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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 1:48:13 PM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

Does it take time to learn? Sure it does. Can you get a basic idea of what you like to eat and ideas on how to prepare a healthy version within a weeks time? Of course you can. This depends on your willpower and determination.

-

I submit that we may be saying the same thing differently.


And I submit that that is absolute nonsense, and is only applicable to people who already know how to do it.

Switching from frozen pizza, chicken pot pies, and tv-dinners, to making your own pizza dough, your own chicken pot pie, your own mashed potatoes, grilling your own steak, chicken, and fish, steaming your own vegetables, making your own granola, and learning how to do seasoning means going from spending 1 hour a week on food prep to 10 hours a week on food prep -if not more than that when you factor in researching and reading recipes. Doing that in the span of a week, especially when you factor in grocery shopping, is unrealistic. You're talking about learning either 21 recipes (if it isn't far more than that) in the span of a week, or switching to eating the same meal 5 times a week, weeks in a row.
Even an experienced home cook wouldn't try to learn 21 new recipes in a week, let alone somebody who doesn't even have the basics down.

You comparing it with kicking drinking is as bad a comparison as quitting smoking is, because you're comparing quitting something by cutting it out completely to learning to substitute a limited skill set and vast repertoire of items with a vast range of skill sets and another vast repertoire items.

Learning a handful or recipes a week is a realistic goal. As is relying on those recipes disproportionately heavy for a while. Switching from 5 minute meals to 30-90 minute meals overnight, while keeping a varied and non-boring diet that's within budget and satisfying physically and emotionally in the span of a week is not.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 3:01:21 PM   
MistressDarkArt


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaharThorne


I just got a $50 Walmart gift card from doing MyPoints program. It is how I get extra funds in the house. I'll see if I can find a yoga mat and DVD tomorrow after the doctor's office.


Check your local library before spending $$. That way you can try several styles free until you find what you like most.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 4:19:15 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline 		Checking the library first is a great suggestion!

Shar - I'm a yoga teacher and I recommend Rodney Yee's AM Yoga for beginners, people are not in great shape, and those who want a nice warm up before a more challenging workout. It's only 20 minutes, but is great for the lower back and the mind. It's under $14 on Amazon.

If this is all you are doing, you won't need a yoga mat if you have carpet.

Included is Patricia Walden's PM Yoga, which is somewhat more challenging, but still a beginner lesson.

I'd also be happy to vet titles from WalMart or the library.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 4:24:30 PM   
kalikshama


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quote:

I have to finish off what I got first. I don't believe in trashing food but using it up.


Try bartering it on craigslist for yoga gear :)

I don't like to trash food either. Last month, I wanted to lose a few pounds for a wedding and gave all the problem food to a downstairs neighbor.

When I was diagnosed with chemical sensitivities in '99, I had to make a complete lifestyle change. I don't remember what I did with the food - I may have composted it or given it away - but I did throw out a big box of cleaning products.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 4:26:17 PM   
kalikshama


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quote:

Frankly, I think most folks are going to find this post offensive.


I thought you made some very good points and the only part I found offensive was when you wanted to give Wonder Bread to the poor ducks

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 6:03:27 PM   
Gauge


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Joined: 6/17/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

Does it take time to learn? Sure it does. Can you get a basic idea of what you like to eat and ideas on how to prepare a healthy version within a weeks time? Of course you can. This depends on your willpower and determination.

-

I submit that we may be saying the same thing differently.


And I submit that that is absolute nonsense, and is only applicable to people who already know how to do it.

Switching from frozen pizza, chicken pot pies, and tv-dinners, to making your own pizza dough, your own chicken pot pie, your own mashed potatoes, grilling your own steak, chicken, and fish, steaming your own vegetables, making your own granola, and learning how to do seasoning means going from spending 1 hour a week on food prep to 10 hours a week on food prep -if not more than that when you factor in researching and reading recipes. Doing that in the span of a week, especially when you factor in grocery shopping, is unrealistic. You're talking about learning either 21 recipes (if it isn't far more than that) in the span of a week, or switching to eating the same meal 5 times a week, weeks in a row.
Even an experienced home cook wouldn't try to learn 21 new recipes in a week, let alone somebody who doesn't even have the basics down.

You comparing it with kicking drinking is as bad a comparison as quitting smoking is, because you're comparing quitting something by cutting it out completely to learning to substitute a limited skill set and vast repertoire of items with a vast range of skill sets and another vast repertoire items.

Learning a handful or recipes a week is a realistic goal. As is relying on those recipes disproportionately heavy for a while. Switching from 5 minute meals to 30-90 minute meals overnight, while keeping a varied and non-boring diet that's within budget and satisfying physically and emotionally in the span of a week is not.


It is not nonsense. While you are correct that no one is going to become a Michelin Star chef within a weeks time, you can learn basics in a week if you put your mind to it. Perfecting it is a different story but the basics? Take chicken thighs, put in oven pan, season with some herbs and salt and pepper, cook in oven for 1 hour at 375 degrees. Pretty complicated. Make salad, take different greens and put them together in bowl, dress and serve. Or hey... they have bag salads. Frozen veggies are a cinch... Put pan on medium heat, add small amount of water and frozen veggies, cover and cook for 15 minutes or until hot. Mashed potatoes... bring water to boil in a medium saucepan, cut potato in half and cut the halves in half, add salt to water, put in potatoes, cook until fork tender. Add a little butter and a little milk to the potatoes and mash with a fork or a potato masher. Don't put fear into a novice cooks heart because cooking can appear to be quite complicated but it is not it. The food you make can either be simple or complicated but even the complicated stuff is pretty simple once you are good at the basics.

My advice, get a Betty Crocker Cookbook. BEST COOKBOOK EVER. It will teach you easy recipes and techniques and take the mystery out of tasty food.

As far as my comparison of cutting out junk food to my drinking being a bad comparison, I do believe you brought up the smoking one. My point of the analogy was simply to show that keeping the junk around when you have decided to stop eating it is useless.

Obviously I will not convince you that you can pick up basic cooking within a week and that is fine. I don't need to or want to convince you. Basic stuff with tutorials are readily available on Youtube, on Food Network's website and other places like Recipe.com. To fill the gaps until you learn more recipes and techniques, there are a great deal of ready made healthy choices available without having to rely on junk to fill those gaps. The most important thing to remember is read the labels!

I am not here to argue, I am here to help. Cooking is not difficult to learn to do.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 6:29:40 PM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline 		From my own personal observation, I think some people inherit the 'cooking' gene and some don't. Of course, everyone should have basic cooking skills, IMO. But not everyone finds even the basics easy, and some people are just always going to find what I consider very simple cooking a huge chore.

Though I agree that knowing how to cook well is important to healthy eating, most can't learn how to do that in a week. You have to start with healthy shopping. Do you have *any* idea how many people can't pick out fruits and vegetables from the produce dept?

Hell, the clerks have trouble with things like radicchio, ginger, avocado, kale....they don't know what it is, and they sell it.

How do you pick out a good cut of meat? How about chicken? Fish? What are the rules for washing, storage, freezing? All these things need to be learned.

So I think you are seriously underestimating the learning curve here.

In any case, you don't help people make major changes by telling them to buck up and change their life over night. Those changes rarely last.

Small, incremental steps in the right direction ensure you can stay the course and reach your goals. But again, JMO.









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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 6:54:42 PM   
ShaharThorne


Posts: 11071
Joined: 2/24/2009
From: Somewhere in TX
Status: offline 		I got cookbooks. In fact, Mom was pouring over them while I was online looking for fig jelly recipes that use pectin I even got the Breast Cancer Betty Crocker one.

Except for the frozen pizzas, all frozen meals are gone. It was under the bread, on top of the pizzas. The kiddos get the pizzas when they come spend the night.

I am going to the doctor tomorrow to get the referral, discuss getting a shingles shot since I did have chickenpox and go over starting the diet. Afterwards, drop by Walmart to get some stuff and pick up my meds.

I also have been suffering from an episode today. Hate it when that happens, especially when the phone rings and I am yelling that I am not home. I hate flare-ups.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 7:03:54 PM   
Gauge


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ChatteParfaitt

From my own personal observation, I think some people inherit the 'cooking' gene and some don't. Of course, everyone should have basic cooking skills, IMO. But not everyone finds even the basics easy, and some people are just always going to find what I consider very simple cooking a huge chore.

Though I agree that knowing how to cook well is important to healthy eating, most can't learn how to do that in a week. You have to start with healthy shopping. Do you have *any* idea how many people can't pick out fruits and vegetables from the produce dept?

Hell, the clerks have trouble with things like radicchio, ginger, avocado, kale....they don't know what it is, and they sell it.

How do you pick out a good cut of meat? How about chicken? Fish? What are the rules for washing, storage, freezing? All these things need to be learned.

So I think you are seriously underestimating the learning curve here.

In any case, you don't help people make major changes by telling them to buck up and change their life over night. Those changes rarely last.

Small, incremental steps in the right direction ensure you can stay the course and reach your goals. But again, JMO.


I'm done repeating myself. It's nothing personal but I have nothing new to say. No one is actually reading what I am saying, they are taking what they want from it. I am trying to encourage this person and everyone is telling me that what I am saying is wrong and can't be done. How odd.

_____________________________

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/22/2013 7:13:44 PM   
dcnovice


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Joined: 8/2/2006
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quote:

From my own personal observation, I think some people inherit the 'cooking' gene and some don't. Of course, everyone should have basic cooking skills, IMO. But not everyone finds even the basics easy, and some people are just always going to find what I consider very simple cooking a huge chore.

Agreed. I'm largely in the don't group.

Another factor, at least for me, is living alone. I do sometimes enjoy preparing food for friends, but it's hard to work up the enthusiasm for prep, cooking, and cleaning when it's just me.

On a more whimsical note, I've observed that folks often tend to be either cooks or bakers. The cooks seem more improvisational; the bakers are pretty precise. Have others noticed that?

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 4:47:12 AM   
calamitysandra


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Joined: 3/17/2006
Status: offline 		Absolutely.

I find that cooking is (mostly) an art, and baking is (mostly) a science.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 5:49:31 AM   
evesgrden


Posts: 597
Joined: 6/9/2012
Status: offline 		The OP has already lost 60 pounds.

The OP is 46 years old.

She already knows that tater tots and fried fish is not on any diet, nor is "only a slice or two" of chocolate cake, only one piece of lemonade pie, only a mini 3 musketeers bar, fudge, hamburger helper, 1/2 a stick of butter in stew, and so forth. All those things make for a weight gain diet.

The OP has lost 60 pounds. Clearly she already KNOWS how to lose weight.

With the farmers market so far away, and living rural.. she could have her own garden grow her own veggies. Exercise and economical. But these are not the answers she wants. She wants the answers that allow a slice or two (OR TWO????) of chocolate cake AND a slice of lemonade, and mini chocolate bars, AND fried fish, AND fried potatoes... make a long enough list of weight gain junk food and you only need to have each one occasionally to make it a steady diet without a decent nutrient in sight.

Don't want to throw out the fish sticks? Have one a week.. they're FROZEN.. it's ok.

The OP is not employed and is quite capable of learning to cook. Having a student loan means she has learned how to learn. She can learn to cook.

That, however, means she has to want to do what it takes to lose the weight. And all I get from any of her responses is that any of that work is simply not agreeable to her. The one concession I saw from her is that her mother will have to make her own cake, and the OP will only have a slice or two of that. That's the big change she's willing to make.

She wants the weight to be gone, but she doens't want to go through the process of losing it.

It's a choice and she knows it.... she already lost 60 pounds.





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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 7:38:44 AM   
ShaharThorne


Posts: 11071
Joined: 2/24/2009
From: Somewhere in TX
Status: offline 		We took the carpet out of the living room and laid laminate down...easier to clean and I can see the scorpions creep out. So the mat is needed. When he was alive, Dad did not wipe his boots off and the carpet was coated with ingrained dirt.

I can get a kit for $23 at walmart...just have to sneak over there when we go to town today. On one of my FB buddies, she showed a yoga form that works on the throat, strengthening it and the thyroid. I am going to share it so it can stay in my timeline.

ETA: I did find a yoga DVD by Yee that deals with fatigue, stress, the back and so forth for $9.25 with free shipping. Just need the mat kit that Walmart sells.

< Message edited by ShaharThorne -- 7/23/2013 7:55:45 AM >

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 7:48:59 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline 		In my never humble opinion, the OP has an unhealthy relationship with food. You can't fix that by going on a diet, you fix that by turning your unhealthy relationship into a healthy one, and that takes times and a great deal of motivation.

If this issue was as easy as 'you've lost weight before, so you can do it now' we wouldn't have so many obese people.

This is an emotional issue, which is why I mentioned way back in this thread that the OP needs to fix her mental 'tape.' Somewhere in her mind, junk food and fatty food feed an emotional need. She almost certainly has a very low self esteem and has a bad tape running in her head that tells her she's worthless. You don't *have* to care about your diet if you're worthless. This is a very well ingrained issue that she might not even be fully aware of. But until that is fixed, her diet will not improve.

Like many obese people, she has a very emotional relationship with food. Not everyone does. Some don't care what they eat and eat only to sustain life. Others (like me) love food and live to eat (at least partially.) Now, I've turned that emotional relationship into a positive by becoming a great cook and doing my best to eat in a healthy way.

The OP can do that as well, one step at a time. But that bad tape needs to be replaced with a good tape. Some only accomplish this through therapy.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 8:08:04 AM   
MAINEiacMISTRESS


Posts: 1180
Joined: 9/12/2012
Status: offline 		I'd like to interrupt right now to say there is an excellent article in National Geographic about SUGAR (August 2013), the history of its production, and its affect on human metabolism (energy sapping after initial rush), fructose being processed by the liver into fat resulting in obesity, rather than being immediately metabolized throughout the body like glucose...a buildup becomes TOXIC resulting in insulin resistance and diabetes. Sugar affects the same pleasure centers of the brain as respond to heroin and cocaine, therefore causing an addiction.

Look for the issue with the cute red frosting topped cupcake on the front cover.

Mmmmm...I want to EAT that cupcake...

But I'm NOT going to.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 11:01:44 AM   
evesgrden


Posts: 597
Joined: 6/9/2012
Status: offline 		I have no doubt that she has an unhealthy relationship with food, and I never said it was easy. But she is acting like she doesn't know that fried foods and chocolate cake and tater tots have anything to do with her weight, and others are trying to educate her about calories and exercise.

My point is not that it's easy, but that she already KNOWS about what foods to eat and what foods not to eat; she KNOWS about exercise. This is not news to her just like it's not news to a smoker to tell them that cigarettes are unhealthy.

Therapy is likely the best option, or overeater's anonymous..she can do that online. Support for compulsive eating is available online.

The problem for the OP is not about whether Paleo works, or walking or yoga. Does anyone expect her to say "OHHHHH.. i didn't know that two slices of chocolate cake is not considered "restraint" or.. "I didn't know that battered fish is fried food since I bake it in the oven" or "I didn't know about portion control, or reading labels or or or or......."


Not the issue because she's lost weight.. she KNOWS these things. This is not an information deficit problem.

Yes to therapy. Yes to online support groups. Everything else... she already knows. By advising her about the "everything else" she's being enabled; she's stalling on dealing with the real issues.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 2:50:59 PM   
ShaharThorne


Posts: 11071
Joined: 2/24/2009
From: Somewhere in TX
Status: offline 		Well...I lost 7 pounds since May so something is working. Maybe the avoidance of all things with HFCS? Most people don't realize how that compound is in most foods and drinks.

Refilled the pain killers and the doctor said to go ahead and do the Paleo diet. Mom finally admits that she needs to lose weight (she weighed in at 190 today). She has to do PT 3 times a week for a while to strengthen her right leg (the muscle had a slight case of atrophy).

Did not get to Walmart...having a heat wave and coming out to a hot van at 2:45 in the afternoon can make one want to go home and raid the tomatoes...

I am going to print up some Paleo bread recipes so I can eat that instead of regular bread.

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You are making two and a half feet of irresistible, tubular sex! -Lola, Kinky Boots

Founder: Bitch with Tits

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 3:40:40 PM   
areallivehuman


Posts: 277
Joined: 1/16/2010
Status: offline 		Might I suggest you read this pamphlet, free pdf download.book

A lot of the problem is we eat for amusement, entertainment, and emotional fulfillment, and neglect the real reason for eating; to stay alive. Eat to live, not live to eat.

Simple foods, prepared simply. Pouches of instant oatmeal are not that good for you, unprocessed (steel cut) oats are very good for you. White rice does not have much nutritional value, brown rice is rich in nutrients. Simple foods, as close as you can get to the way they came out of the ground. Buy an electric rice cooker, convenient for rice, oats, other whole grains, add garlic yams, onions, carrots, the possibilities are infinite. You can have the occasional fried potato, cake ,pie etc, when you're better.

I eat no meat, poultry or fish. No sugar, honey, syrup, or artificial sweeteners. No dairy,eggs, cheese, butter. Whole grains, vegetables, beans. It is not as monotonous as it sounds, the world is full of delicious cheap healthy food,this is the way poor people eat, and they don't get these diseases.

This has worked very well for me, for over 5 years now, and flat out reversed diabetes in my girlfriend. And I am an active 56 year old man, who works in a busy shop, and I will tell you you do not need vast amounts of protein to function.

I wish you health

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 5:07:08 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Though I agree that knowing how to cook well is important to healthy eating, most can't learn how to do that in a week. You have to start with healthy shopping. Do you have *any* idea how many people can't pick out fruits and vegetables from the produce dept?

Hell, the clerks have trouble with things like radicchio, ginger, avocado, kale....they don't know what it is, and they sell it.

How do you pick out a good cut of meat? How about chicken? Fish? What are the rules for washing, storage, freezing? All these things need to be learned.


Oh yes, I'm always telling the clerks what this or that vegetable is, and last time, they mentioned a pepper someone else bought earlier that they couldn't identify, which I correctly guessed without seeing was a habernero.

I've learned to not ask the men in my life to pick up produce and the first time B picked up meat for me, I had to get on the phone with the butcher.

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RE: Where does this go to? HELP!! - 7/23/2013 5:22:31 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

My advice, get a Betty Crocker Cookbook. BEST COOKBOOK EVER. It will teach you easy recipes and techniques and take the mystery out of tasty food.


I'm a fan of The Joy of Cooking. I started with the 6th edition and am now on the 8th. I didn't learn how to cook from my mother and it helped me when I was living on my own and realized I had no clue. My grandmother didn't teach me how to cook either, but did drill into my head, "If you can read, you can cook." I would argue that it should be, "If you can follow instructions, you can cook."

Since then, I've cooked for pay and during four volunteer situations. I love to cook and try new recipes, and yet the three hours of prep required to get ready for the first day of the South Beach diet almost did me in.

There may be two things to overcome - learning to cook and acquiring the motivation and time management skills to do so.

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