RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (Full Version)

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vincentML -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 8:09:05 AM)

FR

Modern Ruins of Abandoned Detroit (PHOTOS)

"But there is a haunting beauty to the decaying ruins of a post-industrial city such as Detroit, which has become the largest American city to file for bankruptcy. And this is what photographers Yves Marchand and Romain Meffre captured in their series "The Ruins of Detroit" (Steidl, 2011). In the images above, Marchand and Meffre document a city's disintegration, showcasing structures that were formerly a source of civic pride." [SNIP]

"You could find all the archetypal buildings of an American city in a state of abandonment, like an American Pompeii. We knew we would probably never have the opportunity to photograph such a powerful place anywhere else."




Moonhead -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 9:23:50 AM)

Hang on, didn't New York file for bankruptcy under the Ford Presidency? That's a bigger city than Detroit.




vincentML -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 9:43:51 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Hang on, didn't New York file for bankruptcy under the Ford Presidency? That's a bigger city than Detroit.

NO




Real0ne -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 12:26:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

cities and states and nations are "corporations" no different than any other corporation. well they are different, we worship them and they get away with forcing their services upon you at the end of a barrel of a gun and if you disagree they will bankrupt you and take away all your shit in the process

No Detroit and cities are not a business corporation. Private (and publicly traded) for-profit corporations have a fiduciary responsibility to pay as little as possible, employ as few as possible have no retirement or benefit funding problems.

If Detroit was in fact business corporation charged with maximizing profit, it would have either shrunk to possibly less than 100,000 long ago or lead the country in starvation.

As it is. with NAFTA and most favored nation regime with China, metropolitan Detroit saw the exportation of some 2-3 million auto industry jobs abolishing a no longer needed 2-3 million jobs they created.

Let's take the govt. jobs out of the metro Wash., DC area, let's take wall street, advertising and high fashion not to mention the lawyers and business headquarters., out of NY and let's take the oil business and the jobs it creates out of Houston and Dallas and then the 271 hotel casinos out Vegas and see what happens to those cities.




first thing that pops up when I search for city muni corps





Home > For Everyone > Government > Welfare > Housing > Missouri Laws 99.080 - Authority to constitute municipal corporation--powers--profits--profits to be applied, ...
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Missouri Laws 99.080 - Authority to constitute municipal corporation--powers--profits--profits to be applied, ...
Missouri Laws > Title VII > Chapter 99 > § 99.080 - Authority to constitute municipal corporation--powers--profits--profits to be applied, how--agents of authority, restrictions

Current as of: 2009
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99.080. 1. An authority shall constitute a municipal corporation, exercising public and essential governmental functions, and having all the powers necessary or convenient to carry out and effectuate the purposes and provisions of sections 99.010 to 99.230, including the following powers in addition to others herein granted:

(1) To sue and be sued; to have a seal and to alter the same at pleasure; to have perpetual succession; to make and execute contracts and other instruments necessary or convenient to the exercise of the powers of the authority; and to make and from time to time amend and repeal bylaws, rules and regulations, not inconsistent with sections 99.010 to 99.230, to carry into effect the powers and purposes of the authority; love the language, did you do a double take?

(2) Within its area of operation: To prepare, carry out, acquire, lease and operate housing projects; to provide for the construction, reconstruction, improvement, alteration or repair of any housing project or any part thereof; except that, when the authority shall lie within an unincorporated area of a first class county having a charter form of government and that unincorporated area is bordered by a city or cities of the third class which may provide services to that authority, the city or cities shall give its approval before said construction, reconstruction, improvement, alteration or repair takes place;

(3) To arrange or contract for the furnishing by any person or agency, public or private, of services, privileges, works, or facilities for, or in connection with, a housing project or the occupants thereof; and (notwithstanding anything to the contrary contained in sections 99.010 to 99.230 or any other provision of law) to include in any contract let in connection with a project, stipulations requiring that the contractor and any subcontractors comply with requirements as to minimum wages and maximum hours of labor, and comply with any conditions which the federal government may have attached to its financial aid of the project;

(4) To lease or rent any dwellings, houses, accommodations, lands, buildings, structures or facilities embraced in any housing project and (subject to the limitations contained in sections 99.010 to 99.230) to establish and revise the rents or charges therefor; to own, hold, and improve real or personal property; to purchase, lease, obtain options upon, acquire by gift, grant, bequest, devise, or otherwise any real or personal property or any interest therein; to acquire by the exercise of the power of eminent domain any real property in fee simple or other estate; to sell, lease, exchange, transfer, assign, pledge, or dispose of any real or personal property or any interest therein; to insure or provide for the insurance of any real or personal property or operations of the authority against any risks or hazards; to procure or agree to the procurement of insurance or guarantees from the federal government of the payment of any bonds that they obtained by putting up YOUR PROPERTY AS COLLATERAL or parts thereof issued by an authority, including the power to pay premiums on any such insurance; to allocate federal or state tax credits or other economic benefits or inducements allocated to an authority;
Sounds just like the king of england to me
quote:


The ideal King of the english common- law represents the power and majesty of the whole community. His fiat makes laws2. His sentence condemns. His judgments give property, and take it away. He is the state'. It is true, that in the exercise of these powers, the real King, to whom they are necessarily entrusted, is advised, directed, and controlled by others.

But in the contemplation of law the sovereignty and undivided power of the state are in the King. [in america the sovereignty is in the hands of the henchmen, hence you did NOT get to vote on the construction of this country or its rico pyramid scam legal system (as proven by Professor Fine), THEY DID!]

' Attorney-General's Speech in Hardy's Trial. Howell's State Trials, xxiv. 246.




(5) To invest any funds held in reserves or sinking funds, or any funds not required for immediate disbursement, in property or securities in which savings banks may legally invest funds subject to their control; to purchase its bonds at a price not more than the principal amount thereof and accrued interest, all bonds so purchased to be canceled;

looks pretty profitable to me
they securitize everything YOU own to THEIR benefit


(6) Within its area of operation: To investigate into living, dwelling and housing conditions and into the means and methods of improving such conditions; to determine where blighted areas exist or where there is a shortage of decent, safe and sanitary dwelling accommodations for persons of very low, lower and moderate income; to make studies and recommendations relating to the problem of clearing, replanning and reconstructing of blighted areas, and the problem of providing dwelling accommodations for persons of very low, lower and moderate income, and to cooperate with the city, the county, the state or any political subdivision thereof in action taken in connection with such problems; and to engage in research, studies and experimentation on the subject of housing;

(7) Acting through one or more commissioners or other person or persons designated by the authority: To conduct examinations and investigations and to hear testimony and take proof under oath at public or private hearings on any matter material for its information; to administer oaths, issue subpoenas requiring the attendance of witnesses or the production of books and papers and to issue commissions for the examination of witnesses who are outside of the state or unable to attend before the authority, or excused from attendance; to make available to appropriate agencies (including those charged with the duty of abating or requiring the correction of nuisances or like conditions, or of demolishing unsafe or unsanitary structures within its area of operation) its findings and recommendations with regard to any building or property where conditions exist which are dangerous to the public health, morals, safety or welfare;

(8) To contract with private owners to manage, lease and operate any rental, cooperative or condominium housing project within its area of operation and to act as management agent for any such project for a management fee;

(a) The persons and families who occupy the housing project shall be very low, lower or moderate income persons as defined in sections 99.010 to 99.230;

(b) Any profit derived by housing authorities from such management fees should be applied to the development, improvement or maintenance of housing projects in the following manner: no less than fifty percent of said profits shall be applied toward improving, developing or maintaining housing units that are occupied by or will be occupied by persons of very low income; the remaining profits shall be applied toward improving, developing or maintaining housing units that are occupied by, or will be occupied by persons of low income; GROWTH

(9) To loan the proceeds of its bonds and notes to provide for the purchase, construction, extension and improvement of any housing project;MORE GROWTH

(10) To exercise all powers or parts or combination of powers necessary, convenient or appropriate to undertake and carry out housing projects and all the powers herein granted. [MORALS TO INSURE YOU ARE A NICE MORAL PERSON AND EXERCIZE THEIR RELIGION.

Thats right they do not give a fuck who you WORSHIP, as long as you EXERCISE THEIR RELIGION


2. No provision of law with respect to the acquisition, operation or disposition of property by other public bodies shall be applicable to an authority unless the law shall specifically so state. Of course that is another government PERK since that does not apply to you, you know PRESUMED innocent

3. An authority may exercise any and all of the powers conferred upon it by this section, [WITHOUT INDICTMENT, WITHOUT FIRST BEING TRIED] either generally or with respect to any specific activity or activities, through or by any agent which it may designate including any corporation or corporations formed under the laws of this state and for such purposes, an authority may cause one or more corporations to be formed under the laws of this state, provided, however, that no employee of any housing authority or publicly elected official shall receive, directly or indirectly, any compensation [DOESNT INCLUDE DIVIDENDS] therefrom other than their salary as such an employee or publicly elected official and that all profits from such corporations and agents shall be distributed in the following manner: not less than seventy percent of said profits shall be applied, in such manner as the housing authority shall determine, toward improving, developing or maintaining housing units that are occupied by, or will be occupied by persons of very low or lower income; not more than thirty percent of said profits shall be applied in such manner as the housing authority shall determine; and if such corporation or agent is involved in managing, developing or purchasing a housing project, at least twenty percent of the units of said project shall be reserved for very low or low income. The distribution of project units reserved for persons of very low and lower income by size shall be proportional to the distribution of units by size for the entire housing project.

(RSMo 1939 § 7860, A.L. 1978 H.B. 1155, A.L. 1986 S.B. 767, A.L. 1988 H.B. 1105)




So there you have it, looks so innocent and this alone presumes authority over literally everything and wipes out every right you could dream up putting them under state authority!

Now I just grabbed the first one that popped up.



theen there is that:

An office of profit is a term used in a number of national constitutions to refer to executive appointments. A number of countries forbid members of the legislature from accepting an office of profit under the executive as a means to secure the independence of the legislature and preserve the separation of powers.


quote:

Note that the U.S. Constitution does not define the term "office of profit". In fact, that term is not even used in the above-mentioned provision. However, the term "office of profit" is referred to in three other provisions.

First, only a person holding an office of honor, an office of trust, or an office of profit, is subject to impeachment and removal from office. Specifically, Article I, Section 3, Clause 7 provides:

"Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law."

Second, a person holding an office of trust, or an office of profit, is prohibited from receiving presents, emoluments, offices, or titles from foreign powers. Specifically, Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 provides:

"No Title of Nobility shall be granted by the United States: And no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under them, shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince or foreign State."

Third, a person holding an office of trust, or an office of profit, is prohibited from serving as a presidential elector. Specifically, Article II, Section 1, Clause 2 provides:

"Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector."




and how easy is it to get around that simple shit? LMAO


Now that is the first link that popped up, I never seen the shit from Misery in my life before but I believe no one needs to be a rocket scientist to see that the housing authority of Misery enforces the states right to enforce THEIR MORALS upon everyone indiscriminately in accord with overlord rule. Isnt equality wonderful?



So I sorta disagree wit ya. Most of them are incorporated in deleware.

They created their own government community in which you have very limited power, just like the Janitor working for any major corporation, has not fucking power but to OBEY while others make all the rules.

Now if you wanted to argue that People, which means community, is those of the government, natives, aboriginees et al not with standing, I agree. However everyone else is dragged along because government is FORCE at the end of a barrel of a gun and they show steady growth.

Resistance is futile.

The meaning of this is that the system is BY design created to suck all wealth upward by unequal power under the law as we see in detroit and its the same everywhere else, just the shit did not hit the fan yet.








tj444 -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 3:42:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
The problem isn't necessarily collecting the taxes owed, it's the crash in values.
There are tens of thousands of homes that used to be taxed based on a value of 100K to 150K or more that are now being taxed based on a value of 10K or less.
It's not that they can't collect what they're owed so much as that they are only owed 5-10% of what they used to get.
If you have a business making widgets and are selling them for $100-150 each and the market crashes so you can now only get $5-10, you're truly fucked.
Similar situation.

Thats not really how it works.. the city just raises the rate as the values drop.. they still need the same tax to run the city so thats what they tend to do.. lets see what Zillow shows..
House listed in Detroit for listed price of $500.. Property tax value $16,346 in 2012.. Property taxes $2,368.. thats like about 1/5th of the value every year in property taxes???.. how crazy is that? [8|]
where I am you would pay that amount of tax for a property assessed at about $80k or so..
http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/9361-Appoline-St-Detroit-MI-48228/88331747_zpid/




Yachtie -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 3:45:12 PM)

without comment -

[image]http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2013/07/20130710_santelli.jpg[/image]




DaddySatyr -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 3:50:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

FR

Modern Ruins of Abandoned Detroit (PHOTOS)



Re: photo 21:

I'd have abandoned that shit, too! It looks like it's about to fall on some poor schlub's head!

I think it's pretty evident - given the amount of money owed to the pension plans - that mis-management plays a large part in this situation but, where does unemployment come into play?

A city that was so relient on an industry that has been given away to foreign countries canNOT be expected to have survived.



Justice was served in Florida,



Michael




cloudboy -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 9:30:17 PM)


Cities and businesses usually do well after a fiscal restructuring. NYC was once in bad shape, now it is booming. The big question is how a bankruptcy judge will rule on the cities pension commitments.

Currently, 38 cents of every city dollar goes toward debt repayment, legacy costs and other obligations.






thishereboi -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 10:27:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

Well... Let's say it won't be Government...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hhJ_49leBw


Well that was depressing but I agree with a lot of it. One of the biggest problems they are having with the abandoned houses is that kids have to walk by them on their way to school. It's a sad situation and hopefully they will find a way to pull out.

On a side note, if I am not mistaken the only two decent looking buildings in the intro were the Ford building and the mosque and I am pretty sure they are both in Dearborn, not Detroit. The big grey building with all the missing windows has been like that for as long as I can remember. I could never understand why someone didn't eventually tear it down and I still don't. What a fucking mess. [:(]




tj444 -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 10:43:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
The big grey building with all the missing windows has been like that for as long as I can remember. I could never understand why someone didn't eventually tear it down and I still don't. What a fucking mess. [:(]

it costs money.. here in Houston it costs the city at least $10k to bulldoze a modest sized house.. and if Detroit has 70,000 abandoned buildings.. well... you do the math..




thishereboi -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/20/2013 11:47:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
The big grey building with all the missing windows has been like that for as long as I can remember. I could never understand why someone didn't eventually tear it down and I still don't. What a fucking mess. [:(]

it costs money.. here in Houston it costs the city at least $10k to bulldoze a modest sized house.. and if Detroit has 70,000 abandoned buildings.. well... you do the math..


I understand that but we are talking about 30-35 years now. I'm surprised it hasn't fallen down on its own. But I agree it would cost a small fortune to clean it up now. There are areas that were never cleaned up after the riots and that was in the 60's. Lately it seems they are growing. I was at my friends house tonight and hers is the only house left on her side of the street with someone still living there. Most of the houses are like the ones in the video on the first page of posts. She used to be the second house on the right, but the first house is a lot now. It took about 4 years from the time they left for it to get ripped apart. By the time whoever owned it had it dozed away, there wasn't much left. Now it's 5 foot high weeds and a handy dumping site.




tj444 -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 12:57:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

I understand that but we are talking about 30-35 years now. I'm surprised it hasn't fallen down on its own. But I agree it would cost a small fortune to clean it up now. There are areas that were never cleaned up after the riots and that was in the 60's. Lately it seems they are growing. I was at my friends house tonight and hers is the only house left on her side of the street with someone still living there. Most of the houses are like the ones in the video on the first page of posts. She used to be the second house on the right, but the first house is a lot now. It took about 4 years from the time they left for it to get ripped apart. By the time whoever owned it had it dozed away, there wasn't much left. Now it's 5 foot high weeds and a handy dumping site.

It takes a Mayor that makes it important to do, one of the priorities.. and when a city is losing people, businesses, tax paying properties every day.. its hard to justify spending the money.. and going back 30 years.. it means the Mayors that went thru did not see that as important to do, that is a very bad attitude for a Mayor to have imo.. but to have a demo program, you need strong management in govt.. which has obviously been badly lacking in Detroit.. which is one reason why the city has been declining and now bankrupt.
The Mayor(s) here in Houston have that determination and people can call the city and report dangerous buildings so the city can start legal action against the owner and in due course it will be either cleaned up or demolished.. A property owner here must even keep his lot tidy and mowed, no garbage, etc or same thing.. cited and if the city has to clean it the owner gets the bill..

"In the past three years, the City of Houston has demolished more than 1,000 blighted abandoned homes and 1,120 apartment/condominium units"
"We not only set an aggressive goal, we achieved it in record time," said Mayor Parker. "Although our resources are limited, I won't stop until we eliminate all of the dangerous, abandoned buildings threatening our safety, economy and quality of life. Now it’s on to the next dirty half-dozen."
Located in the Sunnyside neighborhood, the decaying 31 year-old Aries Motel has sat vacant for three years. The property has been a magnet for crime that threatened the health and well-being of local families.
"I want to thank the Mayor for all that she has done," added Pastor James Nash of the nearby Greater Saint Paul Missionary Baptist Church. "She is familiar with this area and has been working with us for years. This blighted motel had shootings, drugs and prostitution. This is a great day for Sunnyside and all of Houston."


http://www.houstontx.gov/mayor/press/20130124.html




vincentML -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 9:44:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Cities and businesses usually do well after a fiscal restructuring. NYC was once in bad shape, now it is booming. The big question is how a bankruptcy judge will rule on the cities pension commitments.


NYC never went into bankruptcy and it had a potentially vibrant financial industry as the 1980s dawned.




DaddySatyr -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 9:49:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Cities and businesses usually do well after a fiscal restructuring. NYC was once in bad shape, now it is booming. The big question is how a bankruptcy judge will rule on the cities pension commitments.



NYC never went into bankruptcy and it had a potentially vibrant financial industry as the 1980s dawned.



NYC never actually filed the papers but they were in deep shit, financially. Of course, they were the recipient of a HUGE bail-out from the federal gov't.

Chrysler got a similar bail-out at about the same time and Iacoca and Hizoner had a friendly little wager as to which would pay off their loan quicker. NYC won.

Your point about NYC's financial hopes is well taken, though. There are so many industries in NYC that it was fairly "easy" to chose where to put economic recovery efforts. While I'm sure that Detroit has more than just the car industry (and its peripherals), how big a percentage are the other industries? I'd wager they're not more than 10-15% (or weren't, when the bottom really fell out).



Buy American,



Michael




thishereboi -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 10:57:05 AM)

Yes, a good mayor would have made a big difference. I think the current one is the best that I can think of, but honestly that is not saying much.




Arturas -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 1:05:26 PM)

who is John Galt?




Real0ne -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/21/2013 3:04:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
The big grey building with all the missing windows has been like that for as long as I can remember. I could never understand why someone didn't eventually tear it down and I still don't. What a fucking mess. [:(]

it costs money.. here in Houston it costs the city at least $10k to bulldoze a modest sized house.. and if Detroit has 70,000 abandoned buildings.. well... you do the math..



are you jammin me?

I am already packed!




papassion -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/22/2013 12:35:18 PM)

All this talk about Detroit going bankrupt has to be bullshit! I distinctly remember Obama using a ton of taxpayer money and going on TV declaring how "I saved Detroit!" in his ads. Did you miss it? It was in all the papers and on TV! (sarcasm)

Get ready for Chicago to go belly up! Teachers highest paid in the nation at up to $110,000. retiring at 80 to 90% of salary! Piss poor graduation rates, Humongous pension shortfall for public sector workers. Horrendous crime stats, highest sales tax in the nation,

Can't blame the Republicans for any of it. there isn't ANY Republican in office! More Democrat policies and ideas In action!




thishereboi -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/22/2013 4:37:44 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

who is John Galt?


Is your google broken?




Politesub53 -> RE: Detroit declares bantruptcy. (7/22/2013 4:54:45 PM)

quote:

quote: Realone


The ideal King of the english common- law represents the power and majesty of the whole community. His fiat makes laws2. His sentence condemns. His judgments give property, and take it away. He is the state'. It is true, that in the exercise of these powers, the real King, to whom they are necessarily entrusted, is advised, directed, and controlled by others.

But in the contemplation of law the sovereignty and undivided power of the state are in the King. [in america the sovereignty is in the hands of the henchmen, hence you did NOT get to vote on the construction of this country or its rico pyramid scam legal system (as proven by Professor Fine), THEY DID!]

' Attorney-General's Speech in Hardy's Trial. Howell's State Trials, xxiv. 246.


Got to point out your total lack of understanding as to what this means. It has nothing to do with the King and everything to do with the general population tjere atre no henchmen. The clue is in your own content.




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