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RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 7:42:06 AM   
DomCplsc


Posts: 12
Joined: 12/13/2008
Status: offline 		One business fails and another opens....sounds good. Unfortunately you will see reality. There are many an empty buildings because a business has closed , oh wait...you already do see it all around the country. Commercial construction is and has also been down for the past 6 years and only getting worse. I am always curious on what planet some of these people live. On one hand...it's big business that is screwing over people, but than a business fails and now it's "another one opens". The reality is that an attack on business is completely ignorant when the country is still suffering from an economic problems. Half of the country understood this and the other half is in denial or just doesn't pay attention.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 121
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 7:45:44 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Another will open. No one said tomorrow.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to DomCplsc)
Profile   Post #: 122
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 7:46:01 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well, it sorts out the marginally acceptable business plans, and the dogshit management quite handily dunnit?

I don't see any businesses being attacked, I see them pretty much being mollycoddled.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DomCplsc)
Profile   Post #: 123
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 8:16:44 AM   
ShadowMasterTX


Posts: 15
Joined: 7/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Hostess has argued that workers must make concessions as it tries to improve its financial position. The privately-held food maker filed for Chapter 11 protection in January, its second trip through bankruptcy court in less than a decade. Hostess cited increasing pension and medical costs for employees as one of the drivers behind its latest filing.

The company, founded in 1930, is fighting battles beyond labor costs, however. Competition is increasing in the snack space and Americans are increasingly conscious about healthy eating.

And Hostess may feel the brunt of that decision as well.



As was stated - we will close the entire company if widespread strikes cripple our business





And that is a choice of business. If a business can not be profitable, then it should close, no matter how long it has been in business.

But, to say the employees of that business should be entitled to less then a respectable wage, is just as bad. If the market Hostess is trying to serve no longer wants their products, or if they need to be discounted so much as to create a demand, then the company needs to re-evaluate it's market position, and shutting down may be the best choice.

Every business pays a price for being in business. Rent, advertising, etc. If your not making enough profit to cover your costs (and I include taxes, and insurance here), then your not making enough money to stay in business.

Taxes, like electricity, are part of the cost of doing business.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 8:33:18 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomCplsc

Commercial construction is and has also been down for the past 6 years and only getting worse.

Untrue.

http://www.construction.com/about-us/press/new-construction-starts-to-rise-2-percent-in-2012.asp

•Single family housing in 2012 will advance 21% in dollars, corresponding to a 19% increase in the number of units to 490,000 (McGraw-Hill Construction Dodge basis). While still at a very low amount, single family housing for the past year has been able to register small yet steady gains.
•Multifamily housing in 2012 will climb 19% in dollars and 18% in units, given rising occupancies and rents, which reflect elevated demand from potential homebuyers still reluctant or unable to move ahead with purchasing a single family home.
•Commercial building in 2012 will grow 10%, following the 12% gain in 2011. Warehouses and hotels will see the largest percentage increases, joined this year by a moderate gain for stores while office construction sees more privately financed projects but less government office buildings


_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to DomCplsc)
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RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 9:42:30 AM   
Yachtie


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Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Another will open. No one said tomorrow.



Great dodge. Sweet

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 126
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 9:45:43 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		lol.. dodge?

Allow me to explain. Businesses have felt like they had the upper hand over employees for a number of years now. Employees are tired of that bs, they learned how to tighten their belts.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 9:51:23 AM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ShadowMasterTX
But, to say the employees of that business should be entitled to less then a respectable wage, is just as bad.


Respectable wage? Please, do everyone a favor and point to it. What is a respectable wage other then what you deem it to be? If you'll do a job for X and I'll do it for Y, so be it. Does it really matter to you that your X and my Y are not the same? Of what business is it of yours anyway? Who made anyone King as to tell me what my time is worth?


_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to ShadowMasterTX)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 9:59:43 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		And the contrapositive must also be as true.  Which means that one should not whine about the union, nor should one whine about the business.





_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 129
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:09:01 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: ShadowMasterTX
But, to say the employees of that business should be entitled to less then a respectable wage, is just as bad.


Respectable wage? Please, do everyone a favor and point to it. What is a respectable wage other then what you deem it to be? If you'll do a job for X and I'll do it for Y, so be it. Does it really matter to you that your X and my Y are not the same? Of what business is it of yours anyway? Who made anyone King as to tell me what my time is worth?



As long as you dont break any federal, state or local laws concerning wages, you can pay whatever you wish.

If you arent an hourly wage earner, you can contract for as little or as much as you desire.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:12:06 AM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

And the contrapositive must also be as true.  Which means that one should not whine about the union, nor should one whine about the business.



The contrapositive, as you state, only applies if the union is not in authority as King.




_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 131
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:16:52 AM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: ShadowMasterTX
But, to say the employees of that business should be entitled to less then a respectable wage, is just as bad.


Respectable wage? Please, do everyone a favor and point to it. What is a respectable wage other then what you deem it to be? If you'll do a job for X and I'll do it for Y, so be it. Does it really matter to you that your X and my Y are not the same? Of what business is it of yours anyway? Who made anyone King as to tell me what my time is worth?



As long as you dont break any federal, state or local laws concerning wages, you can pay whatever you wish.

If you arent an hourly wage earner, you can contract for as little or as much as you desire.



You did not get to the meat of what ShadowMasterTX said... But, to say the employees of that business should be entitled to less then a respectable wage, is just as bad.

He implies most directly that a respectable wage exists. I wish someone to point to it.





_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 132
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:18:17 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		You can start here.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 133
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:37:15 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

And the contrapositive must also be as true.  Which means that one should not whine about the union, nor should one whine about the business.



The contrapositive, as you state, only applies if the union is not in authority as King.





Yeah, fuck the magna charta shit.   Burn the fucking business down.

They are a drain on our economy. 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 134
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:50:12 AM   
Yachtie


Posts: 3593
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

You can start here.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Living_wage



That's hysterical It open's with In public policy... policy is known to change. Hardly determinative of anything but the moment.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 135
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 10:53:31 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Its hysterical that you dont read.

United States
In the United States, the state of Maryland and several municipalities and local governments have enacted ordinances which set a minimum wage higher than the federal minimum that requires all jobs to meet the living wage for that region. This usually works out to be $3 to $7 above the federal minimum wage. However, San Francisco, California and Santa Fe, New Mexico have notably passed very wide-reaching living wage ordinances.[citation needed] U.S. cities with living wage laws include Santa Fe and Albuquerque in New Mexico; San Francisco, California; and Washington D.C.[8] The city of Chicago, Illinois also passed a living wage ordinance in 2006, but it was vetoed by Mayor Richard M. Daley.[9] Living wage laws typically cover only businesses that receive state assistance or have contracts with the government.[10]

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Yachtie)
Profile   Post #: 136
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 4:10:50 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Didnt you say you have a background in restaurants? I do know that at RT's, the cost of the Salab bar is so negligiuble that its less than 50 cents... which is why its free. The cost of a steak dinner... around 2 bucks. Deserts and bar was the expense tab there... which is where it is in most restaurants, unless they make their own deserts.

For a pasta dish? they make a 6 to 10 times on mark up.

A pizza place charges 10 bucks a pie.. no extras... and it will cost them an extra 14 cents to cover employees benefits.

In other words.... its not about cost here... its not about profit margin. Most customers wouldnt notice the extra 20 cents at Papa Johns.... and most wouldnt care knowing the reason why.

All this is doing is giving them a bad rep.

Corporations are tossing a temper tantrum that they will have to do something they dont want too, so they will make their own bottom line hurt. Who do these people think they are fooling? Cutting their noses off to spite their faces when the people they employee live in the communities where the job loses are going to be felt.


Not that I'm aware of....I did wait tables when I was a kid....I now eat at restaurants....as to a background....I'd say that largely compiles my experience with same.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 137
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 4:12:09 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess
I am in business for myself and do quite fine, thank you very much. And when I did employ people, I paid them what they were legally entitled to be paid.



The government has established the legal entitlement of pay. It's called the minimum wage.

You seem to be in favor of limiting the maximum wage.


It's just a gut feel but....I'm fairly confident the feds haven't gone there yet.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 138
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 4:21:51 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Plop a restaurant down in the middle of a community then stop hiring from that community. Where are your customers going to come from? Three towns over?


Not from....because.

If you hire staff from another planet and you sell good food for a price that is commensurate with the product...people will drive an hour to get there. If the service blows the doors off of anything they've ever seen before, they'll reserve a hotel and make a weekend of it.

They'll stand in line in the rain. Hell, they'll pay people to stand in line for them.

They'll fly in.

Darden and Papa John's sell a basic commodity. Others (smaller, with no chance of ever hitting the health care ceiling) will blow their doors off....but with their (Darden and Papa John's) size, they can afford very complex software and scheduling programs to compensate for the new regulations.

Taz....do you honestly believe, as you've suggested, that this effort on their part is simply an effort to make 27 (or 100) restaurants more profitable?

Kiddo....this is NOT a 27 restaurant trial to make 27 restaurants more profitable, this is a 27 (or 100) restaurant trial to see how well it will work in all 10,000 (or 5,000....however many they have) restaurants across their entire spectrum.

Ya'll were freaking out that if the Republicans got in power, women were going to lose their rights across the country, even as that discussion has been happening since 1972 and NOTHING has changed.....yet you think this outlier is simply a basic test of how to improve results at 0.000173% of a major corporations assets?

Honey the clue store is open....I'll hold the damned door for you.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 139
RE: How low will major companies go? - 11/13/2012 4:24:06 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Hostess has argued that workers must make concessions as it tries to improve its financial position. The privately-held food maker filed for Chapter 11 protection in January, its second trip through bankruptcy court in less than a decade. Hostess cited increasing pension and medical costs for employees as one of the drivers behind its latest filing.

The company, founded in 1930, is fighting battles beyond labor costs, however. Competition is increasing in the snack space and Americans are increasingly conscious about healthy eating.

And Hostess may feel the brunt of that decision as well.


Yeah....you're right....Hostess is gonna close their doors.

(I'm sorry....possibly I missed something.....who exactly are the winners here?)

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 140
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