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RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 7:38:52 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

Bullshit......all of it,nothing more than a false dichotomy offered by false prophets of economic doom.
One only need look to Britain to see the effect of government retrenchment upon a faltering recovery.
An economy barely ably to move the needle of growth is not likely to withstand cuts in the public sector.


You have (widespread) delusional view of the economy as a consumption. There is no recovery with cuts or without them (how much money the Fed has pumped into the economy since 2008?).

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 10:47:23 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Here`s Paul Ryan taking credit (errr, responsibility.....) for the sequestration.
http://paulryan.house.gov/top5issues/sequester.htm
Who was in control of the HorRs when the act was created?
Who created the artificial budget crisis a year ago, to begin with?


The R's were in control of the House. The D's were in control of the Senate (who also had to pass the bill), and the President is a D. Without the D's passing the legislation, there would be no Act. So, it's not just the R's to be blamed.

And, did you miss where I supported the President and Administration in putting into place the sequestration to motivate both sides to compromise?

"Artificial budget crisis?!?" WTF is that? Are you saying there is no budget crisis?

The D's blame the R's for crazy ass spending and deficits when the R's are in power. The R's blame the D's for crazy ass spending and deficits when the D's are in power. In the meantime, we have crazy ass spending and deficits and neither side wants to make a change other than who is getting to do the spending. You blame the R's and Bush for the mess we're in (while never blaming the D's, who are at least as much to blame as the R's). Yet, you don't seem to have any problem with the deficits and spending that is continuing on, and is estimated to continue and increase. If Bush spent too much (which we agree on), then the D's are spending too much now. Tax revenues are are better than at any time prior to 2000. The 2012 estimated tax revenues would be the 3rd all-time highest revenue, and if we're within 11% of the 2013 estimate, tax revenues will be the all-time high. And, yet, the estimated 2013 deficit is going to be 5th highest ever. As a matter of fact, according to the OMB budget estimates, Obama's 8 years in charge of the budget will be the 2nd through the 9th highest budget deficits, all time.

You can blame the R's for blocking, not that it matters what I say. You accuse the R's of not compromising when they pass bills that won't even be opened to the floor in the Senate. You blame them for not passing legislation that can pass the Senate. Yet, when they do pass a bill that passes the Senate and gets signed by the President, you still blame them for playing games.

Get real. The R's are not the only problem in DC.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 10:54:35 PM   
fmfclwu


Posts: 74
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

Obama lied the entire campaign, blaming it completely on the Republicans, when it's been shown that it was Obama's Administration that brought it up. Why do people blame it on the Republicans? Because that's what they've been forcefed.



So if you hold my child hostage, and I offer you $1000 to give him back, who should people blame for me being out $1000?

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 11:08:45 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Obama lied the entire campaign, blaming it completely on the Republicans, when it's been shown that it was Obama's Administration that brought it up. Why do people blame it on the Republicans? Because that's what they've been forcefed.

So if you hold my child hostage, and I offer you $1000 to give him back, who should people blame for me being out $1000?


Not the same thing, and you know it.

The R's weren't holding anything "hostage." And, like I said, it takes two to tango. Neither side was compromising. Both are to blame, yet only the R's are being blamed.

And, because you probably didn't notice it, but I support the Administrations use of the sequester as a motivator to get both sides to compromise. It failed. That blame is on the D's as much as it is on the R's.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to fmfclwu)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 11:15:07 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/23/2013 11:38:12 PM   
fmfclwu


Posts: 74
Joined: 5/3/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Obama lied the entire campaign, blaming it completely on the Republicans, when it's been shown that it was Obama's Administration that brought it up. Why do people blame it on the Republicans? Because that's what they've been forcefed.

So if you hold my child hostage, and I offer you $1000 to give him back, who should people blame for me being out $1000?


Not the same thing, and you know it.

The R's weren't holding anything "hostage." And, like I said, it takes two to tango. Neither side was compromising. Both are to blame, yet only the R's are being blamed.

And, because you probably didn't notice it, but I support the Administrations use of the sequester as a motivator to get both sides to compromise. It failed. That blame is on the D's as much as it is on the R's.


First of all, you must have been born in 2012 to think the Republicans weren't holding a hostage.

Second, the Republicans' publicly stated position is that no compromise is possible. The Democrats have offered a compromise position that is in line with the vast majority of the country, including a majority of Republican voters, and have publicly stated that they are willing to negotiate. So if you want to assign blame to both parties, you have to answer this question: given the Republicans' publicly stated position that no compromise is possible, what specific thing could Democrats possibly do to achieve that compromise that you're blaming them for not reaching?

When you punish both parties for one party's extremism, you incentivise that extremism.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 1:06:58 AM   
FatDomDaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?


(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:52:58 AM   
fmfclwu


Posts: 74
Joined: 5/3/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?



I have no clue what this has to do with Republican hostage-taking over the debt ceiling, but the reasons spending per capita is up since 1/20/2009, in rough order of importance, would be:

- Health care cost inflation - every year, a greater and greater share of our economy is consumed by medical device makers, hospitals, and health insurance profits. Medicare costs have gone up about $245B/yr since Obama took office, and account for about 45% of all increased spending under Obama - and would have happened under any President.
- Aging of the population. Social Security payments are also up nearly $200B/yr since Obama took office, and we've now accounted for about 80% of the spending increase since Obama took office.
- The recession automatically blows up spending on many programs like Unemployment Insurance (+32B since Obama took office), Food stamps and WIC (+51B since Obama took office), and housing assistance (+17B since Obama took office). We're now at over 95% of the spending increase since Obama took office.
- The holding period inflation since Obama took office is about 6%.


Adding up just the factors above, none of which were under Obama's control, we have your full spending increase since Obama took office. The image of Obama as profligate spender is nothing but a right-wing myth.

Edit: hit submit instead of back-to-post.

< Message edited by fmfclwu -- 2/24/2013 2:54:54 AM >

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 5:07:03 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.
This has never been an issue before President Obama.
The blame for it all is on the "r"s.


Yeah, they held the rating hostage.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/06/us-usa-debt-downgrade-idUSTRE7746VF20110806
    quote:

    "The downgrade reflects our opinion that the fiscal consolidation plan that Congress and the Administration recently agreed to falls short of what, in our view, would be necessary to stabilize the government's medium-term debt dynamics," S&P said in a statement.
    The decision follows a fierce political battle in Congress over cutting spending and raising taxes to reduce the government's debt burden and allow its statutory borrowing limit to be raised.
    On August 2, President Barack Obama signed legislation designed to reduce the fiscal deficit by $2.1 trillion over 10 years. But that was well short of the $4 trillion in savings S&P had called for as a good "down payment" on fixing America's finances.


Sure seems like the issue has to do with our deficits and debt. The bill was passed. S&P didn't accept it as enough.





_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 5:21:50 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: fmfclwu
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Obama lied the entire campaign, blaming it completely on the Republicans, when it's been shown that it was Obama's Administration that brought it up. Why do people blame it on the Republicans? Because that's what they've been forcefed.

So if you hold my child hostage, and I offer you $1000 to give him back, who should people blame for me being out $1000?

Not the same thing, and you know it.
The R's weren't holding anything "hostage." And, like I said, it takes two to tango. Neither side was compromising. Both are to blame, yet only the R's are being blamed.
And, because you probably didn't notice it, but I support the Administrations use of the sequester as a motivator to get both sides to compromise. It failed. That blame is on the D's as much as it is on the R's.

First of all, you must have been born in 2012 to think the Republicans weren't holding a hostage.


That would be against CM's TOU, I do believe. So, you can rest assured that my youthful (WTF?!?) countenance belies my actual age.

quote:

Second, the Republicans' publicly stated position is that no compromise is possible. The Democrats have offered a compromise position that is in line with the vast majority of the country, including a majority of Republican voters, and have publicly stated that they are willing to negotiate. So if you want to assign blame to both parties, you have to answer this question: given the Republicans' publicly stated position that no compromise is possible, what specific thing could Democrats possibly do to achieve that compromise that you're blaming them for not reaching?
When you punish both parties for one party's extremism, you incentivise that extremism.


Here's a question for you: If your beliefs are completely against what the other side is trying to do, what would you do? Acquiesce, I'm sure, right? Or, would you use any leverage you could possibly have to inject fiscal sanity into the picture?

Ending "Bush tax cuts for the rich" would net $800B over 10 years. The $1+T of spending cuts they were offering? The expected reductions in war spending. They were counting cost reductions that were going to happen anyway. WTF kind of offer is that?!?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to fmfclwu)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 9:02:44 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?






Just more bullshit from the bullshit party......

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 10:49:24 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		No it's not...

You guys are really good at spending other people's money.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 11:14:02 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		That crap only works on the already bullshitted.


In ther words you`re wasting your time.

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 1:05:17 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?






Just more bullshit from the bullshit party......


So he rounded up and the amount is $822.90. Sheesh. I suppose if I had written $823, your panties would still be in a knot.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/real-federal-spending-82290-american-2008

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 1:56:36 PM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?






Just more bullshit from the bullshit party......


So he rounded up and the amount is $822.90. Sheesh. I suppose if I had written $823, your panties would still be in a knot.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/real-federal-spending-82290-american-2008


Anytime anyone points out that dems are as bad as repubs he gets his panties in a knot... He's a twue believer.


_____________________________

http://www.extra-life.org/

(in reply to Aylee)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:17:55 PM   
HarryVanWinkle


Posts: 1720
Joined: 5/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?






Just more bullshit from the bullshit party......


They're both bullshit parties.

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:23:44 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967


quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

The "r"s held our nation`s full faith and credit and historical AAA rating hostage, and ended up ruining it.

This has never been an issue before President Obama.

The blame for it all is on the "r"s.



Well then tell me... in a down economy... regardless of who's "fault" it is... why President Obama increased spending almost $1,000.00 per person since he took office?






Just more bullshit from the bullshit party......


So he rounded up and the amount is $822.90. Sheesh. I suppose if I had written $823, your panties would still be in a knot.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/real-federal-spending-82290-american-2008


Anytime anyone points out that dems are as bad as repubs he gets his panties in a knot... He's a twue believer.



CNS?



Again....just more bullshit from rightist media.....

Yawn.... already.....

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:24:07 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		I say let these cuts begin. We have to start someplace and I say better now than never. It will not be the end of the world.

(in reply to HarryVanWinkle)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:27:45 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		More bullshit from the bullshit party.....


"State governors plead with Washington to avoid government shut down"



http://www.wlox.com/Global/story.asp?S=14149107&clienttype=printable

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Bob Woodward on Sequester: President Obama "is... - 2/24/2013 2:41:31 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967



Anytime anyone points out that dems are as bad as repubs he gets his panties in a knot... He's a twue believer.



Let's face it, shit sucks right now and the engorgement (oops, I meant government) or what passes for government is not helping.

I feel slightly like Henry II, "Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?" Except with, "Will no one rid me of these turbulent regulations?"

And why does the sequestration NOT kill things like bunny inspectors?

I am actually kind of tired of the numbers said about this and that. The Senate has not passed a budget in over 1000 days (lit fans will get the reference.) So how do they KNOW? No one knows. The Senate is not doing its job, has NOT done its job, and it is time to impeach the lot of them for dereliction of duty.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 40
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