Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (Full Version)

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dcnovice -> Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:26:11 AM)

Historian Robert S. McElvaine says no. While it sounds intuitive that a businessman would have the surest handling of the economy, the data suggest otherwise.

quote:

Since Herbert Hoover’s 1928 election, the American people have voted out of office after a single term only three elected presidents: Hoover, Jimmy Carter and George H.W. Bush — all of whom were successful businessmen before they were president. And the only successful business-trained president who was reelected, George W. Bush, oversaw an economic collapse at the end of his second term.

As measured in constant 2005 dollars starting on Jan. 1 of the year after they took office — the economy’s performance in the first year of a presidency is better assigned to the preceding administration — the four presidents with successful business careers had the four worst records in terms of gross domestic product performance.

. . .

The startling bottom line is that the nation’s GDP has grown more than 45 times faster under presidents with little or no business experience than it has under presidents with successful business careers. And on average, when there has been a successful businessman in the Oval Office (so, Truman is excluded), GDP growth has been negligible.

On average, under presidents with successful business experience, GDP has increased 0.12 percent. And under presidents with little or no business experience, GDP has grown 5.46 percent.

Complete essay at The Washington Post


Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?




Yachtie -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:38:43 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

Historian Robert S. McElvaine says no. While it sounds intuitive that a businessman would have the surest handling of the economy, the data suggest otherwise.

quote:

Since Herbert Hoover’s 1928 election, the American people have voted out of office after a single term only three elected presidents: Hoover, Jimmy Carter and George H.W. Bush — all of whom were successful businessmen before they were president. And the only successful business-trained president who was reelected, George W. Bush, oversaw an economic collapse at the end of his second term.

As measured in constant 2005 dollars starting on Jan. 1 of the year after they took office — the economy’s performance in the first year of a presidency is better assigned to the preceding administration — the four presidents with successful business careers had the four worst records in terms of gross domestic product performance.

. . .

The startling bottom line is that the nation’s GDP has grown more than 45 times faster under presidents with little or no business experience than it has under presidents with successful business careers. And on average, when there has been a successful businessman in the Oval Office (so, Truman is excluded), GDP growth has been negligible.

On average, under presidents with successful business experience, GDP has increased 0.12 percent. And under presidents with little or no business experience, GDP has grown 5.46 percent.

Complete essay at The Washington Post


Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?



Has a community organizer president been good for the community?




DomKen -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:39:23 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

Historian Robert S. McElvaine says no. While it sounds intuitive that a businessman would have the surest handling of the economy, the data suggest otherwise.

quote:

Since Herbert Hoover’s 1928 election, the American people have voted out of office after a single term only three elected presidents: Hoover, Jimmy Carter and George H.W. Bush — all of whom were successful businessmen before they were president. And the only successful business-trained president who was reelected, George W. Bush, oversaw an economic collapse at the end of his second term.

As measured in constant 2005 dollars starting on Jan. 1 of the year after they took office — the economy’s performance in the first year of a presidency is better assigned to the preceding administration — the four presidents with successful business careers had the four worst records in terms of gross domestic product performance.

. . .

The startling bottom line is that the nation’s GDP has grown more than 45 times faster under presidents with little or no business experience than it has under presidents with successful business careers. And on average, when there has been a successful businessman in the Oval Office (so, Truman is excluded), GDP growth has been negligible.

On average, under presidents with successful business experience, GDP has increased 0.12 percent. And under presidents with little or no business experience, GDP has grown 5.46 percent.

Complete essay at The Washington Post


Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?



Has a community organizer president been good for the community?


Yes. Next question.




dcnovice -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:44:11 AM)

quote:

Has a community organizer president been good for the community?

A hijack in post two. That's gotta be a record.




Fellow -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:52:18 AM)

quote:

Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?


In general, running the government as a business would not work. It has been discussed broadly. It depends heavily of the situation what skills would benefit the office holder's progress-making ability. In the current situation business experience (or good understanding of the economy) is crucial to lead the country out of economic disaster. Obama total lack of such understanding has caused significant harm (huge increase in debt load, absence of meaningful reform effort).




tazzygirl -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 11:55:43 AM)

quote:

Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?


Yes. The last Adminstration was more concerned with their business holdings and supporters than with the country as a whole. And I am not just pointing at the GOP here.

Look where that left us.




Owner59 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 12:01:58 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

Historian Robert S. McElvaine says no. While it sounds intuitive that a businessman would have the surest handling of the economy, the data suggest otherwise.

quote:

Since Herbert Hoover’s 1928 election, the American people have voted out of office after a single term only three elected presidents: Hoover, Jimmy Carter and George H.W. Bush — all of whom were successful businessmen before they were president. And the only successful business-trained president who was reelected, George W. Bush, oversaw an economic collapse at the end of his second term.

As measured in constant 2005 dollars starting on Jan. 1 of the year after they took office — the economy’s performance in the first year of a presidency is better assigned to the preceding administration — the four presidents with successful business careers had the four worst records in terms of gross domestic product performance.

. . .

The startling bottom line is that the nation’s GDP has grown more than 45 times faster under presidents with little or no business experience than it has under presidents with successful business careers. And on average, when there has been a successful businessman in the Oval Office (so, Truman is excluded), GDP growth has been negligible.

On average, under presidents with successful business experience, GDP has increased 0.12 percent. And under presidents with little or no business experience, GDP has grown 5.46 percent.

Complete essay at The Washington Post


Thoughts? Perhaps the skills that work in business are different from those needed in government?



Has a community organizer president been good for the community?




Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


Turned around a 750,000 per month job lose too....to boot.




erieangel -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 12:07:39 PM)

quote:

In the current situation business experience (or good understanding of the economy) is crucial to lead the country out of economic disaster.


I thought that was what ADVISERS were for. Obama needs better advisers, that's for sure.

Hoover, a successful businessman who brought us the Great Depression.

Bush, Jr. a not-so-successful businessman (he did bankrupt more than one oil drilling company) who brought us the Great Recession.

Under Carter we had run away inflation.

I don't really remember Bush, Sr's time in office. I was sick those years and have little or no memory of anything beyond trying to keep a roof over my kids' heads and providing nutritious meals.

It scares me what Romney would do this country if he gets the vote. He's gone on about creating jobs, but his record in business shows he's created majority minimum wage and slightly better jobs--not good paying jobs like those lost with the move of Sensata to Chine (starting salary $17 per hour isn't even great). That's Romney's plan for the US, offshore jobs to China and other low wage countries so that the oligarchs get richer, never mind the hard workers here at home who are now out of a job.

BTW, Bain Capital owns 51% of Sensata. Romney has an $8M stake in Bain.

HE IS GOING TO CLEAN UP WITH THIS MOVE!!!!!








ThatDaveGuy69 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 12:15:32 PM)

Romney's assertion that as a businessman he is, by default, a better choice is patently BS. As the CEO of Bain, his decisions were final. He's never had to form coalitions, never had to consider the imput of 400+ members of Congress, never had to think about polling numbers, popularity, or a million other factors that define the job of the President. He won't be able to say This is how we are going to do this - every bill he tries to get through Congress with be subject to the whims of both houses. And, if elected, while he might have a majority in both houses, there is always the filibuster. Successful goverments find ways to compromise. The GOP has not been willing to do this over the last 3+ years and so we have gridlock. If a Romney predidency thinks it will have have an easier time than Obama has had I think he'll be in for a very rude awakening.

~Dave




TheHeretic -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 12:38:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
A hijack in post two. That's gotta be a record.



Ain't election season fun?

My thought would be; how good were they at business, and what have they done above and beyond that?

In the present situation, Mitt Romney excelled in business, went on to an extremely challenging organizational assignment, and then demonstrated the ability to lead and govern successfully, and to work across the aisle.

President Obama, as I pointed out more than twice at the time of his campaign, didn't even have the innate qualities of leadership to be captain of his high school basketball team




Yachtie -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 1:16:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.




DOM68005 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 1:34:27 PM)

Except for new positions on his staff, any President of either party does NOT create jobs. Jobs are created when a business perceives a need for someone to perform a task at a cost they are willing to pay with the intent of making money for the new employee, and up the chain of command.

When a President proclaims he made xxx,xxx jobs in a given time period, he is guity of fraud which is his job more often than not.

What is useful would be a President together with his administration and Congress to create an atmosphere that stablizes regulations and taxes so businesses can know the rules to play by.




LookieNoNookie -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 3:24:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.


Maybe what the Prez meant when he said "you didn't build that" was...."I built that". Him and Gore.

They worked weekends.




snappykappy -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 3:28:39 PM)

how about all of the jobs that have been lost per the amount of unemployed
why not put those who are still looking for work in those jobs that they lost if they have not already found employment

it is all a dog and pony show




dcnovice -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 4:22:52 PM)

FR

That noted liberal David Stockman (Reagan's budget director) takes a look at Bain Capital and Romney's record in Newsweek.

quote:

Nevertheless, Mitt Romney claims that his essential qualification to be president is grounded in his 15 years as head of Bain Capital, from 1984 through early 1999. According to the campaign’s narrative, it was then that he became immersed in the toils of business enterprise, learning along the way the true secrets of how to grow the economy and create jobs. The fact that Bain’s returns reputedly averaged more than 50 percent annually during this period is purportedly proof of the case—real-world validation that Romney not only was a striking business success but also has been uniquely trained and seasoned for the task of restarting the nation’s sputtering engines of capitalism.

Except Mitt Romney was not a businessman; he was a master financial speculator who bought, sold, flipped, and stripped businesses. He did not build enterprises the old-fashioned way—out of inspiration, perspiration, and a long slog in the free market fostering a new product, service, or process of production. Instead, he spent his 15 years raising debt in prodigious amounts on Wall Street so that Bain could purchase the pots and pans and castoffs of corporate America, leverage them to the hilt, gussy them up as reborn “roll-ups,” and then deliver them back to Wall Street for resale—the faster the better.

That is the modus operandi of the leveraged-buyout business, and in an honest free-market economy, there wouldn’t be much scope for it because it creates little of economic value. But we have a rigged system—a regime of crony capitalism—where the tax code heavily favors debt and capital gains, and the central bank purposefully enables rampant speculation by propping up the price of financial assets and battering down the cost of leveraged finance.

. . .

The Bain Capital investments here reviewed accounted for $1.4 billion or 60 percent of the fund’s profits over 15 years, by my calculations. Four of them ended in bankruptcy; one was an inside job and fast flip; one was essentially a massive M&A brokerage fee; and the seventh and largest gain—the Italian Job—amounted to a veritable freak of financial nature.

In short, this is a record about a dangerous form of leveraged gambling that has been enabled by the failed central banking and taxing policies of the state. That it should be offered as evidence that Mitt Romney is a deeply experienced capitalist entrepreneur and job creator is surely a testament to the financial deformations of our times.

Complete article at Newsweek






Politesub53 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 4:40:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.



Low unemployment under GWB........ Are you serious ? The number reached record highs on his watch and Obama inherited these.

From may 2008 to may 2009 they shot up by four million and kept going up that year. Obama has stabalised them and grought them down by 2 million from 2009 until now, and that in an economic crisis.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

As for Romney, his philosophy, is he likes to fire people. I wouldnt expect much job creation there.




Yachtie -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 5:05:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.



Low unemployment under GWB........ Are you serious ? The number reached record highs on his watch and Obama inherited these.

From may 2008 to may 2009 they shot up by four million and kept going up that year. Obama has stabalised them and grought them down by 2 million from 2009 until now, and that in an economic crisis.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

As for Romney, his philosophy, is he likes to fire people. I wouldnt expect much job creation there.


May 2008 to May 2009 is hardly the totality of Bush's 8 years in office. Reread all the above. Do you see your mistake?




LookieNoNookie -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 5:10:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.



Low unemployment under GWB........ Are you serious ? The number reached record highs on his watch and Obama inherited these.

From may 2008 to may 2009 they shot up by four million and kept going up that year. Obama has stabalised them and grought them down by 2 million from 2009 until now, and that in an economic crisis.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

As for Romney, his philosophy, is he likes to fire people. I wouldnt expect much job creation there.


Wow! That's some amazing math!




Politesub53 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 5:12:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Considering the President created more jobs in his 1st year than in all of bush`s 8......the answer would be yes.


That's as spurious as one can get. It's hard to create any large quantity of jobs in an economy where unemployment was low.



Low unemployment under GWB........ Are you serious ? The number reached record highs on his watch and Obama inherited these.

From may 2008 to may 2009 they shot up by four million and kept going up that year. Obama has stabalised them and grought them down by 2 million from 2009 until now, and that in an economic crisis.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

As for Romney, his philosophy, is he likes to fire people. I wouldnt expect much job creation there.


May 2008 to May 2009 is hardly the totality of Bush's 8 years in office. Reread all the above. Do you see your mistake?




In May 2008, Bushes policies were coming to fruition, 12 months later, and with Obama not having been in office long enough to have had any effect, Bush`s policies had added 4 million to the figures. I even added the link hoping you were bright enough to figure it out for yourself.




Politesub53 -> RE: Is a Businessman President Good for Business? (10/21/2012 5:15:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

Wow! That's some amazing math!


Care to show why genius ?




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