RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (Full Version)

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Kaliko -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 5:59:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

But it seems like the description of a D/S relationship is about having no disagreement, one makes decision, and the other just follow without question.



Oh, I question. And he answers. And if we disagree, we will talk about it. Sometimes passionately. In the end, though, the decision is his.

Everybody has their own requirements for a good relationship. One of mine is to be able to say to him "I don't understand. What do you mean by that?" or "I'm not comfortable with that. Can we talk about why?"

I'm not giving him my whole self if I just shut up and stay quiet when I'm confused or questioning. He deserves to know, and he can use that information making decisions going forward. Once he knows and he's made his decision? Then I shush up and stay quiet. (Theoretically.) :)



lizi -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:05:45 AM)

I don't play games, I've never even been able to do the coy 'I'm interested in you' type of things; I let men know upfront where I am with things. If things change and aren't as they were, I let them know that too. I am unable to contrive anything in a believable way, whoever I'm with will be getting exactly what was promised. Btw, I suck at role play too.

Since it is a deep part of my personality to honestly be who I am at any given moment, I don't much see the use of artificially putting up obstacles in a relationship. To me, a D/s relationship runs on trust, honesty, and unrelenting support; why potentially damage that by throwing in a wrench here and there? It's like saying, "Gosh we have this great car, it takes us wherever we want to go, I think I'll pour sand in the gas tank for excitement!"

I think there has to be a rock solid base to work from in a D/s relationship, one that both members have to be sold on as being a a firm platform so they can jump off from it and do the kinky or risky things that they do, all the while having the solid base to come back to. In a good relationship you have to be able to depend on that person and know they are there, not wonder where they will be and what they'll be getting up to.



Greta75 -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:14:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC
I'm trying to follow where your head is at Greta. Yes, I talk back to my boss and Carol talks back to me... all the way up until a decision is reached. After that, if I continue to talk back to my boss then either he or I gets fired. Ditto with Carol.

And this is exactly how I visualize D/S, but a few here seem to imply that, there is no talking back allowed at all, no disagreement, they want absolute peace and harmony and no protest.
Jeff, you have explained before that you actually condition Carol to accept some things you want, and you understand some things will take time for her to accept. Now that sounds more realistic in a real relationship than what the rest are saying about it.

Of course, if I look back to my x-vanilla marriage, me and my x are exactly the same mind, so we never have disagreements on anything, we always come to the same conclusion, make the same decisions, we were so much alike in thoughts and decision making process, that there is nothing to disagree about at all. So I guess for a total peace between two people, it takes that kind of like-mindedness. But on the bad side, we became like brothers and sisters, there is no passion. And I say that because I'm like that with my brothers as well, we never fight or disagree.



Greta75 -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:21:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Not to mention that there are some ways of expressing annoyance or disagreement that will get you fired before you finish the first sentence.

K.


I would imagine talking back to your dom is like talking back to your boss, with alot of respect and deference.



JeffBC -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:22:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
And this is exactly how I visualize D/S, but a few here seem to imply that, there is no talking back allowed at all, no disagreement, they want absolute peace and harmony and no protest.

Ahhhh... yes. Well since I haven't been able to download my brain into Carol's and frankly wouldn't want to be married to me even if I could do that then yeah... I'm all with you on this one. Honestly, I think a lot of what I read online is just plain ridiculous bullshit that is way too black & white to exist in any real world I know about.

That being said, I suppose some guys out there really don't want a relationship. They want a living love doll. I also get it that some women want that too... at least to dabble with. I suspect such relationships are very short-term in nature but they may well fill a purpose for those involved.

I would imagine talking back to your dom is like talking back to your boss, with alot of respect and deference.
For the record, both Carol and I have a TON more respect for each other than we have ever had for any boss. Nobody needs to "command" that. It's true simply because we find our partner respect-worthy.



Level -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:30:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Not to mention that there are some ways of expressing annoyance or disagreement that will get you fired before you finish the first sentence.

K.


I would imagine talking back to your dom is like talking back to your boss, with alot of respect and deference.



Change "talking back" to "talking to", and I'd be more agreeable to this.



Greta75 -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 8:17:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC
For the record, both Carol and I have a TON more respect for each other than we have ever had for any boss. Nobody needs to "command" that. It's true simply because we find our partner respect-worthy.

I am very close to my brothers and was with my x-vanilla husband, but the way I talk back to them, will be very different from the way I talk back to my dom or my boss.
Perhaps on the surface, the way I talk back to my bro or my x-vanilla man may be perceived as disrespectful, but it's that type of talk freely that we could with each other, without any formality and just alot of mutual understanding and teasing and playfully bantering sort of way.
It would just be alot less playful and more formal with bosses or doms, for me at least, that's what I mean by with respect. I think generally, you talk differently with people of authority.



chatterbox24 -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 8:50:00 AM)

Challenge can be exciting. I think one of the most satisfying things, is to have a challenge, have good communication, and resolve it.( in example leadin to Make up sex!!!!)Its A building block to an already solid foundation.
But if you dont have that solid foundation to begin with those challenges can be destruction. Challenges that are never resolved causing emotional and mental distress, that come out of incompatiblity are not exciting and are usually a very good tool to use to see a relationship is probably not in ones best interest.



AthenaSurrenders -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 12:06:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact


Seriously, you never see vanilla people deciding that they have to cause discontent in some guise of supposing there are benefits in "challenges" to the harmony of the home. Why kinky people decide they have to do this to keep the relationship "interesting" is beyond My realm of understanding.



Actually I sort of disagree with you on that. I've seen plenty of women give each other terrible advice about deliberately provoking jealousy in their other half to get him to 'fight for her' or prove his love. They might not be consciously thinking that challenging each other will improve their relationship but that is how I would interpret it.

And then there are people like my Mother-in-law, who thrives on confrontation and conflict in a relationship and will set it up if it doesn't arise naturally. Arguably these aren't the healthiest relationships but I wouldn't say it doesn't happen to non-kinky folk.

With D/s and BDSMers though it does seem to tie in with the whole sexual fantasy of conquering and taming, rather than the practical day-to-day reality of having a satisfying relationship.



OsideGirl -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 1:51:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: AthenaSurrenders
Actually I sort of disagree with you on that. I've seen plenty of women give each other terrible advice about deliberately provoking jealousy in their other half to get him to 'fight for her' or prove his love. They might not be consciously thinking that challenging each other will improve their relationship but that is how I would interpret it.

And then there are people like my Mother-in-law, who thrives on confrontation and conflict in a relationship and will set it up if it doesn't arise naturally. Arguably these aren't the healthiest relationships but I wouldn't say it doesn't happen to non-kinky folk.

I'll agree that it happens in vanilla relationships. I actually think there is more game playing in vanilla relationships than D/s BDSM relationships.

I don't think game playing helps build a healthy and happy relationship. It builds a relationship where you can't trust the other person. It's manipulation and passive aggressive.



DesFIP -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 6:37:39 PM)

I've known people to have humongous fights on Friday night to relieve work week stress, followed up by make up sex.

It isn't something I enjoy. And I really hated living in an apartment above a couple like this, worse because it was more daily than just once a week.

But as far as not talking to him, that would remove part of his ability to make truly awesome decisions. Because I'm a resource well worth exploiting. I'm highly intelligent and I will remember details while he's a big picture person.If I stopped telling him when he was making a mistake, in time for him to avert making it, he'd make a lot more.



NuevaVida -> RE: How much challenge do you enjoy from a sub? (3/20/2013 7:13:28 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: misanthropicdom

Playing "hard to get" is a very vanilla concept, perhaps something your mother or aunt or Cosmo magazine tried very hard to force into your head. It's bullshit. It's always been bullshit. It has been my experience that women who consistently play "hard to get" eventually spend a lot of time alone, taking to their cats.


I didn't play hard to get. I was hard to get. I was picky, took my time getting to know the person before I committed and shot down/walked away from anyone who wasn't on the same page that I was. If I spent time alone it was my choice. And I don't own a cat.


I second this - me too. Except I DO own a cat, and I was quite happy with my life with just the kitty in it. And my family. And my friends. And my job. And all the things I like to do by myself.

That said, yes, I challenge him, but only when it's either necessary (because I think he seriously needs to rethink something) or when I'm feeling emotionally distant, and it's my authentic reaction to something he's saying or wanting of me. He deals with it by setting us back on course.

Of course, there are playful challenges too, which he loves. Time and place appropriate.

I don't make up challenges; Life can be challenging enough. But some life situations cause me to challenge his thinking, which might annoy him at times, but in the end he appreciates/tolerates.



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