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RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 6:21:37 AM

cloudboy

Posts: 7306
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(1) Demonize Obama

(2) Rail against Obamacare

(3) Tax Cuts (even though we are at historic lows)

(4) Austerity (without any specifics)

(5) Pretend the Bush years never happened.

(6) Point out high unemployment and public debt w/o putting a solution to address them on the table.

(7) Filibuster

(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 21

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 7:57:42 AM

Marc2b

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One of the unfortunate effects of our increasingly media/communications connected world is that the worst among us quickly get their inane screeching elevated to the top. This is also aided by the fact that each side of the political divide is quick to make sure that the worst of the other side gets promoted. The underlying message of this is, of course, "they're all like that." It is so common in politics that I think most people don't even notice it. Even here on the CM political boards. How many threads are posted with the intent of look what this republican/democrat said/did... this proves that they are all bad.

I first started paying attention to politics when Reagan was President and since then I have "learned" that:

Reagan was the worst President ever.
Carter was the worst President ever.
Bush (the Elder) was the worst President ever.
Clinton was the worst President ever.
Bush (the Younger) was the worst President ever.
Obama is the worst President ever.

I don't know who will be elected in 2016 but one thing I am certain of... they will be the worst President ever.

I have also learned that each and every Presidential election is THE MOST IMPORTANT ELECTION IN THE HISTORY OF THE UNITED STATES AND IF THE WRONG PERSON WINS AMERICA WILL NOT SURVIVE!!!!!

After each election I have been informed that the FREE AMERICA I LOVE IS DEAD!!!! COMMIE PINKO LIBERALS ARE GOING TO TAKE AWAY MY PICK-UP TRUCK AND FORCE ME TO DRIVE A PRIUS!!!!! Either that or the FREE AMERICA I LOVE IS DEAD!!!! NAZI KLAN CONSERVATIVES ARE GOING TO TAKE AWAY MY SCIENCE BOOKS AND FORCE ME TO READ THE BIBLE!!!!

The truth of the matter is that the extremists on both sides, while they may have the occasional temporary minor victories, never really make much progress. I'm still driving a pick-up truck and the good guys won in Kitzmiller vs. Dover.

_____________________________

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(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 22

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 11:57:24 AM

Fightdirecto

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Joined: 8/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
The question is why the right went for the demonization rather than go against the policy? Truly what did it gain?

I believe it began in February 1950 with Senator Joe McCarthy. He presented the argument that any American that disagreed in any way with the Republican Party was ipso facto an enemy of the United States. The conservative argument since McCarthy, intensified by "Tricky Dick" Nixon and the "Southern Strategy" in 1968, has been that opposition to the Democratic Party or a President who is a Democrat is patriotic and opposition to the Republican Party or a President who is a Republican is treasonous.

An example of what I wrote of has come up in a Military Veteran's group on FL:

Tammy Duckworth, a military veteran who lost both legs in combat and who has served as the Illinois State Secretary of Veterans Affairs and as Assistant Secretary of Veterans Affairs at the federal level, was just elected to the U. S. House of Representatives. But because her party affiliation is DEMOCRAT rather than REPUBLICAN, conservatives in that FL group are attacking her as a "shill for the Democratic Party" and a "fake hero". If she had run for the same office and gotten elected as a Republican, the same posters, I am sure, would have been praising her rather than denigrating her.

A good example of the conservative mind-set which dates back to the 1950s and the early part of the Cold War: Republican = patriot & Democrat = traitor. We still hear that from some conservatives today, in particular members of the Tea Party movement. Bipartisanship, they argue, is the equivalent of compromising with traitors. If John Kerry had changed his party affiliation from Democrat to Republican in 2004, he would never have been "swift boated" - he would have been a "War Hero".

Why do the Republicans keep using this tactic and argument? It's gotten them votes since 1950 - so they believe it will get them votes in 2012 and into the future.

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(in reply to DomYngBlk)

Post #: 23

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 2:07:29 PM

ToyOfRhamnusia

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The real problem is that BOTH parties are controlled by the same exclusive elite who wants to control all of us. The righ/left discussions are nothing but a smoke screen for the real issue behind the scenes: how the elite can us to accept, little by little, that we will become "1984" slaves of THEM. Until people start to comprehend this and stop being pawns in that game that aims at their own destruction as free individuals, every new president with be worse than the previous one, because the AIM for the elite is to destroy everything we value, and every single new president is hand-picked and directly instructed to facilitate that.

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(in reply to Fightdirecto)

Post #: 24

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 3:03:55 PM

thompsonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

People like to be entertained. Demonetization is way far better entertainment than the drudgery of facts and figures one gets from dry college lectures.

We obviously went to different schools.

(in reply to Yachtie)

Post #: 25

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 3:47:37 PM

FMRFGOPGAL

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

fr

The Right demonized Obama from the start. That was to be expected knowing Obamacare was to be on the table. Had Romney won does anyone really believe the Left would not be after him?

That would be the logic I would operate under if I had spent 4+ years demonizing a person. It's little doubt they would have that paranoia about their candidate. Couldn't possibly be the guy was faulty in the first place. Riiiiiggggghhhhht.

(in reply to Yachtie)

Post #: 26

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 3:56:06 PM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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Azul!!!! Azul!!!!

I get me some real good wood off of a little demonizing.

Beelzebubba Jones.

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Post #: 27

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 3:56:41 PM

SternSkipper

Posts: 7546
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Quit lying Marc.... We've already seen the pics of you at the wheel of a Gremlin!

BTW - How did the write-in campaign go? Did you get elected sherrif of Nottingham?

(in reply to Marc2b)

Post #: 28

RE: Demonization. - 11/9/2012 9:39:07 PM

xssve

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Joined: 10/10/2009
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Well you know, the liberal conundrum, is how to make that point while managing to acknowledge that George W. is one of the most useless wastes of human potential to ever walk the planet, and that any bum found under the average overpass would have made a better President - and without mentioning that he one suspects his depravity probably knows no rational bounds, if all the dirty laundry came out, I mean, if funeralgate didn't clue you in as to what his ethical priorities were, then truly you're not only drinking the Kool-Aid, you're swilling it like mothers milk, fucking addicted to the teat, and you might as well switch to heroin and start having sex with draught animals, such is your credibility on character judgment.

But yeah, I guess Obama is technically Black, so, in spite of the fact that that's bad enough it wouldn't' be polite to mention it, so you gotta come up some other kind of shit.

< Message edited by xssve -- 11/9/2012 9:40:02 PM >

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Post #: 29

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 3:20:37 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Wasnt just the GOP this time around.

You can tell him that until you are blue in the face and he won't see it. Nice try though.

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Post #: 30

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 4:59:44 AM

DomYngBlk

Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
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Then why would you argue so vehemently and be a toy of romnesia if you felt this way. Disingenuous

(in reply to ToyOfRhamnusia)

Post #: 31

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 5:42:43 AM

xssve

Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fightdirecto

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk
The question is why the right went for the demonization rather than go against the policy? Truly what did it gain?

I believe it began in February 1950 with Senator Joe McCarthy. He presented the argument that any American that disagreed in any way with the Republican Party was ipso facto an enemy of the United States. The conservative argument since McCarthy, intensified by "Tricky Dick" Nixon and the "Southern Strategy" in 1968, has been that opposition to the Democratic Party or a President who is a Democrat is patriotic and opposition to the Republican Party or a President who is a Republican is treasonous.

An example of what I wrote of has come up in a Military Veteran's group on FL:

Tammy Duckworth, a military veteran who lost both legs in combat and who has served as the Illinois State Secretary of Veterans Affairs and as Assistant Secretary of Veterans Affairs at the federal level, was just elected to the U. S. House of Representatives. But because her party affiliation is DEMOCRAT rather than REPUBLICAN, conservatives in that FL group are attacking her as a "shill for the Democratic Party" and a "fake hero". If she had run for the same office and gotten elected as a Republican, the same posters, I am sure, would have been praising her rather than denigrating her.

A good example of the conservative mind-set which dates back to the 1950s and the early part of the Cold War: Republican = patriot & Democrat = traitor. We still hear that from some conservatives today, in particular members of the Tea Party movement. Bipartisanship, they argue, is the equivalent of compromising with traitors. If John Kerry had changed his party affiliation from Democrat to Republican in 2004, he would never have been "swift boated" - he would have been a "War Hero".

Why do the Republicans keep using this tactic and argument? It's gotten them votes since 1950 - so they believe it will get them votes in 2012 and into the future.

You're right, it a very basic propaganda technique, and it's more or less straight out of Levi-Strauss, it's not right and left, or even good vs. evil, it's life vs death, those are they symbols being manipulated.

Naturally, this resonates with the religious right, who themselves are perpetual victims of this basic propaganda technique, used by Christian churches get them to trade their dignity in this life for a promise of riches in the next. It's really quite stunning that people can be so obtuse as to fall for that, but it's been working since about the Third century.

Republicans promise the promised land, but of course they never deliver, they can't it's a fantasy, a pure hypothetical - instead, it's always that their noble best efforts have been thwarted by the devious liberal agenda, and you best send them more money so they can keep up the fight - etc., etc., etc.

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Post #: 32

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 5:43:51 AM

xssve

Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
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Literally, look up Calvinist premillenialism, it's the model.

< Message edited by xssve -- 11/10/2012 5:44:07 AM >

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Post #: 33

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 6:14:10 AM

flyhumbleguy

Posts: 162
Joined: 6/23/2011
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That's about right. Though freak shows tend to get the ratings most Americans are more voyeuristic than prone to becoming cult followers that would be willing to go down the same path...at least for now, most aren't so desperate to do so.

(in reply to Marc2b)

Post #: 34

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 6:22:43 AM

flyhumbleguy

Posts: 162
Joined: 6/23/2011
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So what's the proof? Today, African-Americans have more liberty and clout than 100 years or even further back than that. Same with women. On an international basis, there is greater opportunity to pick up from your home country and find a career in another country than there had been for almost any previous period. If that is a trend toward less liberty and enslavement as engineered by some invisible elite, sign me up for some more of the same!

(in reply to ToyOfRhamnusia)

Post #: 35

RE: Demonization. - 11/10/2012 10:59:34 AM

xssve

Posts: 3589
Joined: 10/10/2009
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What do you correlate this with? A century of application of liberal economic and social policy? The end of American apartheid? Women's rights, including the right to vote? What else changed?

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Post #: 36

RE: Demonization. - 11/11/2012 5:22:35 AM

flyhumbleguy

Posts: 162
Joined: 6/23/2011
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Please tell me what you correlate it to. I'm just responding to a prior post that indicated there is an invisible powers that be who are orchestrating things to make us less free. I ask for proof of this as the clear trend is for more people total as well as for more previously marginalized demographic groups to enjoy more freedom, not less. Perhaps if you specify what you correlate it to, we can see if that factor is diminishing where we could expect freedoms to diminish as well.

(in reply to xssve)

Post #: 37

RE: Demonization. - 11/11/2012 6:50:28 AM

tazzygirl

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Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Wasnt just the GOP this time around.

You can tell him that until you are blue in the face and he won't see it. Nice try though.

When I say it about my own party, those in my own party tend to listen a bit more. I dont consider it a "nice try". Just giving food for thought.

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Post #: 38

RE: Demonization. - 11/11/2012 7:03:05 AM

SchrodingerSock

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Joined: 11/7/2012
From: Scotland
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A cabal of witches tell me scaremongering works wonders.

The worst example of demonization of others was carried out by Hitler - narrowly pipping Josef Stalin. And that was in a time frame more recent than most people care to remember or delve into. :(

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Post #: 39

RE: Demonization. - 11/11/2012 7:15:37 AM

DarkSteven

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FMRFGOPGAL

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

fr

The Right demonized Obama from the start. That was to be expected knowing Obamacare was to be on the table. Had Romney won does anyone really believe the Left would not be after him?

That would be the logic I would operate under if I had spent 4+ years demonizing a person. It's little doubt they would have that paranoia about their candidate. Couldn't possibly be the guy was faulty in the first place. Riiiiiggggghhhhht.

FMRFGOPGAL, I'm not quite in agreement here. That's like blaming a car for the machinery that produced it.

Romney was the result of the GOP process. He won the primary due to his fundraising abilities and the fact that he was viewed as the most likely to beat Obama. He actually was IMO much better than the other nutcases he ran against, with the exception of Huntsman, Daniels, and Johnson.

One of the things that hurt him was the pivoting he needed to do from hyperconservative in the primary to moderate in the general. Also, he emerged from the primary pretty bloodied - Obama was able to continue Gingrich's attacks on him.

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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Post #: 40

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