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RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/5/2012 9:44:26 PM   
Jonc101


Posts: 122
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Australia
Status: offline 		They're made even easier to obtain when illegals are giving or selling them to the snakeheads to pass on to other illegals travelling to America to join flying schools and fly planes into skyscrapers....get my point?

Sorry you feel that humans are more important than paper, but we DO live in that kind of world, not some hippy borderless paradise.

FJ

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/5/2012 9:47:56 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jonc101

Still cheaper than paying men thousands of $ a month to stay on the dole, sucking up benefits and possibly planning anti-social acts here and back in their home countries. Don't forget we don't know who these people are, seeing as they destroy their IDs, a suspicious act in itself as they try to convince us of their latest stories.


People without status in the USA can't qualify for the "dole." What are the rules in Australia?

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 12/5/2012 9:48:54 PM >

(in reply to Jonc101)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/5/2012 9:50:51 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Depends on the state.

As far as illegals getting in... almost as many illegals are in the US as a result of expired visa's as there are from illegal crossings. In other words, almost half came here legally.

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
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RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/5/2012 9:56:05 PM   
Jonc101


Posts: 122
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Australia
Status: offline 		We also have quite a lot of overstayers who came here legally and remained, for reasons of love, sun and surf. However we do know who they are and most of them return home on their own steam when the love fizzles out or winter arrives. They usually leave under their own steam having worked and contributed, which they have to as they have no recourse to welfare benefits.

Quite a different situation to sneaking in on leaky boats, having paid people smugglers thousands of dollars, singing the appropriate mantras about 'political persecution' and going onto welfare for the rest of their lives.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/5/2012 10:07:48 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Many of ours work and pay into our system. Many dont get anything back out due to fear of being caught. Many are paid below legal wages as a result of that fear.



_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Jonc101)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 1:21:57 AM   
metamorfosis


Posts: 1132
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jonc101
The Sri Lankan people smugglers are now discounting their tariff from $10,000 to a cheap $500 in order to fill up the leaky boats.


*wonders how many of them have died seeking freedom in those leaky boats*

Pam

< Message edited by metamorfosis -- 12/6/2012 1:29:08 AM >

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RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 1:50:41 AM   
Jonc101


Posts: 122
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Australia
Status: offline 		I don't think too many Aussies are worried about that. We're sick of them. They were never invited here, they paid thousands to 'sneak' in without ID. They could be anyone and everyone.

Can't protect a fool against himself.

And it's only the lawyers who are encouraging them to continue coming. That's where I lay the blame.

FJ

(in reply to metamorfosis)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:07:42 AM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Many of ours work and pay into our system. Many dont get anything back out due to fear of being caught. Many are paid below legal wages as a result of that fear.





Some people here are almost schizoid about immigrants. My goose-stepping old father ("That Oswald Mosley was a very impressive speaker, you know") will talk one minute about 'Poles who come here and just go on the dole forever'; the next minute about 'Poles taking British people's jobs'. No mention, though, that the latter sort are helping to pay his pension, mad old git that he is. (He's staying at mine over Christmas. That experience I will find . . . testing.)

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RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:37:52 AM   
TizzyTara


Posts: 37
Joined: 11/30/2012
Status: offline 		I am okay with refugees coming here as long as they go through proper channels and are indeed, 'refugees' as per the Geneva Convention. But fact is, the people smugglers operating from Indonesia, do NOT fill their leaky boats with 'refugees' but 'economic refugees'. Economic refugees being people that go 'country shopping' instead of settling in the first country to give them asylum.

And they arrive without document and ID and therefore we don't know their history. While they may be good folk they equally may not!


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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:45:36 AM   
Jonc101


Posts: 122
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Australia
Status: offline 		Tara, that's the strengh of it - economic opportunists jumping the gun and using the well-tutored mantra of 'political persecution'.

The Pommy/Polish experience has nothing to do with it. Rightly or wrongly, the Poles are allowed in to the UK under the terms of the Schengen Agreement, so that's a matter for the Brits to work out for themselves.

Australia is a country of migrants - half of us are either born overseas or our parents were. That's just the two immediate generations. The rest of us came in dribs and drabs over 200 years.

It's never a matter of whether we like or dislike immigration, it's a matter of the quality of these new arrivals, disguising themselves as something they're not.

FJ

(in reply to TizzyTara)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:56:43 AM   
TizzyTara


Posts: 37
Joined: 11/30/2012
Status: offline 		I agree Jonc101. Personally, I'd like to see Australia embrace a proactive immigrant programme such that immigrants come here in substantial numbers.

I'm sure the Burmese would love to come here and settle and what wonderful new Australians they would make.

However, instead of the Australian Federal Government sinking money into a programme for immigrants that would benefit Australia as well as the immigrants: the Australian Government is spending millions on making good the people smugglers agreements with their passengers i.e pay us big bucks and we will smuggle you into Australia on a boat.


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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 3:36:43 AM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

The birth rate in the USA is falling steadily. We are in serious need of more immigrants to maintain our future economic progress.

Even by our government's own over-cooked numbers, the unemployment rate in the U.S. is still above 8%. More realistically, it's probably twice that. And you think we need more immigrants??

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 12/6/2012 3:37:56 AM >

(in reply to vincentML)
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RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 5:15:39 AM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

lol.. he still has lots to learn here.



Hes Aussie, maybe we can fix him up with Tweaks......

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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 5:33:32 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

The birth rate in the USA is falling steadily. We are in serious need of more immigrants to maintain our future economic progress.

Even by our government's own over-cooked numbers, the unemployment rate in the U.S. is still above 8%. More realistically, it's probably twice that. And you think we need more immigrants??

K.



Yes, especially in the STEM program where we are lacking. Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math college students from abroad with their parents. The House recently passed a Bill, I believe, but with the caveat to reduce quotas from the general populations of immigrant applications. If I have it right the Dems demurred on that.

For several reasons, location and poor wages, there are not a lot of urban people in line for agricultural jobs, so there really are some jobs that Americans don't want. However, I believe the use of undocumented immigrants has probably been abused as a union busting tactic and cost suppression tactic in such industries as construction, hospitality, and meat processing.

The 'logic' of more population equals improved economy arises from the observation that immigrants, no matter their education levels, tend to be risk takers and therefore more entrepruneurial than the settled population groups. We witnessed that in Dade County where there is a thriving immigrant economy. Not all of them from Cuba. Many 'illegals' from other Latino countries.

ETA It is the outsourcing of jobs that has reduced our consumer base. We need more people here with purchasing power to circulate money in our economy. Overtime the population has to grow in order for the economy to grow. Japan is facing a problem with an aging population and a very tight immigration policy (if any at all) Russia is also losing population and faces future economic problems because their consumer base has been reduced by emigration. China, India, and Brazil do not have that problem. Neither would the Middle East if their authoritarian tendencies got out of the way.

< Message edited by vincentML -- 12/6/2012 5:41:23 AM >

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 5:58:00 AM   
metamorfosis


Posts: 1132
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jonc101
I don't think too many Aussies are worried about that. We're sick of them.
FJ


My point is you might want to rethink if it's really bogus to give asylum to people who are literally dying to get to your country.

Pam


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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 12:24:14 PM   
Jonc101


Posts: 122
Joined: 1/11/2005
From: Australia
Status: offline 		They're mostly 'bogus' people so why should anyone care how they choose to die? Sorry, gotta be clear-minded about these things. They have our Govt. wrapped around the proverbial little finger, aided by our own 5th column 'human rights' shysters who are earning a very good living putting legal obstacles in the way of deporting the buggers.

FJ

(in reply to metamorfosis)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 12:49:13 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline 		You're just pissed off because of all that sleigh-flying and present-delivering you're going to have to do come the 24th, aren't you?

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:15:00 PM   
naughtynick81


Posts: 890
Joined: 3/23/2007
Status: offline
quote:

My point is you might want to rethink if it's really bogus to give asylum to people who are literally dying to get to your country.


You meant fake liars who get rid of their documentation and then come to Australia expecting us to believe any sob story and hand them everything on a silver platter?

What the fuck is this world coming to?


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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:38:01 PM   
papassion


Posts: 487
Joined: 3/28/2012
Status: offline
You Libs have to look at things the way they are, not the way you imagine them to be. Most, if not all, of the kind and gentle libs of the european countries that welcomed immigrants and praised how "liberal" we are in accepting these people! The people in European countries are now making our conservtives look tame in the way the Europeans now view the immigrants. They now see the error of their ways in allowing unlimited immigration. High unemployment, lowered wages, crime, brutal taxes to support the immigrants, etc. Libs turn a blind eye to the plight of potential immigrants waiting to get in legally. I gues the pain and suffering of legals waiting don't count to a lib.

Why can't these people get jobs in Mexico. If you pay attention, just about ALL manufactured goods today are made in China or MEXICO. Oh thats right. I don't think Mexico has a good welfare program.

I don't know if the government is smart enough to match legal immigration

(in reply to naughtynick81)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Illegal immigrants - 12/6/2012 2:39:33 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Any you cons look at things the way you imagine them to be exclusively, not what is true or real.

Thats where you fuck up all the time, and have since the founding of the world.

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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