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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/28/2013 5:52:58 PM   
NoBimbosAllowed


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so, counterbalance the lad with posting something poetic about Lou, since he was a poet.




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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/28/2013 8:51:34 PM   
garyFLR


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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: garyFLR

FD, I've noticed on several threads I've started, you come across as negative. Starting arguments that revolve around you. Why not contribute to threads in a positve way? you're starting to get a reputation.

Sorry Gary, if I don't like something, I'm entitled to say it.
It's not whether you started it or not; it's just my opinion on that particular topic.
Sorry if it's negative. Someone has to say it even if it's not popular.

Nobody says all the topics have to have an agreeable audience.
But here, like the other one about JJ someone.
I said I didn't miss him.
If others want to pick up on that and make me sound illiterate or ignorant then I have a right to reply.

This thread was started so people can write a few words to express their sadness at the passing of an iconic figure, not so you can derail yet another thread. It's best we ignore you & continue our eulgies to a great man. Go sulk in the corner, little man.

< Message edited by garyFLR -- 10/28/2013 8:54:22 PM >


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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/28/2013 8:56:00 PM   
NoBimbosAllowed


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and thus we do continue.


The Nilla folk had Elvis; he sang from the heart, for their hearts.

the Bent Boys and Left of Centre Lasses had Lou, who groaned in pain, knowing their pain.



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It's all about the curvature of the female azzzzzzzzzzz, meaning Niki Minaj and Serena Williams and Kate Cerebrano, NEVER Kylie Minogue! Wooden Spoons and Ottoman scenes from Story of O, baby dolls!

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 12:42:25 AM   
PyrotheClown


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"It always bothers me to see people writing 'RIP' when a person dies. It just feels so insincere and like a cop-out. To me, 'RIP' is the microwave dinner of posthumous honours." - Lou Reed


So instead,
I'll just say thanks Lou

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 2:14:27 AM   
garyFLR


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Listening to the Velvets, Live At The New York Museum Of Modern Art, Circa 1966. (On youtube if anyone would like to give it a spin. It's terrible, but, it's still really great !!

Nico would have made a great Domme!!



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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 2:35:13 AM   
MadameMarque


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Aw, Hell.

His music spins on in those he inspired.

Okay, Lou, get the sex, rock n roll started up there, so there'll be a proper party going on.

(and all blessings)


different colors made of tears

- from Venus In Furs, written by Lou Reed

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 3:07:27 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


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He was a favorite.



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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 5:20:00 AM   
EdBowie


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So based on refusing to listen to music in general, and never listening to Lou Reed... you developed a 'dislike' sufficient to make post after post in a thread about his life and death?

As opposed to seeing a schadenfreude opportunity to make it all about you, you, you?


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: fetisheden
yes.it's funny when people are so proud of their ignorance

Not ignorance.
I disliked him and his music so much that I discarded him from my mind and I said so.
That isn't ignorance; that's my personal judgement.



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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 5:59:21 AM   
Blonderfluff


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

I disliked him and his music so much that I discarded him from my mind and I said so.

Yes you did. And I'm just as pleased to see you here as I am when Westboro Baptist Church shows up at a solder's funeral.

Kinda makes words unnecessary, if ya know what I mean. Good luck.

K.



Well said. i actually knew Lou Reed for many years. Trust me He NEVER cared about the popular view. He cared about words and the feelings they evoked. And. He would have been VERY glad that someone like fdwarf didn't care for him!!!

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 9:07:39 AM   
Domnotlooking


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Gotta ask:

What the hell were they doing giving a liver transplant to a 70 year old substance abuser? When you think of all the people who would have benefited from that liver, you can only conclude that it is a very mean old world indeed.

The VU were indeed massively influencial (but seldom played much these days in this house), but he produced a lot barrel scraping stinker albums after that. The live ones with Alice Cooper's guitarist, Steve Hunter, a bit of Street Hassle and Sally Can't Dance hold up, but then there are the truly dire ones like The Bells, Songs For Drella, and on and on.

Even the post-Cale VU was a giant slide in imagination. He always did best with a collaborator rather than on his own.Transformer is at least 40% Bowie in style. I saw him a few times with guitarist Robert Quine and I also saw Robert Quine alone. Guess which show had me looking at my watch a lot less?

At the end, he was milking it with his Metal Machine Album tour and that horrible Lulu/Metallica collaboration. If his legendary name were not attached, would these avant-precious wank jobs have ever seen the light of day?

I'm grateful for his invention of the sunglasses and black tee shirt look which I still wear a bit, tho. Empathy to those who miss him, but I miss the days when I actually looked decent in that get up more than I do his very underachieving career of the last third of a century.

Unverifiable gossip that I have heard a lot over the years in NYC is that he was no one you wanted to encounter in a dungeon -but really, who knows?

< Message edited by Domnotlooking -- 10/29/2013 9:41:48 AM >

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 9:18:17 AM   
garyFLR


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Bowie, Reed, or Pop, who influenced who?

So Lou's output was variable, to say the least, at the latter end of his career, who's isn't? But, at his best, there was no one to touch him in his idiom. His influence is far ranging.

< Message edited by garyFLR -- 10/29/2013 9:19:00 AM >


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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 9:26:42 AM   
Domnotlooking


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I thought the agreed orthodox, canonical position was that Iggy was the alpha and omega originator of all that was eye-liner arty.

Sectarian opinions: T-Rex, NY Dolls.

Seen 'em all live back in the day, which makes me a bit older than many pebbles you see laying around in the street.

Iggy gets my vote for best show. T-Rex was a tad fey (a very brit taste, that fey thing), and the Dolls, while glorious in a you had to be there way, were just too fucked up to play.

Will Lou Reed's rep and standing outlast the boomer cohort?

I'll bet that him and his whole downtown bohemian context will not. For the young, that time and sensibility already seem incoherent.

To quote a better songwriter: What a draaag it is getting older.

< Message edited by Domnotlooking -- 10/29/2013 9:27:43 AM >

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 9:33:46 AM   
Domnotlooking


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Record Nerd Alert:

The first to smear on the eyeliner (backing out Little Richard) were probably the Pretty Things. Can anyone verify?

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 9:46:26 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking
Even the post-Cale VU was a giant slide in imagination. He always did best with a collaborator rather than on his own.

Nice to see somebody addressing this one, however tentatively. The Velvets were just a dull garage band without Cale.

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 10:18:19 AM   
Domnotlooking


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"However tentatively"? Whatever.

Cale's post VU career has hardly been stellar either. Much cred attached to his producing Patti Smith's Horses album, but that's a pretty by the numbers album, sound-wise. Albums like Church of Anthrax have been enjoyed by no one except as hip-signifying props. Live he was a dire, shambling mess. Only Lee Perry does a worse show.

Book Recco:

The End -the story of Nico's last days on the road. You will laugh until you fall over. In one funny scene Nico is on tour with Cale in Japan. They play to empty houses and general bafflement. The Japanese verdict: "famous, but not popular".

It really could be on all their tombstones.

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 1:29:59 PM   
Moonhead


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I beg to diffwer about Cale's post Velvets career. There's no question that the Patti Smith debut is overrated, but for what it is (a rip off of Peter Hammill's Nadir's Big Chance) it isn't as bad as all that. Also, that's far from his only esteemed production job: The Modern Lovers album, the Nico stuff you allude to (nobody else ever managed to get a half decent album out of her), Jennifer Warner, the Stooges, loads of stuff.

You're definitely being too harsh on his solo stuff: Church Of Anthrax (which is is more Terry Riley than Cale in any case) is an avant garde obscurity, and so hardly a good example. You might just as well say that Reed's crap over the even duller and less listenable Metal Machine Music. Cale's solo records didn't even sell all that well back in the '70s, but stuff like Music For A New Society, Fear, and Vintage Violence still stand up, and he was capable of something as good as Black Acetate while Reed was reduced shitting out drivel like Ecstasy.

I'd also question that he's crap live; Sabotage is a bit messy sounding, but there's nothing wrong with Fragments Of A Rainy Season, and it's worth having a look on youtube for his appearances on Jools or him doing Dylan Thomas backed by a children's choir.

Finally, that version of Hallelujah makes mincemeat out of the original, and I can't think of any other pop musicians who've taken an axe to a baby grand on children's televesion...

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 2:24:56 PM   
Domnotlooking


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.....The best thing about finding a copy of Blue Mask or Vintage Violence is that the album will always be in near mint condition -having been played 1.5 times at most.

These long ago, slightly dated conceits were not only "famous but not popular", but also revered, but never listened to. Call it the later works of Tom Waits syndrome.

When I lived in England, Lou Reed enjoyed a popularity that was baffling. Lou Reed represents a very academic, european kind of taste that is worthwhile as far as it goes, but not in any way relevant to broader musical progress at all. I'm glad I heard it all, but I don't think anyone will be listening to it 20 years from now. It was a great moment, but now it's gone.

I mourn the passing of the days when I was gullible enough to love this stagey faux-transgressive stuff and enjoyed feeling exclusionary and knowing about it more than I mourn the passing of the noise itself.

On the other hand, people who like this stuff are usually at least a little interesting. Just like I'd prefer reading a Morrissey interview to a listening to a Morrissey record, I'd prefer talking to arty intellectual people about anything else but arty intellectual stuff.

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 3:00:24 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Domnotlooking
.....The best thing about finding a copy of Blue Mask or Vintage Violence is that the album will always be in near mint condition -having been played 1.5 times at most.

Really? I'll have to ask for a refund on the copy of The Blue Mask I bought off a market stall in '91 (I think) that the previous owner had played so much a couple of the tracks skipped.

The only Cale record I've ever seen on a market stall or in a charity shop was a vinyl copy of Music For A New Society. That one played okay, but it'd definitely seen some use.

Neither example suggests somebody listened to one side twice and the other once, then got rid of it.

As for Reed representing an academic, artsy fartsy taste, do me a favour. He's better known for his '70s pop stuff than he is for the artsier moments, and even most of those are basically pub rock with feedbacky knobs on and a bit more wordiness than Lee Brilleaux was up to. That's why the second and third Velvets were so dull and I prefer Cale's solo stuff to Reed's, as a matter of fact: the bugger didn't have the chops to play avant garde stuff, to the extent that when he tried the results are just plain embarrassing. It's particularly obvious on the stuff he produced himself, where he sticks his own guitar so high up in the mix it drowns out everything else, instead of letting the (generally) much better musicians he's playing with carry him.

(I'd also question that the academic, artsy taste is a dying thing as well, but that's a whole other argument.)

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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/29/2013 4:35:29 PM   
NoBimbosAllowed


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Blonderfluff


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

I disliked him and his music so much that I discarded him from my mind and I said so.

Yes you did. And I'm just as pleased to see you here as I am when Westboro Baptist Church shows up at a solder's funeral.

Kinda makes words unnecessary, if ya know what I mean. Good luck.

K.



Well said. i actually knew Lou Reed for many years. Trust me He NEVER cared about the popular view. He cared about words and the feelings they evoked. And. He would have been VERY glad that someone like fdwarf didn't care for him!!!


Meanwhile, I just love the fact that Blonderfluff looks like a sexier version of one of the naughtiest sexy Brit Actresses, Celia Imrie!

Seriously, get a photo of Celia smiling, from ten or 15 years ago, and compare the pics!

_____________________________

It's all about the curvature of the female azzzzzzzzzzz, meaning Niki Minaj and Serena Williams and Kate Cerebrano, NEVER Kylie Minogue! Wooden Spoons and Ottoman scenes from Story of O, baby dolls!

(in reply to Blonderfluff)
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RE: RIP Lou Reed. - 10/30/2013 9:35:01 AM   
Domnotlooking


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Hey, Moonhead:

Thanks for talking. I gotta go make some $$$$. Your taste is not my taste, but at least you have taste and can talk about it.

I think the old, arty bohemian thing is soon to be gone and we'll all be poorer for it. A lot of it is student driven and these days, kids just don't have the leisure time to listen to the Joy Division box set 52 times.

Also, people like Lou Reed seem a little passé with their then-daring bisexual alluding in the era of gay marriage. The young will wonder what the fuss was all about.

Likewise, the presentation of drugs as having some seedy glamour. No one thinks going up to Harlem to buy smack is something they'd want to do anymore (and they'd just find a Starbucks and Bed, Bath, and Beyond, anyway).

Back circa '69, there was a tiny outlaw artiste class and a vast audience of nice middle class people with their nose pressed against the glass drinking in the sheer thrill of it all (note nerd song ref.). A lot of that audience stayed with him, but how many people under 45 are in this thread?

The Lou Reed of '69, would be agog at the soma-like options for pleasure we have today. He had a paperback book called the "The Velvet Underground" (a real piece of shit, BTW). We have THIS -and a few thousand other options. Like I said, we mourn not just Lou, but the loss of raw newness.

I think of another groundbreaking, transgressive artist of his day: Bing Crosby. He crossed the color line, put jazz in the mix, and was (after Jolson) pretty much the first superstar. But his context (the war, the big bands, etc.) vanished. And now his cd's go unlistened to, to even at the one cent price that Amazon offers them for. I just read a bit about Lou Reed's New York, which of course is gone -even gone -er then the big bands.

First the context vanishes, then there's the big history re-write (Lou was a wonderful humanitarian, not a tortured, difficult person who had too many shock treatments), and then the big fade. I was reading about a Glam Rock box set and of course, bad old Garry Glitter has been neatly airbrushed out of the history and the compilation. Stuff like Noel Coward and Jaques Brel is included instead as influential. Will future generations really believe that Slade were namechecking Noel Coward? You get the history you just sorta get.

The only thing that usually survives down through the ages are the songs and a truncated snapshot of the artist.

The songs tend to lack a beat or tunefulness. You appreciate them rather than enjoy them. Not a recipe for a longevity guarantee.

The image will shrink down to the sunglasses and the sneer -a brainer Sid Vicious. Lou saw this in his own lifetime. He may have loved Delmore Schwartz, but Delmore was likewise forgotten before Lou ever started touting him -and to no avail. Who here ever bought a Delmore Schwartz book, even while loving Lou? Not me.

The only thing that keeps on keeping on is the urge for adventure, the hunger for the shock of the new and that seems to have taken a beating in recent decades too. Kids today seek shelter from the income distribution storm, not so much to go out and challenge it.

Although I've moved well past Lou (and Souxie, and Leonard, and most definitely Eno), I'd be thrilled if my step kid listened to Lou Reed.

But she wouldn't, even if bribed. He doesn't sound like a proper singer to her, he sounds like bad karaoke.

< Message edited by Domnotlooking -- 10/30/2013 9:45:09 AM >

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