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RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 9:30:51 AM   
mnottertail


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Well, they are hardly enumerable.

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 10:37:17 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Government isn't about codifying the whims of the majority.

What then,is the government's job?


To reiterate (again): Therein lies the importance of "enumerated powers."

To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 10:43:10 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Government isn't about codifying the whims of the majority.

What then,is the government's job?


To reiterate (again): Therein lies the importance of "enumerated powers."

To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?




Saburo:

To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.

Temujin


_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 11:02:22 AM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail


quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Government isn't about codifying the whims of the majority.

What then,is the government's job?


To reiterate (again): Therein lies the importance of "enumerated powers."

To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?




Saburo:

To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women.

Temujin


The kahn was always always a man of few words words.

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 9/11/2013 11:14:59 AM >

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 11:49:12 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Government isn't about codifying the whims of the majority.

What then,is the government's job?

To reiterate (again): Therein lies the importance of "enumerated powers."

To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?


In general:
    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.


And:
    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity


How does our government do that? Enumerated powers.

I'm surprised I had to spell that out for you.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
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  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 11:52:29 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Government isn't about codifying the whims of the majority.

What then,is the government's job?

To reiterate (again): Therein lies the importance of "enumerated powers."

To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?


In general:
    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.


And:
    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity


How does our government do that? Enumerated powers.

I'm surprised I had to spell that out for you.

You have not spelled out a mother fucking thing.
To reiterate...What then, is the government's job?

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/11/2013 8:47:01 PM   
DesideriScuri


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Thompsonx,

Are you the guy that lives "off the grid?" I recall someone saying they did. I can't recall who it was, though. Was it you?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 6:24:28 AM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

Thompsonx,

Are you the guy that lives "off the grid?" I recall someone saying they did. I can't recall who it was, though. Was it you?

It is me but only since 1987

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 6:26:25 AM   
mnottertail


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Joined: 11/3/2004
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Not even putting on waffleGRIDS?

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 7:09:35 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Thompsonx,
Are you the guy that lives "off the grid?" I recall someone saying they did. I can't recall who it was, though. Was it you?

It is me but only since 1987


Proof that it can be done, Phydeaux.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 7:16:15 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Thompsonx,
Are you the guy that lives "off the grid?" I recall someone saying they did. I can't recall who it was, though. Was it you?

It is me but only since 1987


Proof that it can be done, Phydeaux.


But but but if I were to put a coal fired plant in my back yard I would not have to maintain all of the sophisticated hardware that solar is.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 7:33:11 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Thompsonx,
Are you the guy that lives "off the grid?" I recall someone saying they did. I can't recall who it was, though. Was it you?

It is me but only since 1987

Proof that it can be done, Phydeaux.

But but but if I were to put a coal fired plant in my back yard I would not have to maintain all of the sophisticated hardware that solar is.


Oh, shaddap!

I am all in favor of people generating their own power. That is going to be part of my future. I don't know that I'll be completely "off-grid," but I'll definitely reduce my reliance on it.

Any idea how much it costs to divert a river through one's yard to support a hydro-electric setup?




_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 8:47:17 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:


Any idea how much it costs to divert a river through one's yard to support a hydro-electric setup?

Hit me on c mail and I will give you what I have.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 8:54:24 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
quote:

Any idea how much it costs to divert a river through one's yard to support a hydro-electric setup?

Hit me on c mail and I will give you what I have.


Thanks, but it was meant as a joke. I have no river nearby that I could divert. And, I'm sure cost would only play a part in my laying down transmission lines connecting my property to the nearest river for a generator. The local overseers and my neighbors would likely take issue...


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 11:04:31 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Any idea how much it costs to divert a river through one's yard to support a hydro-electric setup?

A lot.

From my research, I helped get my aunt and cousin mostly off grid due to grid reliability problems, the best solution for most people is a hybrid solution. Geothermal if that is possible is the best present baseline power source, it is however expensive if you don't already have a well deep enough to do the job. Vertical axis wind turbines are easy to site and work at fairly low wind speeds, 5 mph to 50mph. Solar is, IMO, the least useful but if your roof faces south a set of panels on the roof can provide a fair amount of power on days when you're more likely to run A/C. To be truly grid independent you will need a battery system and probably an investment in energy efficient appliances, obviously the less power you consume the easier it is to generate it yourself.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 11:34:55 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Any idea how much it costs to divert a river through one's yard to support a hydro-electric setup?

A lot.
From my research, I helped get my aunt and cousin mostly off grid due to grid reliability problems, the best solution for most people is a hybrid solution. Geothermal if that is possible is the best present baseline power source, it is however expensive if you don't already have a well deep enough to do the job. Vertical axis wind turbines are easy to site and work at fairly low wind speeds, 5 mph to 50mph. Solar is, IMO, the least useful but if your roof faces south a set of panels on the roof can provide a fair amount of power on days when you're more likely to run A/C. To be truly grid independent you will need a battery system and probably an investment in energy efficient appliances, obviously the less power you consume the easier it is to generate it yourself.


Taking Thompson's tongue-in-cheek coal plant in his backyard idea, I modified it to my own tongue-in-cheek divert a river idea.

I know alternative/renewable energy systems are cost-prohibitive upfront. I have an old, no longer used well somewhere on my property (the pumps are still in the basement, but it was converted to city water 5+ years ago and I have lots of other shit to deal with that comes before pulling an unused pump out). I have plenty of land for horizontal systems, which, I believe, are cheaper than vertical wells, if starting from scratch (if they can't use the well point already on my property). I would have no issue getting rid of the current landscape to bury lines for that. I'd even likely plant on top of it to protect it, somewhat, anyway, from invasive roots. I would love nothing more than to have a geothermal system installed. I just really need to find some sort of financial means. That's the only thing holding me up, to be honest. I would also consider adding on a roof-mounted solar air heater to augment the geothermal unit in the winter to keep from having to run space heaters and such. Summers would find me with no other form of air conditioning outside of the cooled air from the unit. I'd run a separate dehumidifier, when necessary. Fans will move the air as needed.

I'm extremely interested in VAWT's, too. I can see them popping up on my property at some point in time (provided the zoning commission gives me a variance; currently, only 3+ acre properties are allowed to have wind turbines, and I only have 2 acres; but this is likely more for safety and noise concerns that don't tend to apply to VAWT's. At some point, I'll likely tinker with some options for VAWT's, seeing what I can scavenge to throw together.

I have very little south-facing roof (the house my ex has, I really pushed for the site because the house would face north, allowing for a greater area of south facing, and unbroken roof for future solar panel installation). It seems PV may not be much in my future for that reason. I'm not against creating a "solar array" at some point, but that's not something I think it is likely to be financially smart at today's tech level.

But, yeah. I do love me some renewable energy sources.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 11:44:42 AM   
mnottertail


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Here in minnesota the electric company will finance you for geo and you get tax credits to boot, at little or no interest, you may have that option, worth a phonecall.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 12:36:31 PM   
DesideriScuri


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Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
Here in minnesota the electric company will finance you for geo and you get tax credits to boot, at little or no interest, you may have that option, worth a phonecall.


Thanks, MN. Will look into that.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 12:38:14 PM   
mnottertail


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Otherwise, backhoe and call the corps of engineers and let them know you are moving big muddy a bit to the left.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Germany's power grid destabilizing - 9/12/2013 12:46:42 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
Otherwise, backhoe and call the corps of engineers and let them know you are moving big muddy a bit to the left.


Something tells me that diverting the mighty Maumee 11 or so miles to the left might be more cost-prohibitive than geothermal.

Lemme call American Rent-All first, though...


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 40
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