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So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adminis... - 9/28/2012 12:02:19 PM   
subrob1967


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quote:

New Justice Department Documents Show Huge Increase in Warrantless Electronic Surveillance
By Naomi Gilens, ACLU Speech, Privacy and Technology Project at 1:32pm
Justice Department documents released today by the ACLU reveal that federal law enforcement agencies are increasingly monitoring Americans’ electronic communications, and doing so without warrants, sufficient oversight, or meaningful accountability.

The documents, handed over by the government only after months of litigation, are the attorney general’s 2010 and 2011 reports on the use of “pen register” and “trap and trace” surveillance powers. The reports show a dramatic increase in the use of these surveillance tools, which are used to gather information about telephone, email, and other Internet communications. The revelations underscore the importance of regulating and overseeing the government’s surveillance power. (Our original Freedom of Information Act request and our legal complaint are online.)

Pen register and trap and trace devices are powerfully invasive surveillance tools that were, twenty years ago, physical devices that attached to telephone lines in order to covertly record the incoming and outgoing numbers dialed. Today, no special equipment is required to record this information, as interception capabilities are built into phone companies’ call-routing hardware.

What he really means is, AMERICAN privacy be transparent to his DoJ!






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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:08:04 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Its gotta be pretty fuckin transparent if you know about it.

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(in reply to subrob1967)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:17:40 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
Status: offline 		Its 'looking for evil terrorists' if Republicans do it, but 'invasion of big brother' when a Democrat do it. Got to chuckle at the lengths conservatives will go to paint the Republicans as honorable even against the over whelming tide of evidence that says otherwise.

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:23:24 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well, we look at nixons secret tapings and fbi enemies dossiers, and by god, we dont find out about that until a few years after he resigns.....


So, more transparency, as subrob said, and he is correct in that.

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:39:42 PM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

quote:

New Justice Department Documents Show Huge Increase in Warrantless Electronic Surveillance
By Naomi Gilens, ACLU Speech, Privacy and Technology Project at 1:32pm
Justice Department documents released today by the ACLU reveal that federal law enforcement agencies are increasingly monitoring Americans’ electronic communications, and doing so without warrants, sufficient oversight, or meaningful accountability.

The documents, handed over by the government only after months of litigation, are the attorney general’s 2010 and 2011 reports on the use of “pen register” and “trap and trace” surveillance powers. The reports show a dramatic increase in the use of these surveillance tools, which are used to gather information about telephone, email, and other Internet communications. The revelations underscore the importance of regulating and overseeing the government’s surveillance power. (Our original Freedom of Information Act request and our legal complaint are online.)

Pen register and trap and trace devices are powerfully invasive surveillance tools that were, twenty years ago, physical devices that attached to telephone lines in order to covertly record the incoming and outgoing numbers dialed. Today, no special equipment is required to record this information, as interception capabilities are built into phone companies’ call-routing hardware.

What he really means is, AMERICAN privacy be transparent to his DoJ!







Priceless. Now he is too Authoritarian?

(in reply to subrob1967)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:49:36 PM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
Its gotta be pretty fuckin transparent if you know about it.



The documents, handed over by the government only after months of litigation

We were promised transparency, not litigation.


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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:53:16 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		no, you weren't promised transparency on your terms, or those terms for that matter.

We were promised jobs, jobs, jobs and fiscal responsibility down there with the teabaggers and have neither.

You're gettin some. 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 12:57:31 PM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

You're gettin some. 



Some what?


sent via my oPhone

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 1:10:39 PM   
Louve00


Posts: 1674
Joined: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		American privacy is as transparent as signing on to the internet and googling something. Only the information that's gathered on you from what you do online can be sold to anyone.

So if you value your privacy that much, hurry up and shut down....quick!!!



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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 1:13:34 PM   
graceadieu


Posts: 1518
Joined: 3/20/2008
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Unfortunately, it does seem that once the government gets a chance to encroach on our civil liberties in some way, it's hard to get them to stop doing it of their own volition. The Republicans allowed this stuff to ramp up (to some extent it's always been going on, but more since the Patriot Act), and Obama allowed it to continue, and I'm sure if Romney wins he will too, and on and on forever.

(in reply to subrob1967)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 2:29:51 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
Its 'looking for evil terrorists' if Republicans do it, but 'invasion of big brother' when a Democrat do it. Got to chuckle at the lengths conservatives will go to paint the Republicans as honorable even against the over whelming tide of evidence that says otherwise.


You know, you may mock conservatives who bring this up, but how many of those conservatives were against them way back when?

And, does pointing out Democrat hypocrisy automatically mean a conservative is being a hypocrite? I mean, I admit that I was "for" the warrantless wire taps before waking up, politically. As I became more aware and looked into it, I was against them (2008). But, that doesn't make it okay for Obama to get a pass on this. Wasn't it he who ran against Bush's use of them? Wasn't it he who said there wouldn't be any during his administration?

Where are all the Democrats protesting the use of warrantless wire taps?

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What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 6:47:01 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		got hoarse protesting them before Obama took over.
BTW..like you...we have the option of responding or not, in the negative or positive to any question we chooose, not because you think we should.
goose, meet gander

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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:14:37 PM   
FMRFGOPGAL


Posts: 763
Joined: 9/1/2012
Status: offline 		This thread cracks me up... the whole concept of wing dings holding up the ACLU as their standard bearer. No doubt they'll be back to reviling this fine institution first time they hear the phrase "happy holidays".

(in reply to Lucylastic)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:20:42 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		Is there usually information given to joe public while going thru litigation of any kind??

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<) )╯SUCH
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\(•_•)
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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:24:44 PM   
FMRFGOPGAL


Posts: 763
Joined: 9/1/2012
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quote:

And, does pointing out Democrat hypocrisy automatically mean a conservative is being a hypocrite?


When it is revisionist and doesn't state up front how the ball got rolling it is. Mind you, I haven't seen enough dialogue from you to point a finger. But clearly the OP, if he is all he claims is well aware he is burying the bone in the back yard in order to stick it to a president he just plain doesn't like.
  Not well executed, but motive is clear.



                                                                                                          (in reply to DesideriScuri)

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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:26:26 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline 		and Obama brought in unlimited detention... that means being thrown in jail cuz they think you might do something but never charged, never able to have a lawyer, never able to defend yourself, left in a cell to rot... How is that different from what goes on in China? Americans were included originally but Obama had this election to win so he backed down on including Americans (meaning voters).. Americans will be included in that again at some point in the next 4 years while Obama goes thru his last term in office.. there is no doubt in my mind of that..

Imo, both Obama and Romney are dangerous men.. just that Obama is a bit better with the smoke and mirrors and voters fall for his act..



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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:45:45 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: graceadieu

Unfortunately, it does seem that once the government gets a chance to encroach on our civil liberties in some way, it's hard to get them to stop doing it of their own volition. The Republicans allowed this stuff to ramp up (to some extent it's always been going on, but more since the Patriot Act), and Obama allowed it to continue, and I'm sure if Romney wins he will too, and on and on forever.

Like I have been trying to tell all of you kinkroids, he's doing what he needs to do...to stay alive.

People get a grip. In 1976 R. Reagan was in financial trouble going against G. Ford for the repub nomination. He sent a man to wall street asking him to ask them...what do we need to do to get some of their money ?

His man came back to report and after Reagan asked him was told what he must do...to stay alive. Reagan balked and refused to 'play ball.' His campaign was going broke so he decided that if he had any national political future, he had to go to public funding, YES, go the the govt. that was supposed to be the problem. He did and well...

Once he failed in the nomination against Ford and after Carters's 4 years, the repubs had showered money on him for the nomination and election and Reagan now didn't need to bow to wall street. ('the bankers') he wasn't going to play ball.

It took all of 69 days to shoot his ass. Reagan was very lucky he wasn't killed right away. He played ball, ya'think ? Next question.

HW, W, Obama, Mitt, McCain, anybody will continue the coming fascism. We are now only at the off-shoring stage. Just wait babydolls...soon coming to your neighborhood.

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RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:48:29 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FMRFGOPGAL
quote:

And, does pointing out Democrat hypocrisy automatically mean a conservative is being a hypocrite?

When it is revisionist and doesn't state up front how the ball got rolling it is. Mind you, I haven't seen enough dialogue from you to point a finger. But clearly the OP, if he is all he claims is well aware he is burying the bone in the back yard in order to stick it to a president he just plain doesn't like.
  Not well executed, but motive is clear.
                                                                                                         (in reply to DesideriScuri)


Which part is revisionist?

Did Obama run on transparency? Yes.

Did Obama and the Democrats rail at Bush for the warrantless wiretaps? Yes.

Did the Democrats rail at Obama for the warrantless wiretaps? No.

How is it that when a Democrat bashes a Republican for something, and then does the same thing, if not more, that it's revisionist, and okay?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to FMRFGOPGAL)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 7:50:56 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
got hoarse protesting them before Obama took over.
BTW..like you...we have the option of responding or not, in the negative or positive to any question we chooose, not because you think we should.
goose, meet gander


And, now? Are you getting hoarse over Obama's usage?

And, I do acknowledge everyone having the right of free choice to respond. But, isn't it at least a wee bit disingenuous when you give your guy a pass, but not the other guy?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: So THIS is what Obama meant by Most Transparent Adm... - 9/28/2012 8:31:11 PM   
FMRFGOPGAL


Posts: 763
Joined: 9/1/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: FMRFGOPGAL
quote:

And, does pointing out Democrat hypocrisy automatically mean a conservative is being a hypocrite?

When it is revisionist and doesn't state up front how the ball got rolling it is. Mind you, I haven't seen enough dialogue from you to point a finger. But clearly the OP, if he is all he claims is well aware he is burying the bone in the back yard in order to stick it to a president he just plain doesn't like.
Not well executed, but motive is clear.
                                                                                                        (in reply to DesideriScuri)


Which part is revisionist?

Did Obama run on transparency? Yes.

Did Obama and the Democrats rail at Bush for the warrantless wiretaps? Yes.

Did the Democrats rail at Obama for the warrantless wiretaps? No.

How is it that when a Democrat bashes a Republican for something, and then does the same thing, if not more, that it's revisionist, and okay?



I'm sorry, since we Democrats are only now learning about this alleged increase, I am wondering how many days we'll be allowed to consider the implication past the publication date of this article (9/27/12)? Or we now supposed take responsibility to the pandora's box opened and developed by George Bush and John Ashcroft.
     Yeah just play bullet point.
That's the easiest way to deal with a legitimate premise. Sorry hon, just because Obama hasn't resolved rob's colleagues going completely haywire by the election cycle, doesn't validate blaming it on him.
debate ration reached


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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