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Another Progressive Victory! - 5/13/2013 9:50:30 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		"In A 37-30 Vote ...... Minnesota Senate Passes Marriage Equality Law"

Take that!.....you conservatives......


"Last week, the Minnesota House passed marriage equality. Today, the Minnesota Senate has chosen to do the same. By a vote of 37-30, Minnesota is now the 12th state in the nation to make marriage equality a reality for same-sex couples.

Following in the footsteps of Rhode Island and Delaware, both of which passed marriage equality earlier this month, Minnesota has become the first Midwestern state to legalize same-sex marriage through legislative action. Same-sex marriage is also legal in Iowa, but only because of a court decision














http://www.addictinginfo.org/2013/05/13/minnesota-senate-passes-marriage-equality-law/

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/13/2013 10:34:04 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		Another boost for the 14th.

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 5:13:22 AM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline 		honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 5:55:10 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444
honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'


So, in the case of the US starting to catch up in an area where many think they should, isn't something to cheer about? Would I be correct, then, that you'll not cheer if China starts to impose environmental standards?


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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 7:37:37 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'



It's a small step but at least we are headed in the right direction. And you have to keep in mind that some folks are too ignorant to understand that many liberals are against gay marriage and many conservatives are for it, so to them it's a chance to paint the other side as evil. Sometimes a bigot has to take what he can get. Funny how they ignore the election in CA where the liberals showed up in increased numbers and shot down prop 8 while electing Obama. I guess they just don't like it when the facts prove them wrong. But it is really good news for Minnesota.

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 3:49:48 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444
honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'


So, in the case of the US starting to catch up in an area where many think they should, isn't something to cheer about? Would I be correct, then, that you'll not cheer if China starts to impose environmental standards?

China is a third world country, you really want to compare the US to them? My point is the US fancies itself as a world leader.. maybe just in making money no matter what & at all costs? (like Monsanto, Haliburton, arms mfrs, chemical corps, drug corps, banksters, etc).. imo, you can't legislate morals, humanity, equality, doing the right thing.. you either have that as the core of your society or you dont..

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 4:41:44 PM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

It's a small step but at least we are headed in the right direction. And you have to keep in mind that some folks are too ignorant to understand that many liberals are against gay marriage and many conservatives are for it, so to them it's a chance to paint the other side as evil.


I don't often think you are right but when you are it is simple, straight forward and dead-bang bullet proof right.

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 4:43:28 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
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quote:

China is a third world country,


I think you might want to google just what "third world means" because china is not a third world country.

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 5:17:01 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		Its also a bald faced lie. In America there are now hundreds upon hundreds of places where a same sex couple can get married today.

England? Zero. France? Zero. Australia? Zero. Germany? Zero.


There are only 14 countries out of 180 that don't currently prohibit same sex marriage, and the US is among them. Another dozen or so nations are aggressively preparing to get ready to start looking into discussing emulating the US.

But thanks for once again pissing on news about other people's lives to relentlessly promote an agenda of bigotry and hatemongering.






quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'



_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 7:19:35 PM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline 		My post wasnt just about same sex marriage , it was about womens rights going backward and how the US is still in some states trying to make birth control and abortion, etc more difficult to get, its about not letting child rape victims that get pregnant get an abortion, etc.. its about men expecting their viagra paid by Obamacare/health plans but not wanting it to pay for womens birth control, & various other inequities.. its about those things that American female posters here have repeatedly stated they are against & how they have to keep fighting to hold on to those rights.. its also about how the poor are treated in this country & how difficult it is for them to get the help they need.. But I dont expect you to understand..

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Its also a bald faced lie. In America there are now hundreds upon hundreds of places where a same sex couple can get married today.

England? Zero. France? Zero. Australia? Zero. Germany? Zero.

There are only 14 countries out of 180 that don't currently prohibit same sex marriage, and the US is among them. Another dozen or so nations are aggressively preparing to get ready to start looking into discussing emulating the US.

But thanks for once again pissing on news about other people's lives to relentlessly promote an agenda of bigotry and hatemongering.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'





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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 7:40:16 PM   
njlauren


Posts: 1577
Joined: 10/1/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'



It's a small step but at least we are headed in the right direction. And you have to keep in mind that some folks are too ignorant to understand that many liberals are against gay marriage and many conservatives are for it, so to them it's a chance to paint the other side as evil. Sometimes a bigot has to take what he can get. Funny how they ignore the election in CA where the liberals showed up in increased numbers and shot down prop 8 while electing Obama. I guess they just don't like it when the facts prove them wrong. But it is really good news for Minnesota.



That would be a nice argument, if it is true. Most people who describe themselves as liberal favor same sex marriage and the conservatives who are for same sex marriage tend to be libertarian conservatives, which is not the dominant strain in the GOP (sorry, Rand Paul and his father are not libertarians, both of them support banning same sex marriage on religious grounds), the GOP of John Boehner, Mitch McConnel and most of the house is the tea party/religious right/wingnut conservative (Barry Goldwater despised them, and said, of gays "those assholes (the religious nutjobs) are telling me I should hate my own grandchild for being gay, that isn't conservative, that is just a moron (or something to that effect).

Everyone things of California as being a liberal state, but if you get outside LA and SF, there are large pockets of conservatives, and they voted in huge numbers in favor of prop 8. The swing voters were not particularly liberal, in a sense Obama helped get it passed, because blacks voted in huge numbers and thanks to the black churches, they voted a large majority in favor of proposition 8...so arguing liberals are against same sex marriage and conservatives are for it has a big caveat, prob the same percentage of liberals are against same sex marriage as there are conservatives for it, and it is a small percentage.

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 7:47:43 PM   
njlauren


Posts: 1577
Joined: 10/1/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Its also a bald faced lie. In America there are now hundreds upon hundreds of places where a same sex couple can get married today.

England? Zero. France? Zero. Australia? Zero. Germany? Zero.


There are only 14 countries out of 180 that don't currently prohibit same sex marriage, and the US is among them. Another dozen or so nations are aggressively preparing to get ready to start looking into discussing emulating the US.

But thanks for once again pissing on news about other people's lives to relentlessly promote an agenda of bigotry and hatemongering.

Hundreds and hundreds of places? If you mean within the 14 states, sure, but that doesn't mean the US grants same sex marriage either, since as of this writing, no federal benefits are available to same sex couples, and if married in one state, it has no meaning in the 36 that don't allow it. Unless the US as a country uniformly allows it. I believe France just passed it, I believe England has full rights for same sex couples in its civic unions, and even countries like Spain and Mexico allow same sex couples to wed, as does South Africa and several scandinavian countries. We proclaim ourselves the land of the free and home of the brave, and it is shameful we let religious belief trump rights, in that regards, we aren't all that much better than Iran, unfortunately, the US is a very religious country, and sadly in the wrong way, instead of it being in the rights of the weak and powerless, it seems to be more in using religion as a weapon to hit others over the head. The US should have been leading the way, not in the thralls of a political party catering to people who are no different than the mullahs who run Iran, the GOP should rename itself to Hezbollah, literally "party of God", cause that is what they are. Without something like the Loving decision, we cannot say the US allows same sex marriage, and just keep in mind, it wasn't long ago that there was a major effort to write a same sex marriage ban into the constitution, not something to be proud of, it is still a plank in the GOP platform.






quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'




(in reply to Powergamz1)
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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:00:42 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline 		FR



We're gonna make it, after all!


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it's never enough to keep up.

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INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:12:25 PM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
Joined: 8/29/2011
From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
Status: offline 		I'm against "same sex marriage" but I strongly favor "same sex civil unions".

Sorry, there's a part of me that says that marriage is between a man and a woman and a part of me that says that everyone has a right to be treated equally. Therefore, I strongly support the government recognizing same sex couples that enter into some kind of legal union.

However, I do not favor couples being given advantages over single people. If we're going to argue 14th amendment and shit, let's do it right.

Why do married couples get tax breaks? That doesn't sound like equal treatment to me.

Why can only married couples enjoy survivor benefits?

Why can only "spouses" visit certain people in the hospital?

What gives?

I don't believe in "gay rights", "womens' rights", or "minority rights" of any kind. I believe in EQUAL rights.



Peace and comfort,



Michael

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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:16:06 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		You can 'believe'' anything you want. That doesn't make it true.


quote:

ORIGINAL: njlauren


quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Its also a bald faced lie. In America there are now hundreds upon hundreds of places where a same sex couple can get married today.

England? Zero. France? Zero. Australia? Zero. Germany? Zero.


There are only 14 countries out of 180 that don't currently prohibit same sex marriage, and the US is among them. Another dozen or so nations are aggressively preparing to get ready to start looking into discussing emulating the US.

But thanks for once again pissing on news about other people's lives to relentlessly promote an agenda of bigotry and hatemongering.

Hundreds and hundreds of places? If you mean within the 14 states, sure, but that doesn't mean the US grants same sex marriage either, since as of this writing, no federal benefits are available to same sex couples, and if married in one state, it has no meaning in the 36 that don't allow it. Unless the US as a country uniformly allows it. I believe France just passed it, I believe England has full rights for same sex couples in its civic unions, and even countries like Spain and Mexico allow same sex couples to wed, as does South Africa and several scandinavian countries. We proclaim ourselves the land of the free and home of the brave, and it is shameful we let religious belief trump rights, in that regards, we aren't all that much better than Iran, unfortunately, the US is a very religious country, and sadly in the wrong way, instead of it being in the rights of the weak and powerless, it seems to be more in using religion as a weapon to hit others over the head. The US should have been leading the way, not in the thralls of a political party catering to people who are no different than the mullahs who run Iran, the GOP should rename itself to Hezbollah, literally "party of God", cause that is what they are. Without something like the Loving decision, we cannot say the US allows same sex marriage, and just keep in mind, it wasn't long ago that there was a major effort to write a same sex marriage ban into the constitution, not something to be proud of, it is still a plank in the GOP platform.






quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

honestly? the fact that the US is several decades behind (other countries) is not much to cheer about.. imo.. not to mention that a change in state/federal govt can reverse such "victories".. your political system sucks.. just sayin'







_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to njlauren)
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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:18:36 PM   
Powergamz1


Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline 		Equal rights, and 'separate but unequal' citizenship, is an oxymoron.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I'm against "same sex marriage" but I strongly favor "same sex civil unions".

Sorry, there's a part of me that says that marriage is between a man and a woman and a part of me that says that everyone has a right to be treated equally. Therefore, I strongly support the government recognizing same sex couples that enter into some kind of legal union.

However, I do not favor couples being given advantages over single people. If we're going to argue 14th amendment and shit, let's do it right.

Why do married couples get tax breaks? That doesn't sound like equal treatment to me.

Why can only married couples enjoy survivor benefits?

Why can only "spouses" visit certain people in the hospital?

What gives?

I don't believe in "gay rights", "womens' rights", or "minority rights" of any kind. I believe in EQUAL rights.



Peace and comfort,



Michael



_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to DaddySatyr)
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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:18:36 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I'm against "same sex marriage" but I strongly favor "same sex civil unions".





Except if you define it differently, the participants in such unions are going to be treated differently. It's equal protection under the law, all or nothing, and nothing ain't an acceptable solution.



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That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 8:38:50 PM   
ThatDaveGuy69


Posts: 978
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		It has always been in the best interest of the State to promote marriages that result in children. (How else will We be able to defeat Them?) Toward that end, a married couple is allowed some sort of tax benefit on the theory that they will reproduce, thus growing the population. At least that's how it works in the US. Is it right to sanction one lifestyle over another (legally bound in marriage vs merely living together)? Fuck if I know, but the gubmint been doin' it dat way fo' a long-damn time. IMHO, all the legal benefits should be afforded any 2 consenting adults who wish to be legally united. Along with all the hassles of divorce should their love cool. (Not gonna get into poly here - nope, not gonna do it.)

As far as "traditional" marriage, this is almost always code for "that's what is says in the buybull". Which is nice for those who've never actually read the book. If we took that as the template for marriage then I want a couple dozen wives (so long as I get to pick them) along with some concubines. And throw in a handful of slaves while you're at it. And let's make it OK for me to kill a wife if she doesn't bare me a male child to carry on the family name and be heir to my estate. How far down the rabbtt hole are the right wing-nut jobs willing to go with "traditional (buybull-based) marriage?



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RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 9:10:27 PM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
Joined: 8/29/2011
From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I'm against "same sex marriage" but I strongly favor "same sex civil unions".





Except if you define it differently, the participants in such unions are going to be treated differently. It's equal protection under the law, all or nothing, and nothing ain't an acceptable solution.




Not exactly. I see "marriage" as the pervue of religion and "civil unions" as the pervue of the government.

My way, religions won't eventually be forced into doing something they don't want to do. Both will enjoy the same protections.

I need to add to this.

My way, a couple, going to a church and getting married would generate a certificate of marriage and a certificate of civil union.

A couple who ... say practices a religion that doesn't allow same-sex marriage could just go to a JP and generate a civil union certificate.

The government would have no authority over marriage; only over civil unions.

I hope I made that a bit more clear.



Peace and comfort,



Michael

< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 5/14/2013 9:22:49 PM >

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A Stone in My Shoe

Screen captures (and pissing on shadows) still RULE! Ya feel me?

"For that which I love, I will do horrible things"

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Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Another Progressive Victory! - 5/14/2013 9:27:46 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


Not exactly.



Well, then I guess we are stuck at just offering an affirmation that conservatives aren't in monolithic lockstep on the issue, and leave it there.



_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to DaddySatyr)
Profile   Post #: 20
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