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ThrowAway88 -> RE: He's Clearly Vanilla (9/16/2012 10:48:32 AM)
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(I guess I can't chunk it out like I'd hoped. So... giant wall of text it is....)
quote:
ORIGINAL: graceadieu
I tried that, a few times, before I realized that I just can't date vanilla anymore, at least as a primary relationship. It's too likely to end in heartbreak. It's kind of unfortunate, because it narrows the dating pool tremendously, but I need what I need. (And for what it's worth, I still don't really approach dating - if I'm looking for a relationship - as "kink first". I think I still approach it "love first", I just vet out people who aren't dominant.)
I suspect that you're going to be in the same boat, where your ongoing unfulfilled emotional needs will fester into unhappiness. And I'm sorry about that. But have you tried laying out to him exactly, in detail, what it is that you need from him? It's possible that even if he doesn't "get it" all the way at first, he might get into it. At least enough to keep you happy.
Thanks for this. I think that’s exactly what I’ve been wondering. If we’ll grow together here as we have everywhere else in our relationship. And it has to a certain point. He knows things I like in bed, when to be rough, how I like to be spanked, tied up etc. And since he’s grown there it has made me wonder and hope, probably, that it’ll grow more. And I don’t know that it won’t but I’m at the point where I’m starting to doubt it.
It’s pretty typical relationship stuff. Vanilla or not. And I’m just looking for a safe place to think it all through out loud. I’m grateful for the place to do so.
quote:
ORIGINAL: SlipSlidingAway
Your submission means more to you than you realized. It was likely time with someone who was not wired to react to it that helped bring that to your attention. I don't agree that you are at fault for attempting to have a relationship with him. We all learn about ourselves on a continuing basis. You know more about you now than you did going into it. The thing is, what do you do with that new knowledge?
Chances are things are not going to end up happily. I hate to burst bubbles, and be all realistic and stuff, but people don't change that much. So, he's pretty much who he is, you are pretty much who you are, and if those two people don't jive in some rather significant way? It's likely going to cause relationship discord at some point in time. You both deserve to be with someone who can appreciate ALL the parts of you, at least all of the important ones. And since you are here posting? I'm going to say this one is pretty important to you.
Thanks. You’re pretty dead on. All I can really do is talk to him about it, of course, but I kind of had to get my thoughts straight. I don’t think I realized, or perhaps I’d just forgotten, how important this is to me. I don’t expect anyone to be perfect but I need to be able to express love this way. It’s a little like suffocating. In an unfun kind of way.
He definitely deserves someone who will appreciate him for exactly who he is as do I. And I do. God he’s amazing. I just need a little more and it makes me feel terribly guilty.
quote:
ORIGINAL: AsmodaisSin
I haven't posted in a while but this OP really tugged at my heart strings. I went through almost the exact same situation about seven years ago. The only difference was that I was still accepting my submissive nature. The vanilla guy I was with at the time was perfect for me in almost every other way. The only problem? He wasn't a Dom and he couldn't satisfy me the way that only my Daddy could. This vanilla guy tried, though. I was honest and upfront with him once I realized everything going on with myself. At one point, I actually laughed in his face. It was an awful feeling afterward. I apologized and we went our separate ways.
I know what you're trying to say. He's not a Dom. He doesn't approach you the way you need, he doesn't look at you the way you need; he doesn't speak to you the way you need. Dom/Dommes are a totally different animal.
If you want to stick with him, that's your choice, but I believe you're only fooling yourself. I tried sticking around with my vanilla guy. I even asked for advice here just like you. Every response, for the most part, parallels everything I was once told.
I know that some kinky people make those kinds of relationships work. You have to figure out inside yourself if he'll be able to handle that.
Talk to him. Be truly honest, because right now, you are just fooling yourself.
My thoughts and prayers are with you though.
-mel
Thanks for this. Truly. It helps to read that others have been here. It’s a tough place. I want to do and be the right thing. But it’s hard. You’ve said it well and all I can add is... thank you.
quote:
ORIGINAL: KYsissy
"Perfect". How often in life do we find this? I married Miss Pretty Damn Good. 10 years later she is miss Perfect, for me. No my wildest fantasies are not fulfilled. But in the big scheme, they are not that important. Besides, if they were fulfilled, I would just think up new ones.
Great response. Gives me some perspective and made me laugh. Thank you. And congratulations. You sound very content. That’s a wonderful thing.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Alecta
bit of a throwaway suggestion, why not bombard him with passages from the Fifty Shades series that particularly excite you? It's mainstream enough that it wouldn't be a BDSM hardsell, and it might be just what he needs to ignite his imagination and interest?
Funny thing is... I haven’t read it. I’ve read all the other BDSM classics but this... I don’t know. Maybe it was just bad timing or something. But this is valid and would help when I seem to be without words so frequently. Sometimes I have a hard time being clear and concise so this might help. Thank you for the idea.
quote:
ORIGINAL: BambiBoi
Dear ThrowAway,
I appreciate how hard being torn is. You have a solid relationship in the bag, but the Master of your dreams is in the bush. You want to go hunting, but you don't want to lose the farm. You have my sympathies. I don't think you've done anything wrong by wanting more, but it would be helpful to know what exactly is missing. Is it 24/7 D/s elements? Is it a hardcore sadistic streak? Is he also submissive? The more you can fill in about what's missing, the easier it is to give more than sympathy and hugs.
Let's look at this logically.
(... edited for length....)
In short, despite some very pointed stabs at your current mate, you seem unwaveringly in his arms. Don't throw that away. Lets find a way to build around it.
I respect your anonymity, so if sharing details does not work for you, I understand.
This response got me. Thank you. And I think it made me realize there’s more here that isn’t right than just him being dominant. Maybe I’m putting the label on it and lumping it in when in reality, there’s more that’s not right outside of this.
I would like to add that the only two valid options are the first two. I’d never go behind his back or cheat or any of that. And he wouldn’t go for, nor would I want, some sideline thing.
It is hard. Relationships are hard. It was difficult for me to date looking for a dom ahead of looking for just a good person. Id really like to chosoe my mate based on values and ethics and compatibility first, and have dominance just be there. Which is unrealistic, I suppose. I think, when we met, I was telling myself that I was naturally drawn toward dominant men so it would be fine. He’s the most balanced person I know and displays no dominant characteristics. That’s what’s missing. I love that head of household feeling. I’m just a worshipper. I love great men and he is a great man. He just doesn’t want or need some of the ways I need to express that.
quote:
ORIGINAL: sexyred1
OP, you know it is supremely annoying to give serious replies based on a life well lived to people like you and when you don't hear what you want to hear, you pronounce certain posters as conveying hostility.
That is such bullshit and truly delusional. No one here is hostile towards; none of us know you or really care all that much, but some of us actually like serious issues on the boards and when applicable, we reply.
You have not answered the questions posed to you and are being fairly dismissive and back pedaling now.
I believe the ladies here gave you good points, do with them what you will, but never for a moment believe you have affected anyone to the point that our words seem "hostile". Honest, yes, direct, yes, hostile, oh hell no.
I’m not trying to be annoying. And for the most part, with all internet communication, I can take the good with the bad and leave the rest.
IMO, Saying “shame on you!” and telling me he deserves better than me is hostile. As is calling me delusional. But perhaps I just define “hostile” differently. Either way, I’ve not taken it too harshly. And I did expect some of the harsh words. In fact, I stated so in my original post so it’s not affecting me too greatly. I treat people differently but it’s ok.
I started this thread to get help. To take a good honest look at my relationship. To backpedal and be dismissive would be counter to what I’m trying to accomplish. If it comes across that way, I apologize. It’s not meant to.
And for the most part, I agree that I’ve gotten excellent responses. Which is why I came. Why I asked for thoughts, ideas, and guidance. To me, this is a very serious issue. I wanted shared experiences and I got them. And I’m grateful.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Greta75
Life is often so complicated isn't it.
(...edited for length...)
Look at it this way, if you can't give 100% to him, you are short changing him, let him go. If you choose to commit, then you got to commit to that 100% all the way.
Thank you for sharing. Life is complicated. And I may be experiencing something very similar here though he hasn’t said he won’t do the things I need, but it just isn’t in him.
Know that horrible, awful, thing portrayed on bad television shows, where the wife clearly needs help with something but wants the husband to Want to help with that thing? And by asking for it over and over it becomes obvious that all she really wants is his Desire to help? It’s kind like that. Horrible analogy but I’ll leave it. I want him to Want this and it’s so completely not his fault that he doesn’t. He tries, and I love him for that, maybe it’ll grow but it would have to grow organically from within him and I’m not sure it’s there. I’m not sure he’s not sure it’s not there either. (That’s a mind twister)
quote:
ORIGINAL: LadyPact
I'm late to the party but I'll throw in My two cents.
I'm not real thrilled with the "regular poster that created a sock" kind of thing. If you are a regular poster, you probably already know what I'm going to tell you. I've been here five years and I've said the same thing all along.
(In My opinion, a regular poster would have known LaT better than you did, but that's just Me being cynical.)
You came here knowing that nobody could answer these questions but YOU. Chances are, you even know why that is. Only you know how high of a priority kink or an authority dynamic is in your life. What good does it do for Me to tell you that I could walk away from all of this any time and just be content with MP as My soul mate? All of this stuff is optional for Me. It always has been. That doesn't help you because I have no idea if it's optional for you or if it's something that is more important to you, instead.
I've walked away from this before. When kink wasn't in My life, I didn't sit in My vanilla world pining away for it. If I gave it up again, the only part that would matter would be that I'd probably lose touch with many of the kinky friends I've made over the years. That sure isn't enough for Me to give up what I have with My other half.
The thing you have to ask yourself is whether or not it's optional for you. Nobody else can answer that. YOU have to look inside yourself and see what the answer is and make your decisions based on that. For Me, when the rubber hits the road, love is enough. The question is, can that be enough for you?
If I could answer those things on my own, I wouldn’t be here. That’s the catch-22.
And I’ve apologized about the throwaway account. I’m sorry. I know it sucks. However, I’m not a Regular Poster. I have been at times, over the years. I’m familiar with you, LaT, and remember Hannah and to go waaaaay back, LuckyAlbatross. She was fantastic- don’t know if she still posts but I liked her style. And so many more. But part of the deal with creating a throwaway is that I can’t expect gracious treatment based on stated membership and familiarity nor can I act like I “know” you all. Because truly I don’t. I’m familiar that’s it, and I do have a great deal of respect for you all and your experiences. Which is why I’m here. And I think I’ve been, have tried to be, respectful. So again, thanks.
quote:
ORIGINAL: Winterapple
You say you are very much in love with
this man. He's perfect and the sex is
great. But. I'm just going to speculate
on the but.
By perfect I wonder if you mean he
is by most standards a good catch.
An attractive decent stable man
probably with a good income who is
in love with you. A relationship with
him offers you security. You perhaps
are not in love with him or at least
not as in love with him as he is with
you which gives you the upper hand
in the relationship.
Should you be practical and take
this safe bet or should you break
it off and seek a man or men who
excite you more? A much less secure
path that could mean you'll end up
alone without a life partner at the
end of the day.
That's really something you can only
answer for yourself. If the only thing
wrong with this perfect man is he
doesn't fit your ideal of a dominant man
you might want to ponder on why
that's your ideal and what that ideal
means. Then there's the whole he
sees you as an equal thing which you
find a turn off. Personally, I would never
be with a man who didn't see me as
his equal. No matter what the power
dynamic I wouldn't be with a man who
thought I was less of a person than
he was.
But maybe you can only get excited
by men who think otherwise.
You take your chances in life.
What seems perfect to some isn't
to others. But if you decide you
need bdsm and what you identify
as a dominant man you should
lay off the vanilla guys.
Encouraging someone who you
know from the get go isn't what
floats your boat is playing with
their emotions and that's kind of
nasty, heartbreaker.
This was great. Thank you for the reply and your thoughts.
I would like to add that while a lot of this applies, his financial standing and that particular type of “security” is not a concern and I’ve never factored that in when dating. Well.... I need someone at least self-sufficient. As I am. I’m financially fine. Better than most my age. He and I have always gone dutch if even more heavily on my side. By being with me, long term, he would stand to benefit greatly. He is stable. As a human and a good person. That matters to me more than any of the other stuff. Good family, wonderful friends, and enjoys his work. Those are the things that matter.
With that out of the way, I’ll address the rest. I’m not sure I stated the “equal partnership” thing very well. I may be emotionally needy. He assures me that I’m the least needy woman he’s ever been with but I can’t help but feel it, considering that I still need more than perhaps he has to offer. I don’t want to be playing with his emotions. Not at all.
Which is why I ‘m writing all of this out. To help me figure out what I need and how to better communicate that to him so we can Both decide if we’re right for each other. I think that’s the responsible, kind thing to do.
If his heart gets broken in the end it won’t be because I was malicious.
quote:
ORIGINAL: LaTigresse
I think Winterapple brings up a very good point. The love factor.
All too often I've seen women that were.......dismissive.......of a man that was honest with them in their feelings. A good man that wasn't going to fuck them over. A man that loved them and would treat them well. The women dump to go chasing after some womanizing asshole that isn't fit to own a houseplant let alone be in a relationship with another human being.
I wonder.....is THAT the 'not dominant' factor that was eluded to but never actually explained. Even though we did ask on several different posts.
Definitley not. I’ve had my share of, “womanizing asshole that isn't fit to own a houseplant” (well said) and I’m glad to be done with that chapter. I learned a lot. I learned that, for me, the relationship side is crucial. And I can’t just go for some SuperDom, putting that first. Because when I followed that path it didn’t do me any good. It was fun, but a waste of time.
I want a good person who understands and loves my submissive side. I hope I’ve explained it enough but maybe I haven’t. I’ve tried. I swear. It’s a tough thing to answer. And knowing now just how tough that is, I know I’ve got to figure that out more first. Which is good. I’m glad I know that isn’t as clearly defined in my head as I thought. At the very least, it means that I haven’t’ communicated that with him well enough. I’m glad I know that now and I didn’t. Because if I can’t explain it to you all well, then I obviously haven’t done a good enough job with him. I’m excited to get to talk to him about it. Maybe even just let him read all of this.
quote:
ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist
All other factors aside, as so many have said, it is a matter of your priorities.
For me, love isn't enough.
(...edited for length...)
But that is me. What is the easy part for you and what you can't live without is something that only you can answer, as already mentioned by others.
I like this post because it’s so opposite of everything else. Thanks. I’m not sure I’m in that camp but I’m glad to read this. And you’re right. I’m the only one who can figure it out, as many have said. I think I’m getting closer to that. Which is great.
quote:
ORIGINAL: LaTigresse
I sure as fuck would never give up love and all that goes with it, for me, to have some kink.
(...edited for length...)
That all being said.......I do tend to struggle to understand how a person that has strong personality traits such as dominance or submissive, could be attracted to someone who's personality wasn't complimentary.
Ah. I think it’s because we’re very very similar. And I love that about him. Instead of finding my compliment, my opposite, I found my mirror. We have similar passions, interests, families, wants, life goals etc. He would be an amazing father and has wonderful expectations of life and long term relationships. I love his viewpoints. I understand them. I understand him. And he understands me.
Except this. Maybe. I think I have to try harder before I’m sure of that.
quote:
ORIGINAL: chatterbox24
Sorry to high jack your thread, Poster... Good luck in your choices.
Totally fine. And I wish you well. I’m going to let you guys talk that out and not get involved, if that’s ok. But I don’t mind the hijack. All good.
quote:
ORIGINAL: GreedyTop
FFS, you've been here long enough to know how to trim your posts. Please do all of us a favor and use that knowledge.
This made laugh. Considering the sheer volume of what I’m posting/ about to post. I’ve tried to pair it down some while leaving the context... but it’s a lot. And I know that. I apologize. But I really wanted to get this all down and reply to most, if not all, of these responses.
So yeah. I guess my TL;DR is that I have to define what I need better. For me and for him. Then have some good serious conversations. And trust him. We have to figure it out together. But this have given me invaluable insight.
Thank you all so very much.
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