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Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/11/2013 3:51:01 PM

cloudboy

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Gallup:

As the two major political parties are locked in a high-stakes political imbroglio that has resulted in a government shutdown and may cause the first-ever default on the national debt, Americans are more likely to view both parties negatively than positively. The Republican Party is clearly taking a bigger political hit from Americans thus far in the unfolding saga, with 28% rating the GOP favorably -- a loss of 10 points from only a month ago. This contrasts with previous Gallup findings from just before the government shutdown showing the Republican Party making up ground on a few key issues. Thus, the Republican Party's current strategy in the fiscal debates may not be paying dividends.

The poll states, "Self-identified Republicans are more than twice as likely to view their own party unfavorably (27%) as Democrats are to see their own party unfavorably (13%)."

What are the root causes of Republican self-loathing. Is it the influence of the lunatic fringe? Is it the party's inability to offer solutions for job creation, immigration, environmental protections, financial regulation, health care, and sky-rocketing education costs?

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 10/11/2013 3:54:24 PM >

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/12/2013 4:28:06 PM

cloudboy

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I'm kind of surprised the poll received no comments. Gallup is not a politicized organization.

The question is: what kind of blow-back can the Republicans expect? How much will the Tea Party suffer? Does this negative polling show how super-far right the new gerrymandered districts are -- as the candidates there are pleasing their constituents despite how far away their positions are from national opinions and main stream voters.

----------

Republican Party Favorability Sinks to Record Low
Falls 10 percentage points from September's 38%

(in reply to cloudboy)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/12/2013 4:31:10 PM

Yachtie

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From what I can tell, many Rs think their party is a bunch of spineless wimps.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/12/2013 5:27:24 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I'm kind of surprised the poll received no comments. Gallup is not a politicized organization.

The question is: what kind of blow-back can the Republicans expect? How much will the Tea Party suffer? Does this negative polling show how super-far right the new gerrymandered districts are -- as the candidates there are pleasing their constituents despite how far away their positions are from national opinions and main stream voters.

----------

Republican Party Favorability Sinks to Record Low
Falls 10 percentage points from September's 38%

A lot will depend on how much longer the shutdown goes and if they force us into default. if it ends this weekend I'd expect the GOP to hold even or lose only a few seats. If they keep the shutdown going another week or longer or, shudder, force the default it will be a wave election. Those 80 ultra safe republican districts might be the only ones left in the House.

(in reply to cloudboy)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/12/2013 6:12:31 PM

MrRodgers

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The only surprise is how long this took. But then as we've seen and just about everywhere, lies, propaganda and utter bullshit works.

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/12/2013 6:14:50 PM

DarkSteven

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

From what I can tell, many Rs think their party is a bunch of spineless wimps.

The GOP's problem is that there is no "party" at this point. It's badly fragmented.

The GOP seems to be splitting into at least two factions. The far right types are driven by ideology instead of polls or pragmatism. They not only do not fear a shutdown lasting longer and a refusal to raise the debt ceiling but actually may welcome the crisis. They do feel that the GOP leadership is a bunch of spineless wimps.

The moderates think that the rightists are oblivious to the PR damage the party is taking, and I like to think that they're also concerned about the damage the country will take if things don't get fixed soon, especially the debt ceiling.

A lot or R types are amazed that Obama's not negotiating hard right now. The sad reality is that the Rs are getting hammered in the polls worse than the Ds, and Obama's position is getting worse at a much slower rate than the Republicans. The moderates are exasperated enough that they're threatening the rightists with primary challenges, and the donors are talking about sitting out 2014. The longer this goes on, the better chances the Ds have of regaining the House in 2014. So Obama can afford to just sit tight.

_____________________________

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/13/2013 1:38:36 PM

cloudboy

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Thanks for the feedback all.

I pulled this from a NYT OP ED today that gave a pretty good explanation (in one paragraph, no less) of why the Republicans went for the shutdown:

......just because the Republican strategy has been irrational doesn’t make it inexplicable. The trends that brought us to this point are clear enough: the discrediting of the Republican establishment during the Bush era; the rise of a populist right that often sees opposition as an end unto itself; the willingness of too many media figures, activists and politicians to stoke that wing’s worst impulses; and the current Republican leadership’s desire both to prevent an intraparty civil war and avoid a true national disaster like default.

This acknowledges that theRepublican party with all its warts is here to stay.

----

Here's the part where we wish the American Taliban would just go away (which it won't....):

So we shouldn’t overstate the gravity of what’s been happening in Washington. There are many policies in American history, pursued in good faith by liberals or conservatives, that have been more damaging to the country than the Republican decision to shut down the government this month, and many gambits that have reaped bigger political disasters than most House Republicans are likely to face as a result.

But there is still something well-nigh-unprecedented about how Republicans have conducted themselves of late. It’s not the scale of their mistake, or the kind of damage that it’s caused, but the fact that their strategy was such self-evident folly, so transparently devoid of any method whatsoever.

Every sensible person, most Republican politicians included, could recognize that the shutdown fever would blow up in the party’s face. Even the shutdown’s ardent champions never advanced a remotely compelling story for how it would deliver its objectives. And everything that’s transpired since, from the party’s polling nose dive to the frantic efforts to save face, was entirely predictable in advance.

The methodless madness distinguishes this shutdown from prior Congressional Republican defeats (the Gingrich shutdown, the Clinton impeachment), when you could at least see what the politicians involved were thinking. And it distinguishes it, too, from many of history’s marches of folly as well.

You could compare the behavior of current House Republicans to the diplomatic sleepwalking that led to World War I, but at least, in that case, the various powers had reasonable theories of how they would actually win the ensuing war.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 10/13/2013 1:40:16 PM >

(in reply to DarkSteven)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/13/2013 1:49:09 PM

kalikshama

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There were two good, in depth, articles in the current issue of Rolling Stone:

Inside the Republican Suicide Machine

It's open warfare within the GOP – and all of America is caught in the crossfire

The day before Congress broke for its August recess, on an afternoon when most of official Washington was tying up loose ends and racing to get out of town, Sen. Ted Cruz was setting the stage for the chaos that has consumed the nation's capital in recent weeks.

..."As scary as a shutdown fight is," Cruz insists, "if we don't stand and defund Obamacare now, we never will."

With those words, Cruz fired the first shot in a civil war that has cleaved Republicans in both chambers of Congress – a struggle that threatens the legitimacy of the Grand Old Party and the stability of the global economy. The fight has little to do with policy, or even ideology. It pits the party's conservative establishment against an extremist insurgency in a battle over strategy, tactics and, ultimately, control of the party. Each side surveys the other with distrust, even contempt. The establishment believes the insurgents' tactics are suicidal; the insurgents believe the establishment lacks the courage of its alleged convictions – while its own members are so convinced of their righteousness that they compare themselves to civil rights heroes like Rosa Parks. The establishment is backed by powerful business concerns with a vested interest in a functioning government. The insurgents are championed by wealthy ideologues who simply seek to tear down government. Both sides are steeled by millions in unregulated, untraceable "dark money."

Having backed the GOP into a shutdown fight that congressional leaders never wanted, the insurgents are winning, and establishment leaders are running scared. America is now careening toward a catastrophic voluntary default on our debt because no one in the Republican Party with the authority to put on the brakes has the guts to apply them, for fear of being toppled from power.

"I've never seen anything like it, and neither has anybody else around here," says the House's eldest statesman, 87-year-old John Dingell, who has represented Michigan since 1955. "It's a grave misfortune for the country."

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/inside-the-republican-suicide-machine-20131009#ixzz2hdYyVgTU

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/13/2013 1:53:13 PM

cloudboy

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That is very well described. I liken the the insurgents to the American Taliban. The Taliban are hell bent on keeping girls out of school, the Tea Party is obsessed with not expanding the reach and affordability of American Healthcare.

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Post #: 9

RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/13/2013 2:01:23 PM

kalikshama

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Here's a historical perspective by Sean Wilentz, Pulititzer prize nominee and Professor of History at Princeton University:

Republican Extremism and the Lessons of History

This crisis is about nothing other than the Republican Party – its radicalization, its stunning lack of leadership and its disregard for the Constitution

This latest episode in the endless Republican reality show is not chiefly about the incompetence and incessant squabbling of ideologues and petty politicians, although it's that, too. Nor is it the outcome of the intense partisan polarization that has thrown Washington into gridlock, as if the problem is abstract partisanship itself, with Democrats and Republicans equally at fault. Least of all is it about rescuing the economy from the Democrats' profligate deficit spending, as Republicans claim – not with the deficit shrinking to its lowest level since the financial disaster of 2008 and with the outlook improving. This crisis is about nothing other than the Republican Party – its radicalization, its stunning lack of leadership and its disregard for the Constitution.

The Republicans have now joined a relatively small number of major American political parties that became the captive of a narrow ideology and either jettisoned or silenced their more moderate elements. The Democratic Party suffered this fate in the 1840s and 1850s, when Southern slaveholders took command of the party's levers of power. So, temporarily, did the Republicans in 1964, when Barry Goldwater's presidential campaign claimed the party for extremists on the right, an augury of things to come. But today's Republicans, whatever their pretensions about channeling the Founding Fathers, are so contemptuous of American history and institutions that they cannot learn from even their own recent past.

Like earlier declines into dogmatic politics, the Republicans descended gradually, beginning with Ronald Reagan's departure from the White House in 1989.

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/republican-extremism-and-the-lessons-of-history-20131010#ixzz2hdbztwoJ

(in reply to kalikshama)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/13/2013 10:05:25 PM

slavekate80

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

That is very well described. I liken the the insurgents to the American Taliban. The Taliban are hell bent on keeping girls out of school, the Tea Party is obsessed with not expanding the reach and affordability of American Healthcare.

How clever of you to note the similarity between the two! I wouldn't have seen it myself if you hadn't pointed it out... as a matter of fact, I still don't.

One is an extremist group that often uses violence, using religion as its excuse, and one is a political group with views you disagree with. I'm with you in that I don't agree with their attempts to get rid of the ACA, and I lean more to the left than to the right overall, but calling the Tea Party the American Taliban is absurd.

(in reply to cloudboy)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 12:35:16 AM

tweakabelle

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Thanks for some enlightening links.

For non-Ameicans the current impasse in Washington is bewildering and mysterious. The strategies and policies imposed on the GOP by Tea Party lunatics are seen as suicidal and dangerous, not only for the US but also for the entire world.

It simply doesn't make sense that anyone is prepared to shut their government down and possibly plunge the entire world into recession and worse over funding healthcare. It doesn't make sense that that the TP looneys have initiated a fight they cannot win, that they are condemning themselves to political oblivion needlessly.

Viewing this debacle as a war for control of the GOP does allow us to understand what motivates such insanity. Only the most fanatical of self righteous ideologues would engage in such tactics and be so blind to the inevitable outcomes.

If there is a positive side to this, it is that American voters are being presented with proof positive of just how bankrupt and dangerous the looney Right is, and having seen these nutcases for what they are, voters will have a chance to throw these deranged ideologues out of positions of influence at the next elections.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 10/14/2013 12:36:54 AM >

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 2:42:59 AM

DomKen

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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slavekate80

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

That is very well described. I liken the the insurgents to the American Taliban. The Taliban are hell bent on keeping girls out of school, the Tea Party is obsessed with not expanding the reach and affordability of American Healthcare.

How clever of you to note the similarity between the two! I wouldn't have seen it myself if you hadn't pointed it out... as a matter of fact, I still don't.

One is an extremist group that often uses violence, using religion as its excuse, and one is a political group with views you disagree with. I'm with you in that I don't agree with their attempts to get rid of the ACA, and I lean more to the left than to the right overall, but calling the Tea Party the American Taliban is absurd.

Only if you exclude the Religious Right, which is very much and American Taliban including their frequent use of violence, from the tea party.

(in reply to slavekate80)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 2:37:20 PM

Phydeaux

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavekate80

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

That is very well described. I liken the the insurgents to the American Taliban. The Taliban are hell bent on keeping girls out of school, the Tea Party is obsessed with not expanding the reach and affordability of American Healthcare.

How clever of you to note the similarity between the two! I wouldn't have seen it myself if you hadn't pointed it out... as a matter of fact, I still don't.

One is an extremist group that often uses violence, using religion as its excuse, and one is a political group with views you disagree with. I'm with you in that I don't agree with their attempts to get rid of the ACA, and I lean more to the left than to the right overall, but calling the Tea Party the American Taliban is absurd.

Only if you exclude the Religious Right, which is very much and American Taliban including their frequent use of violence, from the tea party.

Utter bullshit. Calling people that call for abortionists to be killed the Religious Right is offensive bigotry and you should be ashamed. Its as offensive as calling the democrats the party of the weathermen, or the party of the black panthers or the party of Jim Crow, slavery, and the KKK.

(in reply to DomKen)

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 5:07:08 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavekate80

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

That is very well described. I liken the the insurgents to the American Taliban. The Taliban are hell bent on keeping girls out of school, the Tea Party is obsessed with not expanding the reach and affordability of American Healthcare.

How clever of you to note the similarity between the two! I wouldn't have seen it myself if you hadn't pointed it out... as a matter of fact, I still don't.

One is an extremist group that often uses violence, using religion as its excuse, and one is a political group with views you disagree with. I'm with you in that I don't agree with their attempts to get rid of the ACA, and I lean more to the left than to the right overall, but calling the Tea Party the American Taliban is absurd.

Only if you exclude the Religious Right, which is very much and American Taliban including their frequent use of violence, from the tea party.

Utter bullshit. Calling people that call for abortionists to be killed the Religious Right is offensive bigotry and you should be ashamed. Its as offensive as calling the democrats the party of the weathermen, or the party of the black panthers or the party of Jim Crow, slavery, and the KKK.

Which Conservatives do all the time. And the Army of God is supported by more "mainstream" antiabortion groups which are inarguably part o the RR. Also the fact is the RR and far right wingers do engage in more violence than just the anti abortion terror attacks.

Just this weekend the far right of the Republican party waved a white supremacist symbol in front of the White House and Capital
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2013/10/14/ugly-rebel-yell-in-front-of-the-white-house/
Which is an explicit threat of violence.

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 5:11:56 PM

Yachtie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Just this weekend the far right of the Republican party waved a white supremacist symbol in front of the White House and Capital

Which is an explicit threat of violence.

I agree. The Marine Corps do often bring violence with them

The Confederate flag is hardly a white supremacist flag. By your view, one would think the guy is wearing a sheet.

_____________________________

“We all know it’s going to end badly, but in the meantime we can make some money.” - Jim Cramer, CNBC

“Those who ‘abjure’ violence can only do so because others are committing violence on their behalf.” - George Orwell

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RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 5:15:27 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie
The Confederate flag is hardly a white supremacist flag. By your view, one would think the guy is wearing a sheet.

That thing that bigot was waving was never the flag of the CSA. And yes the guy may as well have been wearing a white sheet.

(in reply to Yachtie)

Post #: 17

RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 5:34:11 PM

epiphiny43

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The South I lived in (Texas and FL) sure as Hell regarded the Confederate battle flag as a symbol of White Supremacy. Don't think things have changed any, particularly among the 'disenfranchised poor white males', the power base of regional radicalism and Tea Party.

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Post #: 18

RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 6:24:38 PM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: epiphiny43

The South I lived in (Texas and FL) sure as Hell regarded the Confederate battle flag as a symbol of White Supremacy. Don't think things have changed any, particularly among the 'disenfranchised poor white males', the power base of regional radicalism and Tea Party.

The sad thing is the thing those racists display isn't actually the Standard of the Army of Virgina, aka the Confederate Battle Flag. In reality it was never flown by the CSA it is a 20th century creation based on CSA symbols.

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Post #: 19

RE: Republican Approval Rating Lowest Ever - 10/14/2013 7:59:58 PM

Arturas

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quote:

just because the Republican strategy has been irrational doesn’t make it inexplicable

The strategy is to do their job. Their job is to represent the voters who put them into office and from the polls it is clear they are doing exactly that even if there are large groups that did not put them into office who do not like what they are doing. Their goal is not to make the Republican party look good or bad, it is to do their job and they are doing it. Take the Republican led House for example, they look fragmented because that is the nature of the House. Their job is to vote the way they have been voting, regardless of Obama care being the law now, because their voters do not want it and so they are supposed to do everything they can to stop it as well as the spending which their voters also do not also like, and so, as long as they represent their voters back home then they will continue to do great and look great to the people for whom they work. These men and women are Americans who are doing their job. So, while it is interesting to hear the Press and those on these forums discuss factions in the Party as if this is a bad thing, the truth is this is the way they are suppose to represent their voters back home if they do that then they can only be voted back into office rather than lose seats.

BTW, the house and the senates have different size voter blocks by design, the Senator is elected by the entire state wherease the Representative represents smaller areas of each state, so you naturally are more close to your voters and vote closer to what an individual area wants done and you naturally have more factions in the House. This is natural and designed into our Government and one purpose is to keep one group from taking total control of the Government and as you see, it is working, and as you will continue to see over the next few weeks, it works well.

< Message edited by Arturas -- 10/14/2013 8:01:53 PM >

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