be rationing it out to keep you on your toes.
He might feel like he's doing it pretty frequently from his point of view.
He might have so many other things he wants to try he doesn't have time for everything.
It might not be doing much for him so it feels like a big effort to do it.

Does it happen to me? That's a tough one to answer. To be honest I'm not sure I really have a favourite type of play. What gets me excited is being frightened of what might come next, the specific acts are not as important. For me personally (and I'm not trying to demonstrate how super-duper-submissive I am, I just can;t think of another way to phrase it) I enjoy things a bit less if I feel like he's doing it for my sake. What feels really good is if I know he's doing the things that excite him the most, even if they are acts I don't really enjoy.

I think the closest I can get is that I think I would like more kink time in general - my sex drive is higher than his and a lot of the physical stuff is purely sexual for him. I think it's a case of perspectives. He feels like we're having loads of sex and I feel like we're going a bit slow. I feel it's on me to keep the momentum going because it would be no big deal to him if we did nothing for a week. Not much to be done other than both keep trying to meet each other's needs.



samdarella -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/26/2012 4:07:49 PM)

In a perfect world life wouldn't get in the way and there would be time for all the play either of us wanted. But reality is there just isnt enough time in the day. I get what I need but not nearly as much as I want. But that's ok. It will make it even
More special when we do. Lol I'm practicing my patience. Does it sound like its working?



graceadieu -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/26/2012 11:16:26 PM)

Maybe he's just not that into it.

I know how you feel - there are definitely some things that I really like that we rarely do and I wish he'd do more. And for us that's all it is - he's just not into certain kinds of play that much so we don't do them much.



Nanako -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/26/2012 11:23:08 PM)

I read somewhere that breath play is one of the few things that cannot be done safely. An essay written by a doctor, he basically said that no amount of precautions, short durations, etc, could ever completely remove the risk of brain damage, death, or other complications from breathplay, and his advice was that nobody should be doing it ever.

this wasn't the same article, but it's interesting reading nevertheless: http://www.telecomassociation.com/pubs/chokinggamereport/files/aea3.htm
Personally what i've read is enough to convince me that the pleasure isn't worth it.



DeviantlyD -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 12:13:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KaleidoKenlyn

In the "Changing Styles" forum, I noted that my dom doesn't do breath play as much as I would like.
My question to doms is why? He knows that it's my favorite. I've been wondering about it on my own for a while now.



Uh, don't you think you should ask him instead of a bunch of random strangers who might include those who do not have a clue and pretend they know?
(Rhetorical question.)

I never get why posters ask complete strangers why their Dom/sub/slave/Master/label-of-your-choice won't do something. Like anyone would fucking know what goes on in the life of that individual and could realistically answer the question. *shakes head*

To answer your question directed to the subs (even though I wouldn't necessarily classify myself as such), the answer is no.



kitkat105 -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 12:17:01 AM)

Just like any other relationship, you need to communicate your wants/needs/desires/interests. He's not a mind reader. Just because you are submissive, doesn't mean he won't necessarily indulge you in things you enjoy.



DeviantlyD -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 12:24:21 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nanako

I read somewhere that breath play is one of the few things that cannot be done safely. An essay written by a doctor, he basically said that no amount of precautions, short durations, etc, could ever completely remove the risk of brain damage, death, or other complications from breathplay, and his advice was that nobody should be doing it ever.

this wasn't the same article, but it's interesting reading nevertheless: http://www.telecomassociation.com/pubs/chokinggamereport/files/aea3.htm
Personally what i've read is enough to convince me that the pleasure isn't worth it.


Good points Nanako!

There are no guarantees of the outcome of certain types of play.

http://www.jaywiseman.com/SEX_BDSM_Breath_Closing_Argument.php

I wonder if the OP's dom knows CPR. It might be prudent to learn, if he isn't already proficient at it.



kitkat105 -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 12:28:40 AM)

Some of us do things in the hope that it gives Jay Wiseman a cold sweat in the middle of the night. [;)]



DeviantlyD -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 12:37:36 AM)

Ha!

I know he has a reputation as being overly cautious, but I also understand why. When you see the sorts of things he's seen (as an expert witness in many trials involving BDSM), your viewpoint gets skewed. Seeing only the bad gives you that same perspective.

But at the same time. If none of the "bad stuff" ever happened, he would have no reason to wish to caution others. Personally I'm not willing to involve myself in RACK behaviour. I get high enough from beatings and that works for me. :)



SimplyMichael -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 6:51:57 AM)

The last time I taught a BDSM class, Jay Wiseman attended it. Not actually a big deal, living in San Francisco we all run,into each other. Jay's opinion on breath play is not widely shared, it is certainly risky. I temper the risk by doing stuff tjat psychologically feels like breath play but avoids/limits pressure on the corrotid artery. It is also important to understand,that breathplay covers a lot of ground and certain orms are quite safe...

I would get bored if I always had to do one form of play but I must admit, breath play is hot.



KaleidoKenlyn -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 6:56:03 AM)

quote:


Uh, don't you think you should ask him instead of a bunch of random strangers who might include those who do not have a clue and pretend they know?
(Rhetorical question.)

I never get why posters ask complete strangers why their Dom/sub/slave/Master/label-of-your-choice won't do something. Like anyone would fucking know what goes on in the life of that individual and could realistically answer the question. *shakes head*

To answer your question directed to the subs (even though I wouldn't necessarily classify myself as such), the answer is no.

I was planning to ask him, thanks. I thought it would be interesting to get some other points of view. And I really thought it would be interesting to hear if any one else had experienced anything similar to it.
quote:

I read somewhere that breath play is one of the few things that cannot be done safely. An essay written by a doctor, he basically said that no amount of precautions, short durations, etc, could ever completely remove the risk of brain damage, death, or other complications from breathplay, and his advice was that nobody should be doing it ever.

this wasn't the same article, but it's interesting reading nevertheless: http://www.telecomassociation.com/pubs/chokinggamereport/files/aea3.htm
Personally what i've read is enough to convince me that the pleasure isn't worth it.

There's danger to a lot of things we do. For me, it's worth the risk.
quote:

I suppose there could be lots of reasons.

Like you said, he might be worried about the safety aspect. It's undeniably one of the most dangerous types of play out there.
He might be rationing it out to keep you on your toes.
He might feel like he's doing it pretty frequently from his point of view.
He might have so many other things he wants to try he doesn't have time for everything.
It might not be doing much for him so it feels like a big effort to do it.

Does it happen to me? That's a tough one to answer. To be honest I'm not sure I really have a favourite type of play. What gets me excited is being frightened of what might come next, the specific acts are not as important. For me personally (and I'm not trying to demonstrate how super-duper-submissive I am, I just can;t think of another way to phrase it) I enjoy things a bit less if I feel like he's doing it for my sake. What feels really good is if I know he's doing the things that excite him the most, even if they are acts I don't really enjoy.

I think the closest I can get is that I think I would like more kink time in general - my sex drive is higher than his and a lot of the physical stuff is purely sexual for him. I think it's a case of perspectives. He feels like we're having loads of sex and I feel like we're going a bit slow. I feel it's on me to keep the momentum going because it would be no big deal to him if we did nothing for a week. Not much to be done other than both keep trying to meet each other's needs.

Hooray for great response. It's really interesting to me that you enjoy things less if it's being done for your sake. Not in any negative way. Just out there- for me anyway, heh. I have no problem doing things that I hate if it's something he likes. But yeahh... When he does something I like and I know that he's doing it purely because I like it, well let's just say it doesn't spoil it one bit, haha.
I've got the same problem as far as sex drives go. He loves the kink bit, but for-real sex? He could get by without it much longer than I care to.



Kana -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 9:54:32 AM)

True story here.
A while back I was involved with this chick in a pure TPE, one of those rare ones you mostly read about-straight power dynamic, no deep emotional attachment just a owner/piece of meat type thing.
And it was great. She was into hardcore maso/degradation/humiliation/objectification/dehumanization stuff-just a fuck pig slut I could do whatever I wanted with(And she was this real bif shot businesswoman too, power suits, lots of sycophants, all that shit. Oooh, it was so sexy tearing that authority figure attire off and just savaging her, making her scream for days. That was good shit).
Pretty f'ing hot really.
And everything went well for the first year or so, then we got into breath play.
Now I like breath play, its fun stuff, hits real real deep inside girls, but this chick, she got into it waaaaaaaay more than I do.
Things started slow, hands around the neck, then belts, plastic bags during sodomy, things like that. Then they progressed to garrottes, real hard-core way out edgy shit. But even that wasn't enough. She wanted to be hung til she turned blue and passed out.
And more, she needed it.
Which I wasn't willing to do. This was around the time of the Preppy Murder Case in NY, where his defense was they were involved in breathplay, things went to far and his chick died. Flat out died. And he got serious time, like 5-15 years.
I don't have many hard and fast rules in life, but one of them is, "I don't go to jail for pussy." Been there, done that, got the T-shirt, it wasn't even kinda worth the price of admission.
I would take her to a certain level but no further. Doms got limits too, ya know.
So things went on, but as they did, she became less and less satisfied with the result from play, as did I. I mean, who wants a slave whose needs they can't fulfill? and who wants a dom who can't meet her one critical need?
So after lots of thought, lots of soul searching, lots of talking, I set her free.
Why?
Because it would have been vastly selfish to keep her around otherwise. It would have been self centered, self seeking, wrong and if nothing else, eventually the relationship was bound to crack around this issue anyhow, it would just take a while to reach the forefront.
So I did the right thing-sent her on her way with my blessings, steered her toward a cat I knew who was more up her alley.
I run into her every once in a great while. It's always good to see her...and it's always good to still see her alive and breathing. :-)


I know that's probably not the answer the OP is seeking, but that's my experience. Not an opinion. Not something I read once on a forum. Rather, something I lived and felt. Take it for what it is....



KaleidoKenlyn -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 5:30:40 PM)

Thanks for sharing the story, Kana. That's intense! Usually I would try to ask a question about a story that someone shares, but you seem to have answered every question I would be able to think of already. Anyway, it seems like you did exactly the right thing..

Let me get something out of the way, here. I know I may get preached at for breath play because "there's no safe way to do it" or whatever. But we are as safe as we can be. He's always extremely attentive- we have several gestures that we use, so that he will know if I am okay and how okay I am at that time. He also doesn't generally cut my air off completely for more than 90 to 120 seconds at a time. Yeah, yeah those links you guys posted said that damage can happen from having your air cut off for a minute. But erm... I don't really buy that. Musicians will sometimes go without air for more than a minute. And deep sea divers?? They hold their breath for several minutes at a time. And them.. well it's only up to them to know the limits of their body and to get to the surface when they need air. Whereas for me, there's two of us paying attention. Their air is rather far away also, when you're considering them bursting with the need for it. Yes, I know that they've been professionally trained. But all the training in the world counts as nothing sometimes if people don't listen to their bodies. I do. And he pays even more attention than me. Now as I said, he doesn't completely cut off my air for more than 90 to 120 seconds at a time. The rest of the time, he'll be squeezing and pressing, but always leaving me the tiniest of ways to get some air, but never much.



BambiBoi -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 7:16:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KaleidoKenlyn

Now as I said, he doesn't completely cut off my air for more than 90 to 120 seconds at a time. The rest of the time, he'll be squeezing and pressing, but always leaving me the tiniest of ways to get some air, but never much.


I've been watching this thread for a while, trying to find a nice way to say "with dangerous kinks, its not uncommon for the sub to want more more more harder harder harder, which forces a responsible dominant to show restraint."

I don't care if I was choking out the free dive champion of the world, I would never go two minutes without air. I recognize that I'm soft when it comes to being extreme, but how much more do you want? (Please keep in mind that the mammalian diving reflex doesn't work without water). I get the sense we are no longer talking about wanting breath play of this caliber more often, but instead to deeper degrees.

You don't want to be preached at, and that's not what I'm trying to do. You asked why he doesn't want more. If I were your top, I'd say "every time we go in I worry, it frightens me. I don't feel comfortable going longer, and the amount of completely uninterrupted effort I need to focus on her every twitch is grueling on me."

Find a way to be content before too long. There's a reason free divers leave pretty corpses.



sexyred1 -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 8:07:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KaleidoKenlyn

Thanks for sharing the story, Kana. That's intense! Usually I would try to ask a question about a story that someone shares, but you seem to have answered every question I would be able to think of already. Anyway, it seems like you did exactly the right thing..

Let me get something out of the way, here. I know I may get preached at for breath play because "there's no safe way to do it" or whatever. But we are as safe as we can be. He's always extremely attentive- we have several gestures that we use, so that he will know if I am okay and how okay I am at that time. He also doesn't generally cut my air off completely for more than 90 to 120 seconds at a time. Yeah, yeah those links you guys posted said that damage can happen from having your air cut off for a minute. But erm... I don't really buy that. Musicians will sometimes go without air for more than a minute. And deep sea divers?? They hold their breath for several minutes at a time. And them.. well it's only up to them to know the limits of their body and to get to the surface when they need air. Whereas for me, there's two of us paying attention. Their air is rather far away also, when you're considering them bursting with the need for it. Yes, I know that they've been professionally trained. But all the training in the world counts as nothing sometimes if people don't listen to their bodies. I do. And he pays even more attention than me. Now as I said, he doesn't completely cut off my air for more than 90 to 120 seconds at a time. The rest of the time, he'll be squeezing and pressing, but always leaving me the tiniest of ways to get some air, but never much.


I can introduce you to my ex. He likes breath play so much, that he does not listen to safe words. Which is hard to do when you are choking.

One of the reasons he is an EX.

Some things are not safe to do, no matter how hot you think they are.



subbingincalif -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/27/2012 8:30:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: KaleidoKenlyn

In the "Changing Styles" forum, I noted that my dom doesn't do breath play as much as I would like.
My question to doms is why? He knows that it's my favorite. I've been wondering about it on my own for a while now. Maybe it's precisely because it IS my favorite that he won't give it to me as often as I would like. I've also thought it might scare him a bit, but I'm not sure. There was one time when he thought he'd made me pass out. The only other thing I could think of was the possibility that he does do it pretty often, or at least as often as any other form of play. Maybe it just seems to me that it's not happening enough because.. well .. it can't happen "enough" for me. Haha.
My question to other subs is does this ever happen with you? Where your dom holds out on a specific type of play?

EDIT: I've read over the post so far, and I'm not sure if I phrased this whole thing very well or not. If I didn't, I'm sorry. Kinda low on zzz's right now.



Obviously, you should ask him.

That said, I can certainly understand his reticence if he thought you almost passed out. The more dangerous the activity, the more responsibility for the dom, and he may not feel he has the experience, skill or desire to engage in something so risky. And that to me would be a reasonable position.



DeviantlyD -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/28/2012 12:41:56 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

The last time I taught a BDSM class, Jay Wiseman attended it. Not actually a big deal, living in San Francisco we all run,into each other. Jay's opinion on breath play is not widely shared, it is certainly risky. I temper the risk by doing stuff that psychologically feels like breath play but avoids/limits pressure on the carotid artery. It is also important to understand,that breathplay covers a lot of ground and certain orms are quite safe...

I would get bored if I always had to do one form of play but I must admit, breath play is hot.


Do tell!




quote:

ORIGINAL: KaleidoKenlyn

quote:


Uh, don't you think you should ask him instead of a bunch of random strangers who might include those who do not have a clue and pretend they know?
(Rhetorical question.)

I never get why posters ask complete strangers why their Dom/sub/slave/Master/label-of-your-choice won't do something. Like anyone would fucking know what goes on in the life of that individual and could realistically answer the question. *shakes head*

To answer your question directed to the subs (even though I wouldn't necessarily classify myself as such), the answer is no.

I was planning to ask him, thanks. I thought it would be interesting to get some other points of view. And I really thought it would be interesting to hear if any one else had experienced anything similar to it.



Given that others aren't engaged in a relationship with you, I would think it would be your dom's point of view that is the only one that matters. To each their own.



xssve -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/28/2012 5:54:21 AM)

Yes, liability is a factor, although I don't know for sure if anybody has ever died from gagging on cock - which is a kind of breath play. Just sayin'. [8|]



ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Craving more of a specific type of play (8/28/2012 6:18:17 AM)

*Using FR*

BB said it as succinctly as I could, and possibly with even more finesse:


quote:

You don't want to be preached at, and that's not what I'm trying to do. You asked why he doesn't want more. If I were your top, I'd say "every time we go in I worry, it frightens me. I don't feel comfortable going longer, and the amount of completely uninterrupted effort I need to focus on her every twitch is grueling on me."


I've seen this exact same issue with breathplay of this kind more than once over the years -- the sub wants more and more and more, and eventually the dom burns out. Something about it appears to be addictive, and now that I think of it along those lines, the subs I'm remembering all show aspects of the addictive personality (but than many of us do).

Hhhmm....breathplay is the BDSM equivilent of smack...it's so good, once you try it you have to keep going back for more? Interesting concept.












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