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RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 5:15:17 AM   
absolutchocolat


Posts: 1392
Status: offline 		Ditto. I don't think you should get to call someone a rapist online without them being convicted of the crime first. Nowadays, the court of public opinion often labels someone a criminal before all of the evidence is examined, Plus, I just think it's messy. If someone hurts me, I'm telling the police before blasting someone online, just saying.

Then, of course, there's always that butthurt asshole who didn't get their way, coming online to spread post-coital regret. Gotta love 'em.

(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/27/2013 6:02:35 AM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

THe line between bullying?
I believe bullying is bullying when someone complains it is. IT doesn't matter if the majority pipes up to say " oh this person is to sensitive, they asked for it, I tell the facts" If someone is complaining they feel attacked, it is very real to them. If it feels like bullying to them, it is. That is the line. Usually if someone complains of being bullied, they are so much of the time told "you dont have self control" "you play a victim" I have rarely seen a person say to the person. " I am really sorry to make you feel that way, my tone was not meant to hurt you but to help you" Takes a big person with empathy for others to do that. Using the internet for an excuse to be mean spirited to others, or talk down to them, or call them out on everything you feel is wrong with them is a lame excuse to use. Still there is a person on the other side, not everyone is a troll, fake, liar, people dont know their situation and some people just are rookies, and what seems like cake to some, is a big deal to them. They simply dont know, and really want some good advice. Telling them they are stupid, or you are to old not to know that, is not productive. For as many people who come on this site, and are members, the ratio of people who actually post is very minimal, think there might be a reason for that? I personally find nothing good about intentionally making another feel bad. Alot of posts by new people end up that way, no one sees the pattern? Just my two cents!

Consensual humilation?
ITs consensual when they ask for it by name.



I am mainly in agreement with LadyPact here.

Perceptions are not always true.

Our perceptions are influenced by all of our past experience and if someone has had a lot of negative interactions in their life, then his/her perception is likely to be negative when interacting with on-line folks in forums.
Sometimes people have great difficulty in communicating clearly in any medium and don't realise it,
Those communication difficulties lead to misunderstandings and those misunderstandings often lead to hurt feelings... and in real life interactions, sometimes precarious positions.
Feelings aren't facts, and neither are our perceptions and each person has to be responsible for their own communication style and the issues that result from that.

People often get defensive when someone offers constructive advice that isn't what they want to hear and then they become combative.
Dealing with combative people quickly gets tiring and it is easy to form a negative opinion about that person.

I have noticed though that the negative perception very often changes, when someone decides to own their mistake and put in effort to do better next time.

We are a forgiving bunch, unless you repeatedly sh*t all over us, or attempt to deceive by giving rapidly changeable half-truths.
The people who share their experience and wisdom find dealing with the latter to be a time suck, and very few of us have time to give well thought advice, only to find out later that the evolving story isn't half-true; it creates resentment.

Having said that, I do think a little compassion can go a long way and I try to lead with that.

Too much damage can be done if people are allowed to name those who allegedly abused or sexually assaulted them.

Having said that, I think we should try and do our part to change a system that is too often hostile towards victims; especially in situations in which consent may have been given at some point in the past.
Partner rape is not new, nor uncommon: most people who are sexually assaulted are assaulted by someone they know.
If it happens in 'vanilla' relationships then it happens in kink and power-exchange based ones.
As a society we need to work on lessening the shame of reporting crimes and as "a community" making certain that is inclusive of kink and power-exchange based relationships.

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(in reply to chatterbox24)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/27/2013 8:47:39 AM   
JeffBC


Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1
The blog post essentially says FetLife has become unsafe for kinksters because of a tendency to blame victims of sexual assault when they try to discuss their problems on Fet. Also, hilariously perhaps, the blog post offers CollarMe as a safer alternative to Fet. This post has gone minorly viral on Tumblr and elsewhere, so it's getting some play.

LOLOL. Then again, Fet is the site where it's owner sees no issues with cyber-bullying kids.

Where's the line between cyberbullying and consensual online humiliation?
Uh... consent?

Where's the line between victim blaming/slut shaming and insisting on personal responsibility from a sub who enjoys rough sex?
Intent? People often want to make these two things mutually incompatible and they self-evidently are not. It's perfectly reasonable to say "the rapist should not have committed a crime" and "the rape victim could have minimized the risk". Both are important messages.


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(in reply to RedMagic1)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/27/2013 1:27:08 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

I've never been cyber bullied to my knowledge,
and to be honest, I'm not really sure how it
would be possible to bully me via the internet.

Sooo... Your move, bullies.

Agreed.
I don't see anyway I could feel threatened by anything cyber. I mean, really...it ain't like they gonna beat me up or any such shit. I'm an anonymous guy on an anonymous site posting pretty much for personal fun. It ain't like I need to be on there. I can always just walk-no biggee

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(in reply to ARIES83)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 2:18:31 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
Problem is that in the situations I spoke of, where this is most common, the college parties, the guys are just as drunk as the girls. Yes, everyone should know not to have drunk sex, but when you are drunk, you don't make good decisions.
Seriously, I understand why you say this. But, What in the world is the point of getting drunk, if you get less inhibited, want to have sex, and don't have sex.

I don't mean that anyone should have non-consentual sex ever! However, it will be a cold day in hell, when people give up sex while drinking. It behooves everyone, to decide whether to drink, and whether they're going to have sex while fully awake/sober/aware. I don't advise any guy to get involved with anyone while drunk, but I cannot stand the people who want to become virgins again, after being slut last night, by crying rape. M


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(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 2:28:29 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		When I used to drink a lot and go to bars, I was fully aware that the reason I was doing so was to get laid and nothing else. Didn't care who the guy was as long as he was hot and good at sex.

If it ended up he sucked at sex then the next morning I said to myself "geez he was awful! I don't think I'll be getting fucked by him again next weekend! What the hell made me think he would be good in bed??"



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(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 2:31:03 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Ja, you didn't hang out at my bars, bitch!!!!

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(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 2:34:42 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		I might have! Who knows. I could have even fucked ya and I wouldn't even know. I can't even remember most of the faces and I don't even think I knew most of their names.

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Nothing has changed
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Profile   Post #: 28
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 2:47:55 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Not hardly, I didnt get out that way.

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 4:45:51 PM   
absolutchocolat


Posts: 1392
Status: offline 		I'm with ya. I drank to the point of passing out twice -- both times in the company of friends I trusted, so they could stop me from being slutty. I start handing out blowjobs when I get some rum in me.

When I was just getting my buzz on though, I was like LW. I saw a guy or girl I wanted to bang and took 'em home. Most were repeat performances, but I wouldn't say they were bad decisions. Felt good at the time!

(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 4:47:30 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: absolutchocolat

I'm with ya. I drank to the point of passing out twice -- both times in the company of friends I trusted, so they could stop me from being slutty. I start handing out blowjobs when I get some rum in me.

When I was just getting my buzz on though, I was like LW. I saw a guy or girl I wanted to bang and took 'em home. Most were repeat performances, but I wouldn't say they were bad decisions. Felt good at the time!


Anyone want some rum?

(in reply to absolutchocolat)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 5:14:28 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
Problem is that in the situations I spoke of, where this is most common, the college parties, the guys are just as drunk as the girls. Yes, everyone should know not to have drunk sex, but when you are drunk, you don't make good decisions.
Seriously, I understand why you say this. But, What in the world is the point of getting drunk, if you get less inhibited, want to have sex, and don't have sex.

I don't mean that anyone should have non-consentual sex ever! However, it will be a cold day in hell, when people give up sex while drinking. It behooves everyone, to decide whether to drink, and whether they're going to have sex while fully awake/sober/aware. I don't advise any guy to get involved with anyone while drunk, but I cannot stand the people who want to become virgins again, after being slut last night, by crying rape. M



That's pretty much my point. Even though it sounds like blame the victim, a lot of these young girls are getting black out drunk, and having sex with guys who have enough of a buzz to not wonder whether she is too drunk to consent. After all, during the drunken haze, the girl is actively participating in the act. Then they wake up the next day and because they made a poor decision and don't want to admit it, they cry rape. It's bullshit.

Same thing with quite a few subs. They check their brains at the door when first meeting a new dominant. Some will call it sub frenzy, some will give them a pass for being naive, but unless you were raised under a rock, a girl was taught how to say "no." So when they consent to meeting them at their home, in a motel or whatever, and agreeing to play, when it doesn't go as they hoped, they say they were victimized. They weren't victimized, they behaved stupidly, and they don't deserve a pity party for it.

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 5:28:10 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline 		In my case "no" actually means "be gentle, it's my first time".

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/27/2013 6:44:56 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

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(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/28/2013 1:32:09 AM   
absolutchocolat


Posts: 1392
Status: offline 		Lol!!! Trying to take advantage of me, eh?

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: The line between bullying and consensual humiliation - 3/28/2013 1:59:35 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady
Same thing with quite a few subs. They check their brains at the door when first meeting a new dominant. Some will call it sub frenzy, some will give them a pass for being naive, but unless you were raised under a rock, a girl was taught how to say "no." So when they consent to meeting them at their home, in a motel or whatever, and agreeing to play, when it doesn't go as they hoped, they say they were victimized. They weren't victimized, they behaved stupidly, and they don't deserve a pity party for it.
I agree with you, and this is very much, the reason I disagree with naming/shaming of people on public message boards. As we are not the court of law, and cannot know someone's intentions, when writing to announce victimization, those cases are best left to courts of law to handle. I say this, fully aware, that the law does not always deliver justice.

There can be very few things worse, than having one's body/soul violated. I believe that there are abusers out there, who ought to be prosecuted. That however, ought not be done on a public message boards, to be fair to all parties involved. In cases where there was a party, and individuals were being extra friendly, I would tend to look for clear evidence of dissent, when morning after accusations are made. I feel sorry for the poor bastards who get caught in this crossfire.

As to the OP RedMagic1, my belief is: there is a very clear line, between bullying (undesired/unwelcomed/not consensual), and consensual humiliation. Perhaps for some people, it's okay to be excited about experiences, go edgy/hard, and without a safeword... That is clearly not the best path for most. People (submissives especially), think clearly about what you want, and how much danger you could place yourself in, and avoid the temptation to prove your badness, before consenting to play with a stranger, and without safewords/limits. M


< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 3/28/2013 2:02:53 AM >

_____________________________

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/28/2013 9:00:51 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

I've never been cyber bullied to my knowledge,
and to be honest, I'm not really sure how it
would be possible to bully me via the internet.

Sooo... Your move, bullies.


Well, tell that to the teens who hang themselves from cyber bullying.


(in reply to ARIES83)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/28/2013 9:33:16 AM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		I do think that we aren't talking about teens and Facebook, but the claim of "bullying" here and on FetLife, where there is quite a bit more anonymity.

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/28/2013 9:38:46 AM   
absolutchocolat


Posts: 1392
Status: offline 		I tend to agree with you there. We are all adults here and on FL. By now, most learn to take things other internet geeks say with a grain of salt. If someone begins to harass me -- send threatening messages, emails, etc. -- I can block, delete and move on. I can delete my profile and start fresh. I can report the person. Or I can ignore it.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: The line between cyberbullying and consensual humil... - 3/28/2013 1:07:05 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline 		Exactly. On sites like this, most of us are anonymous. On something like FaceBook, not at all. Unless someone really wants to find me in person, they can't bully me here. I can always just leave and move on with life. If someone here and on Fet is unable to do that, then I would say they have larger problems than thinking they are being cyber-bullied.

(in reply to absolutchocolat)
Profile   Post #: 40
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