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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 10:49:30 AM

mnottertail

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You will need crates of it, I warrant.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 10:52:36 AM

Phoenixpower

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

FR

From the site that shall not be named -

Local TV station CYBC reports that police in the Cyprus' capital are scuffling with protesters (including employees of Cyprus Popular Bank) outside the nation's parliament:

It's not blowing over. Not yet anyway.

Thanks for the link, as I also enjoyed reading this part "The Merkel High Wire Act Is About to End... When She Falls, So Will Europe" of it

Yep, I think the election will be interesting this year, though I know, thats not the topic here now

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 2:48:48 PM

Yachtie

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And from the site that shall not be named -

Cyprus Officially Passes Capital Controls Into Law

That should make the citizenry confident and give them a warm fuzzy

and on the home front, also reported via the site that shall not be named -

A local restaurant chain is now asking customers to fill out a form before paying with a 100. They say that's because they are often on the losing end off counterfeit $100 bills

Really?

How soon before all other retailers and vendors decide that it is a good idea to demand their clients' personal info, for the sake of avoiding counterfeiting of course, first in all $100 bill transactions, then $50, then $20, and so on?

Aww, that's just tin-foil hat schtick

< Message edited by Yachtie -- 3/22/2013 2:54:13 PM >

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 4:13:04 PM

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I observed the English sent a military transport loaded with skids of cashy money to Cyprus, so their troops and such had funds.

And the trend, especially in first world nations is towards "electronic" money, which of course is only functional at the whims of the financial system and the government behind it.

So then what would happen in the case of a large nation like France, Germany, Spain, Italy, where such a bank freeze, and then a levy was made? Or worse, a total breakdown of the national banking system, where the victims cannot even perform a run on the banks?

As many live from hand to mouth, rent and food become unavailable, and small businesses would also be crimped. Trouble will happen.

Thus the real problem will be the consequence if the social order breaks down in one or more larger nations in the EU. I doubt the EU as a whole can put enough boots on the ground to restore order in a country the size of France or Germany. The police would be certainly overwhelmed.

Consider the rioting in the UK last year, as a sample of things to come if Brussels cannot get a brake put on this, and there is every evidence they can not.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 6:36:35 PM

Yachtie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN
if Brussels cannot get a brake put on this, and there is every evidence they can not.

Can't put a break to what needs be increased. Funding. And that's what's causing all the problems.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 6:49:33 PM

Yachtie

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FR

From ABC News -

Lawmakers in Cyprus approved three bills late Friday aimed at securing a bailout for its troubled banks from the European Union and averting a financial meltdown.

The legislation includes one bill that allows the government to divide the wobbling lenders into good and bad banks -- a law that would likely to be applied first to Cyprus Popular Bank. The goal is to restructure without hurting small depositors.

A second law puts in place restrictions on financial transactions in times of crisis and a third sets up a "solidarity fund."

Earlier Friday a Greek Bank was chosen to take over the local branches of Cyprus's troubled banks in a bid to shelter Greek customers of those institutions and help Cyprus shrink its bloated banking sector.

Merkel's not to happy?
According to reliable sources present at the meeting, she said Cyprus was "exhausting the patience of its euro partners" and she was particularly incensed that the government had failed to produce a "plan B". She also complained about the lack of communication from Nicosia.

I think what what wasn't reported was her saying, "It's all Greek to me!"

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 6:59:23 PM

LookieNoNookie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
Question - Who benefits?

Well yah of course. It's not like it's hard to "follow the money" in this case. It's a direct and open transaction. But what I can't figure out is why any non-wealthy type would be in favor.

The average Cypriot isn't. I sincerely doubt the average New Zealander is.

Thy can be.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 7:11:01 PM

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The EU has been backdoor "qualitatively easing" through the purchase of certain member governments "bonds" I believe to the tune of a stated 275 billion Euros (or so it was printed that amount would be used last fall,) though I am not certain if that is their current limit.

But therein lies their downfall, inflationary surges. They only have to look across the Channel to see how this will play out with pensions, savings and the "cost of living."

This is something they cannot print their way out of, Mugabe should serve as an example.

As for external and "harder" currency funding, the Arab, Japanese and Singapore wealth funds are about maxed out, and China flat told them last year that while China might purchase assets, they were not putting hard earned Chinese money into the European governmental madness.

As for begging hard money elsewhere, who in the Americas can they call on?

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 7:27:09 PM

WantsOfTheFlesh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenixpower
Thanks for the link, as I also enjoyed reading this part "The Merkel High Wire Act Is About to End... When She Falls, So Will Europe" of it Yep, I think the election will be interesting this year, though I know, thats not the topic here now

i hear merkel ain't the flavor of the month over in germany so the aid will be no more if she is booted outta office. still wont be good for germany if tha eu fails.

< Message edited by WantsOfTheFlesh -- 3/22/2013 7:31:50 PM >

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/22/2013 8:23:25 PM

Yachtie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WantsOfTheFlesh
i hear merkel ain't the flavor of the month over in germany so the aid will be no more if she is booted outta office. still wont be good for germany if tha eu fails.

Not according to this article -

On the streets of Cyprus, she is viewed as a hate figure, blamed for the bank deposit tax plan, even though the idea originally came from Nicosia, and for insisting that Cyprus should raise a third of the country's rescue fund itself. The effect of this at home has merely been to increase Merkel's support.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 9:52:11 AM

vincentML

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Here is an interesting take on the troubles in Cyprus:

What does this have to do with Cyprus? Since 2008, when Cyprus joined the Eurozone, Russian big shots have been using the country as a backdoor into Europe. They’ve used Cyprus banks to turn rubles into Euros, and then funnel the cash back into Russia. As the New York Times notes, “Cypriot entities, often owned by rich Russians, lent $40 billion a year to Russia from 2007 through 2011.” In 2010, Dymytry Rybolovlev, a Russian oligarch known for expensive real estate purchases, bought about 10 percent of the Bank of Cyprus, which is now in trouble. To a large degree, Germans and other Europeans regard a bailout of Cyprus’s banking system as a bailout of Russians with shadowy wealth. That, too, is unpalatable to Germans and most other Europeans. The Cold War may be over, but Europeans have long memories.
RUSSIANS

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 12:11:42 PM

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So Europeans are silly enough think it is certain Russian bank customer's fault that Cypriot banks bought a toxic load of Greek debt causing them to fail?

The English might as well blame the Arab and Indian depositors at London banks for these bank's ongoing financial problems, their drug money laundering, or the banker's great bonuses.

But explain to us how this works, are the people who have money in bank accounts in the United States commonly seen or regarded as responsible for the bank's criminal activities, or financial irregularities?

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 5:11:31 PM

WantsOfTheFlesh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN
So Europeans are silly enough think it is certain Russian bank customer's fault that Cypriot banks bought a toxic load of Greek debt causing them to fail?

The English might as well blame the Arab and Indian depositors at London banks for these bank's ongoing financial problems, their drug money laundering, or the banker's great bonuses.

But explain to us how this works, are the people who have money in bank accounts in the United States commonly seen or regarded as responsible for the bank's criminal activities, or financial irregularities?

its thought tha cypriot banks didnt screen tha money transfers properly. thats one of tha biggest legal duties for a bank coz it helps stop organised crime & terrorism. maybe part of tha reason tha cyprus popular bank is being shut while tha smaller depositors are being saved http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/03/24/us-cyprus-parliament-idUSBRE92G03I20130324

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 5:31:36 PM

Politesub53

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Blame bad governance and bad banking practices.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 5:33:24 PM

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That may be true, however the Russian depositors in the questioned bank had nothing to do with bank investment policies, unless you have some evidence otherwise.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 5:38:58 PM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN

That may be true, however the Russian depositors in the questioned bank had nothing to do with bank investment policies, unless you have some evidence otherwise.

Do you really think the Russian who owns 10% of one of the banks holds no sway ?

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 5:55:41 PM

WantsOfTheFlesh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN
That may be true, however the Russian depositors in the questioned bank had nothing to do with bank investment policies, unless you have some evidence otherwise.

tha cypriot banks have strong ties wit russia

quote:

2008 Marfin Popular Bank completed its acquisition of 50.4% of the shares of CJSC RPB Holding, parent company of the Rossisysky Promishlenny Bank (Rosprombank), for €83 million. The acquisition makes Marfin the first Greek or Cypriot bank to acquire control of a bank in Russia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyprus_Popular_Bank

quote:

Russian companies and individuals have US$31-billion of deposits in Cyprus, according to Moody’s Investors Services.

More than a third of the branches of the Bank of Cyprus, which held 27% of the country’s deposits at the end of September, are located in Russia.

Russian businessman Dmitry Rybolovlev is the largest shareholder in the Bank of Cyprus with a 9.7% stake held via British Virgin Islands-based trust Odella Resources, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. Rybolovlev, worth US$9.4-billion, bought an apartment at 15 Central Park West, New York, for US$88-million last year.

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/03/19/bloated-with-funds-from-wealthy-foreigners-cypruss-banks-swell-to-7-times-the-size-of-the-economy/

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 6:05:50 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: YN

That may be true, however the Russian depositors in the questioned bank had nothing to do with bank investment policies, unless you have some evidence otherwise.

Do you really think the Russian who owns 10% of one of the banks holds no sway ?

Do Torys like yourself think that a Russian owning 10% of one bank is responsible for the banks failing in Cyprus?

Your right wing Tory government under your champion Cameron did not follow the same rules and dropped the criminal prosecution of the Tchenguiz brothers regarding their part the failings of the Iceland banks, even though they owned more significant shares (and one was apparently on the board of directors of one of the Icelandic banks) in the Icelandic bank and in fact had drawn billions in loans which which were used in the UK, and which could be seized to pay off the injured English depositors.

quote:

Robert Tchenguiz borrowed £1.25bn from the failed bank to finance deals. He used the funds, borrowed months before the collapse, to buy stakes in companies including Sainsbury's and pubs company Mitchells and Butlers. Robert Tchenguiz also owned a stake in Kaupthing.

So are there two sets of rules and standards used. the lax set the Tory voter applies regarding British banking and financial activities and and the far harsher one which a Tory nationalist applies conduct in other countries?

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 6:08:17 PM

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So because a Cypriot bank owns more then half a Russian bank, it shows Russians control the Cypriot banks? Please explain this logic.

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RE: New Zealand is thinking of going all Cyprus - 3/24/2013 6:18:50 PM

LookieNoNookie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YN

So because a Cypriot bank owns more then half a Russian bank, it shows Russians control the Cypriot banks? Please explain this logic.

Here's how that works.

(Grab a calculator....there will be a test later).

In any entity, there is/are 100% shares. 100,000 shares let's say, for example.

If you own more than half (51% or more....51,000 or more of those shares/investment in operating assets, etc.) that gives you control, by any definition.

(And the Cypriot banks don't own more than half....the Russians do).

(Thus endeth the lesson).

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 3/24/2013 6:20:01 PM >

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