RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (Full Version)

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mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:18:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


So, your  'Observe and Report' thingie happened absolutely nothing like in the Martin Zimmerman case then.





tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:29:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

What happens when you are breathing hard
You breathe thru your mouth.


and flat on your back with a broken nose? (cracked septum at best btw)
You breathe thru your mouth.

Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe.
Not lots at all, but down your throat till your sinuses swell, and block the flow (about 20 seconds)

Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood?
NOT the way you got it. 

but you would drown in your own blood if it filled your lungs, which a broken nose wont do.   In fact one of the reasons you have to go to a doctor for a broken nose is to insure that it doesent deform your sinuses permanantly, there is buchu pressure in there, but no outlet.  (thats the internal part) the external bleeding is due to the multitude of small vessels in the outer parts of your nose, and if you feel in your mouth upper lip where that bit of skin is, under there is the vein that feeds it, and you can suck down on like a wad of toilet papter and stop that blood, (or you can press hard with your finger and you will feel your nose go strange).... 




He had a closed fracture. He was told to go to an Ear Nose and Throat Doctor for a follow up... which is standard advice from a PCP, not special in this case.




Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:38:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


So, your  'Observe and Report' thingie happened absolutely nothing like in the Martin Zimmerman case then.




Yeah, unlike Trayvon this guy didn't turn around and punch me in the nose.




Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:48:44 PM)

O’Mara Slams the State – Hints at possible forgery
by diwataman

In a seven page motion Mark O’Mara slammed the state with accusations of withholding evidence, obfuscating details, flat out ignoring requests for discovery and even possible forgery. The story that says it all is in regards to Trayvon’s supposed cell phone, which allow me to remind you that no evidence to date has been released which shows that there was a phone found at the scene that Trayvon was using. There’s more in the motion(s) than just this one story but for now I will only be dealing with this aspect.


O’Mara tells us that the FDLE analyst, Steve Brenton, who was able to get into Trayvon’s cell phone but not completely, whether or not this is the phone found at the scene remains to be seen, made a complete report, including downloaded information from the phone, and on March 26th gave that report to FDLE Special Agent supervisor David Lee. Lee I would also like to remind you called off the latent print report on the phone found at the scene, the date of that report is March 20th. O’Mara had no knowledge of the report or analysis by Brenton and was able to find out about it only because he happened to be in the same building as Brenton on August 8th. Apparently Brenton just mentioned to O’Mara that he did an analysis on the phone. The impression O’Mara gives is that had Brenton not done that and/or had O’Mara not run into him O’Mara would have never known about the report. That’s only the beginning.

Upon learning of this report O’Mara requested it from Corey’s office. On August 24th O’Mara says he received a disk with some files on it but no report. O’Mara again requested the information from Corey and this time there was no response at all. We’re just warming up folks.

Apparently considering now that Corey will not be providing discovery to O’Mara he deposes Brenton on September 26th. Brenton testified to what he had done, showed O’Mara the report that he gave Lee and later provided O’Mara with a copy of that report. Funny thing though about the files from that report and the files Corey sent to O’Mara that were supposedly from that report; they didn’t match. How they “differ” as O’Mara put it is not mentioned and is why I say “possible” forgery. How could they possibly differ so much as to be mentioned in this motion? Clearly it must be significant enough to cause enough concern to look into the matter and given the State’s behavior on this case it should be taken with absolute seriousness.

Add to the top of all of that the fact that the State only listed Brenton as a category C witness and nothing else and what you get is a big fat stay away from me discovery.

The words prosecutorial misconduct come to mind.

http://diwataman.wordpress.com/2012/10/15/omara-slams-the-state-hints-at-possible-forgery/#more-1605




mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:59:46 PM)

Thats a fucking snore.......I would be shocked if he said what a bunch of fuckin guys down there at the prosecutors office, bunch a fuckin guys...




igor2003 -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 3:38:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


There is even less evidence that Martin "started" anyting.




igor2003 -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 3:43:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro




Really?

Dispatcher: Are you following him? (meaning Martin)

Zimmerman: Yeah

Sure sounds like Zimmerman was trying to meet Martin.....

quote:


No it doesn't.



So you have one person that runs AWAY from a person in a car that has been following him. You also have a person that gets out of that car and chases the first person. Which one does common sense tell you is trying to "meet" the other one?




igor2003 -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 3:44:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


So, your  'Observe and Report' thingie happened absolutely nothing like in the Martin Zimmerman case then.




Yeah, unlike Trayvon this guy didn't turn around and punch me in the nose.


But if you had tried to detain that guy for the police would him trying to punch you in the nose have been a surprise?




Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 3:57:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


So, your  'Observe and Report' thingie happened absolutely nothing like in the Martin Zimmerman case then.




Yeah, unlike Trayvon this guy didn't turn around and punch me in the nose.


Now look who is speculating...no proof Trayvon punched Zimmerman in the nose




Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:02:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Wrong again.


Yeah your right you have to armed...especially in the frozen foods there is a dangerous place, ever read the sodium content...?




Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:13:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved.

I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.


So, your  'Observe and Report' thingie happened absolutely nothing like in the Martin Zimmerman case then.




Some say Zimmerman did a bit more then just Observe and report..

Neighbor Raffie Gaffar said he is troubled by the fact that Zimmerman patrolled the neighborhood with a gun. Gaffar, a registered nurse, said he had never met Zimmerman and lived in a different section of the development.

“That is crazy. That is totally crazy,” Gaffar said. “Why does he have to carry a gun? Something is totally wrong with that picture.”
http://thegrio.com/2012/03/21/george-zimmerman-was-trayvon-martin-shooter-a-good-neighbor-or-a-vigilante/











Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:17:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

Now look who is speculating...no proof Trayvon punched Zimmerman in the nose



Even the State prosecutor acknowledges that Trayvon punched George.

So, no. I'm not speculating.




Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:19:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

But if you had tried to detain that guy for the police would him trying to punch you in the nose have been a surprise?


But this on the other hand, there is no proof. There's no evidence to indicate an attempt to detain by George. Speculation, allegations, theories, and guesswork, but no evidence.




BamaD -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:19:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nosathro

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

The 'reasonable doubt' is that the injury was in any way actually threatening, and that George ( once again that evening ) overreacted, but instead of just acting like a total douchebag this time, his overreaction ended up killing an innocent kid.

That's the key here. GEORGES PERCEPTIONS AREN'T REASONABLE.

What is the root cause of George's unreasonable beliefs? Who cares? It's GEORGE'S RESPONSIBILITY to ensure the medicine he's taking doesn't make him dangerous to the public or whatever. Maybe George isn't guilty due to insanity? FWIW, if I was O'Mara, ( given George's lack of candor with him ) I'd wonder if that's not a better strategy.



Lie on your back let someone start beating on you while you are drowning in your own blood then tell us what is reasonable.


Stretching that a bit far arent you? Drowning in your own blood?


What happens when you are breathing hard and flat on your back with a broken nose?
Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe.
Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood?



You have medical proof that is what happen to Zimmerman....NOPE[:)] In fact the EMT did not report that happening either.... in fact witnesses say Zimmerman was walking around...can you walk and drown at the same time...I don't think so. I will even go as far as to say there is no proof it was blood, no test to prove it...could have been Zimmerman, could have been Martin..(Okay I just got a mental picture of that one[:'(]), could have been road kill, could have been ketcup for all anyone knows.. [sm=flameout.gif]

No but once you stand up the blood flow changes, as your breathing slows it gets undercontrol and when you get the bleeding stopped things get better




BamaD -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:22:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

What happens when you are breathing hard
You breathe thru your mouth.


and flat on your back with a broken nose? (cracked septum at best btw)
You breathe thru your mouth.

Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe.
Not lots at all, but down your throat till your sinuses swell, and block the flow (about 20 seconds)

Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood?
NOT the way you got it. 

but you would drown in your own blood if it filled your lungs, which a broken nose wont do.   In fact one of the reasons you have to go to a doctor for a broken nose is to insure that it doesent deform your sinuses permanantly, there is buchu pressure in there, but no outlet.  (thats the internal part) the external bleeding is due to the multitude of small vessels in the outer parts of your nose, and if you feel in your mouth upper lip where that bit of skin is, under there is the vein that feeds it, and you can suck down on like a wad of toilet papter and stop that blood, (or you can press hard with your finger and you will feel your nose go strange).... 



I have awakened in the middle of the night with a nose bleed and it sure felt like I was drowning.




tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:29:59 PM)

Because the back of your throat is relaxed allowing the flow. Wide awake, you would not. And you still have not addressed the blood upon standing.




tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:31:36 PM)

quote:

No but once you stand up the blood flow changes, as your breathing slows it gets undercontrol and when you get the bleeding stopped things get better


You just killed a man... how fast do you think your heart is pumping? That flow isnt stopping any time soon.




Rule -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:35:04 PM)

FR

In my eyes a number of people - at least half of whom I have on Hide (for years past) - have disqualified themselves from ever judging any case and any truth. They are dwelling with Vincent's elves. [sm=abducted.gif]




tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 4:37:36 PM)

Mr Circumcision has spoken.




farglebargle -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 5:36:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

"The defense was unwilling to schedule depositions of those witnesses until the defense had obtained all their statements, including the drawings they had previously made. The drawings were finally included in the 7th discovery exhibit filed on August 24, 2012 which included a drawing prepared by Witness Six that clearly shows that he saw Trayvon Martin on top of George Zimmerman on the concrete sidewalk right where George Zimmerman said he was when Trayvon Martin bashed his head into the concrete. This is powerful exculpatory evidence that was withheld from the defense (and from the Court) that the state had for five months before it was provided to the defense-- and then only after repeated requests."

Excert from Defense's motion


How exactly does this witness statement tell anyone anything about why Trayvon Martin felt he needed to act to defend his life.




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