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RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 6/30/2013 8:23:37 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I dont see where the cops did anything wrong. If a cop suspects someone of committing a crime, do they let them drive off? Of course not.


Today, one of us is dense, and I suspect it is me.

Chalk this one up to frost addled brains for us northern folk?

IWYW,
— Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 6/30/2013 8:25:21 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		LOL.. no, you are far from what I would ever describe as dense. The cops handled it badly, even I can see that. But saying they did something wrong.. I cant go that far.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 22
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 6/30/2013 8:33:36 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

LOL.. no, you are far from what I would ever describe as dense. The cops handled it badly, even I can see that. But saying they did something wrong.. I cant go that far.


Ah. I misunderstood. Thanks for clarifying.

Take it as an indication of the standards we hold law enforcement to where I live that it might've cost them their badge.

The LEOs would have been investigated, but the charges would have been dropped on the facts in evidence. Though, they might still have lost their job over it, a matter of standards in how well police must handle different situations, and particularly undercover police. The girls wouldn't have been charged with anything, nor taken into remand or custody.

We just draw the line between "badly handled" and "wrong" in different places.

IWYW,
— Aswad.



_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 6/30/2013 8:39:45 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline 		According to the State Prosecutor that dropped all charges but the assault on an officer, everything the Agents did was not within procedural guidelines.

As for the assault on an officer, his hands are pretty much tied by state statutes.

There was another incident of a similar nature in North Carolina in April of this year.

It would seem both states have the same training personnel.

As for Elizabeth Daly, it seems that while initially held on Alcohol related charges, which the state prosecutor dropped, the VA ABC office is saying that she was never held on those charges, just fleeing from law enforcement officers and assault on two officers.

Also, contrary to the many civilian witness statements, the ABC spokeswoman insists that the first officer Identified herself, showed her badge, etc. and that the other agents did not get involved until after the subject failed to respond.

All charges have since been dropped.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 6/30/2013 8:55:18 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		The one girl, the driver, was charged, not with possession of alcohol, but with the attempt to cause bodily injury to the officers. Her own actions caused her to be charged. The charges were dropped, but even the DA stated the charging was the right thing to do pending an investigation.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 25
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 5:58:01 AM   
defiantbadgirl


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Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

they were not city or county police officers, they were North Carolina BTAF agents.



Since they aren't city or county police officers, I think it's safe to assume they weren't carrying police or sheriff badges. That explains why the badges were unidentifiable.


_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 6:15:46 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		They werent even NC....

Virginia Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control

Their badge...



Virginia Police Badge







_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 6:30:25 AM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Her own actions caused her to be charged.


No, the agents that aren't even police (that means no badge that says police) are to blame for the girls fleeing. Even if the agent that showed the badge was close enough for the girls to read the tiny print, they weren't even from the right state. Wearing street clothes. No police badges. A gun. Jumping on the hood of the vehicle. Trying to break the windows out to get to them. The girls dialed 911 to report the attack to police. Yes, ignorance is an excuse if people are attacked and escape because they feel their life is in danger. Feeling that ones life is in danger is even considered an acceptable reason for killing someone.

< Message edited by defiantbadgirl -- 7/1/2013 6:39:02 AM >

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 6:32:29 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		The ABC Bureau of Law Enforcement is charged with enforcing the alcoholic beverage control laws and regulations in the commonwealth. ABC special agents are sworn and certified police officers, vested with statewide authority of arrest for ABC violations as well as any other Virginia criminal law violation.

http://www.abc.virginia.gov/enforce/enforce.htm

Might want to rethink that.


_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 7:03:50 AM   
GotSteel


Posts: 5871
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad
I did. I can only reiterate that I'm glad I don't live over there.


It was a real shocker to me when I started travelling abroad and found out that the police being giant assholes was not a universal phenomenon.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 7:45:23 AM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		This isnt as bad as the one in SF. Drunk off duty cops beat a guy up because he wont give them.his bag of takeout they want to steal. Poor guy gets arrested for resisting arrest of course, typical cop bullshit. Turns into big scandal, ccitizens video saved the guy and the drunk.pig turned out to be police chiefs kid and after the typical cop coverup, both get fired. Year later dad and son beat up another guy.

And people wonder why some of us want to own guns...

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 3:04:52 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		~FR~

I wonder what kind of training the ABC agents get. I mean even Barney Fyffe had a badge, right? Also, it should be credentials that people need to look at, and not just badges.

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RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 3:47:15 PM   
eulero83


Posts: 1470
Joined: 11/4/2005
Status: offline 		there's a thing I don't understand, and it's probably due to cultural differences, is it such a big deal if the girl that may or may be not underage bought a box that could or could not be beer? I mean was not enough take the plate number and send her home a fine for flying a ABC grocery bag's check, or if it's in the usa you can't post a ticket have her stopped by a regular police car?
I mean it's not they suspected she had a gun or to illegally trade in alchol, it was an unopened pack of beer... was it necessary to jump on her car show a gun and try to break the car's window?
To me they look like wannabe super cops that were frustrated because they spent most of the time checking kid's grocery instead dealing with what they think is real crime.

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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 3:54:39 PM   
eulero83


Posts: 1470
Joined: 11/4/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

~FR~

I wonder what kind of training the ABC agents get. I mean even Barney Fyffe had a badge, right? Also, it should be credentials that people need to look at, and not just badges.


It's not that someone needs special training to understand if you approach in plain clothes a teenager girl in a parking lot during night jumping on her car with a gun in your hand she will shit a brick and panic.
By the way the badge is different in shape and color by the one the police use so it could have looked fake to her.

< Message edited by eulero83 -- 7/1/2013 3:56:32 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 4:43:15 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83

there's a thing I don't understand, and it's probably due to cultural differences, is it such a big deal if the girl that may or may be not underage bought a box that could or could not be beer? I mean was not enough take the plate number and send her home a fine for flying a ABC grocery bag's check, or if it's in the usa you can't post a ticket have her stopped by a regular police car?
I mean it's not they suspected she had a gun or to illegally trade in alchol, it was an unopened pack of beer... was it necessary to jump on her car show a gun and try to break the car's window?
To me they look like wannabe super cops that were frustrated because they spent most of the time checking kid's grocery instead dealing with what they think is real crime.


Its illegal to sell alcohol to a minor.

http://www.virginiarules.org/virginia-rules/alcohol-tobacco

ABC is Alcoholic Beverage Control... not a store named ABC.

Its not cultural differences, its the differences between legal systems.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to eulero83)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 5:06:38 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

The girl never should've been arrested. I don't understand why the agents aren't in trouble for their conduct.

All agents must show their Nazi bone fides. If not sufficient, they are moved off the street. None will likely ever be arrested again.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 5:24:36 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Why would one jump on the car or try to break the windows, anyway?

If they were worried the girls were gonna drive off, either of those actions would be a bad idea.

IWYW,
— Aswad.


"I couldn't put my windows down unless I started my car, and when I started my car they began yelling to not move the car, not to start the car. They began trying to break the windows. My roommates and I were ... terrified," Daly stated.

I dont see where the cops did anything wrong. If a cop suspects someone of committing a crime, do they let them drive off? Of course not.





Interesting though how there was no crime. Also, society is supposed to be 'happy' that the charges were dropped after there was no basis for any original charges against the women. I wonder if they could have just gone ahead and shot the car up.

Probably, they could have said they thought they saw a gun. See how easy it is ? Ya'know, in America...shoot first and ask questions later.

We cower before the troops already.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 5:27:52 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		I would love to see a video of the scene.... Im curious how many were laughing... until this poor misunderstood teen grazed a few cops.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to MrRodgers)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 6:22:25 PM   
eulero83


Posts: 1470
Joined: 11/4/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83

there's a thing I don't understand, and it's probably due to cultural differences, is it such a big deal if the girl that may or may be not underage bought a box that could or could not be beer? I mean was not enough take the plate number and send her home a fine for flying a ABC grocery bag's check, or if it's in the usa you can't post a ticket have her stopped by a regular police car?
I mean it's not they suspected she had a gun or to illegally trade in alchol, it was an unopened pack of beer... was it necessary to jump on her car show a gun and try to break the car's window?
To me they look like wannabe super cops that were frustrated because they spent most of the time checking kid's grocery instead dealing with what they think is real crime.


Its illegal to sell alcohol to a minor.

http://www.virginiarules.org/virginia-rules/alcohol-tobacco

ABC is Alcoholic Beverage Control... not a store named ABC.

Its not cultural differences, its the differences between legal systems.


sorry for my bad english I meant a "grocery bag's check" imposed by ABC officers I understood that part, it's illegal to sell alchool to minors even here (the age is 18 by the way), but it's an administrative crime, I see from your link it's a penal crime in virginia.
What I considered as cultural differences was that enforce with the thread of weapons a minor offence, and where it's easy to identify the person as a car has a plate number, is way over common sense.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: psycho agents terrify college students - 7/1/2013 6:27:09 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Attempting to avoid arrest is a bigger crime. These officers are on campuses... these are sorority girls... Its a college town... these kids go back to college.. not where the cars are registered.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to eulero83)
Profile   Post #: 40
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