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RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:28:51 PM   
graceadieu


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quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

This is not a religious issue.


It's only a religious issue for Islam and some weird Asian group that believes in "marriage by capture".
Islam, effectively, through it's required legal system, makes rape legal and then punishes the victim.

How in the name of God is rape not a religious issue in countries that practice sharia?


And yet, and yet, this kind of stuff happens in many countries that are not majority-Muslim, such as the United States, and guys get away with it all the time, even in those countries.

Hell, take the currently-topical rape case in Maryville (Missouri) where two very underage girls (13, I think?) were raped and then dumped unconcious outside in below-freezing temps in t-shirts by their rapists. The guys confessed, and one of the rapes was video recorded, but the DA still dropped the case and the guys got away with it. Oh, and when the one mom pressed charges, they started getting death threats from people in the town and somebody burned their house down. Nobody has been punished for any of it.

< Message edited by graceadieu -- 10/29/2013 9:29:03 PM >

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:38:24 PM   
Phydeaux


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetAnise

However Muslim women are not killed for rape itself. Perhaps some women are killed who's families believe in Honor Killing, but for the rape itself the only person to be killed is the rapist. Rape is a capital punishment and must be proven. And I quote, "There is no Islamic precedence for punishing the victim of sexual assault, even if the assault is not proven. The only exception is if a woman is found to have deliberately and falsely accused an innocent person. In such a case, she may be prosecuted for slander. Sadly, there have been cases where women have attempted to initiate a rape complaint, but ended up being prosecuted and punished for adultery. (Huda)"

Here is a wonderful article called "Competing approaches to rape in Islamic law."

Your article and link said she was arrested but did not say for what. Nor did it say she would receive the death penalty.


This is quite all poppycock.

Rape can only be proved by witnesses. Since, presumably, the men will not witness, there can be no rape proved. The woman's testimony only counts for half of a man.

Rape cannot be proven without witnesses, but sex can be proven by inspection.
The girl will be tried for having sex.

(in reply to SweetAnise)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:41:21 PM   
Phydeaux


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Only historical moral equivalence is weaker than current moral equivalence.
The essence of being a moral person is being able to say: "A is better than B'; not "A and B are equally bad because of something A did a few centuries ago". That, imo, is the domain of the morally bankrupt.

This current, open, flourishing evil, not an historical exercise.

But it isn't anything to do with Islam. It is a cultural practice that long predates the area's conversion to Islam just as the Greco-Roman pedophilia and pederasty had nothing to do with Christianity.


It has everything to do with ISLAM. Go look up how many women are required to have the legal weight of one man.
It is therefore impossible to prosecute rape in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia etc.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:43:59 PM   
NoBimbosAllowed


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux




This is quite all poppycock.

Rape can only be proved by witnesses.


rape-kits and medical professionals trained to use them would beg to differ.

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Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:47:02 PM   
Phydeaux


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

I think they are Bart Stupac: when pushed by the Party/Mosque they agree to whatever evil is required of them.

Then you really know nothing of Muslims. They run the gamut just as members of every other faith do. Following any aspect of sharia is no more required of Muslims than following the mosaic code is of Jews or Christians. All that is required of Muslims is obeying the five pillars, declaring there is no god but Allah, praying five times a day, fasting during Ramadan, giving a set percentage of your income to the poor and making the pilgrimage to Mecca once during their lifetime if that is feasible.

What you obsess over is the repugnant behavior of fundamentalist. Which faith the fundamentalists are is really immaterial. If Christian fundamentalists ever take over a nation you can expect the same sorts of atrocities you now attack Muslims for. Just look into the actions of Oliver Cromwell to see that even "civilized Christians" are capable of atrocities in the name of their faith.


Not true. The earlier verses are subrogated to later versus. All muslims are called to jihad.
Despite your febrile attempts at moral equivalence the religions are not the same.

Despite the actions of men in any religion, the teachings of Christ are in no way similar to the teachings of Mohammed.

Christ
'do good to those that injure you'

Mohommed
'terrorize them, kill them in their sleep'

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:47:07 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Only historical moral equivalence is weaker than current moral equivalence.
The essence of being a moral person is being able to say: "A is better than B'; not "A and B are equally bad because of something A did a few centuries ago". That, imo, is the domain of the morally bankrupt.

This current, open, flourishing evil, not an historical exercise.

But it isn't anything to do with Islam. It is a cultural practice that long predates the area's conversion to Islam just as the Greco-Roman pedophilia and pederasty had nothing to do with Christianity.


It has everything to do with ISLAM. Go look up how many women are required to have the legal weight of one man.
It is therefore impossible to prosecute rape in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia etc.

You made an assumption that the above exchange was about rape. You might want to examine that assumption.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:47:38 PM   
graceadieu


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quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

There you go again. Ignoring facts; in this case he institutionalization of (homosexual) pedophilia in Afghanistan.


That's a very tragic but interesting example. One of the reasons that people liked the Taliban was because, unlike the secular Afghani government, they actually tried to put a stop to that awful (but ancient and institutionalized) practice.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 9:58:12 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

I think they are Bart Stupac: when pushed by the Party/Mosque they agree to whatever evil is required of them.

Then you really know nothing of Muslims. They run the gamut just as members of every other faith do. Following any aspect of sharia is no more required of Muslims than following the mosaic code is of Jews or Christians. All that is required of Muslims is obeying the five pillars, declaring there is no god but Allah, praying five times a day, fasting during Ramadan, giving a set percentage of your income to the poor and making the pilgrimage to Mecca once during their lifetime if that is feasible.

What you obsess over is the repugnant behavior of fundamentalist. Which faith the fundamentalists are is really immaterial. If Christian fundamentalists ever take over a nation you can expect the same sorts of atrocities you now attack Muslims for. Just look into the actions of Oliver Cromwell to see that even "civilized Christians" are capable of atrocities in the name of their faith.


Not true. The earlier verses are subrogated to later versus. All muslims are called to jihad.
Despite your febrile attempts at moral equivalence the religions are not the same.

Despite the actions of men in any religion, the teachings of Christ are in no way similar to the teachings of Mohammed.

Christ
'do good to those that injure you'

Mohommed
'terrorize them, kill them in their sleep'

Christ
he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

Muhammad
He will not enter Paradise whose neighbour is not secure from his wrongful conduct

I've read both the Bible and Qu''ran cover to cover and the teachings of Muhammed and Christ are identical. Both are based on the older semitic faith and both teach a new way that says to love everyone else etc.. Both books also contain passages that can be used to cast doubt on those central themes.

Jihad does not mean holy war as it is so often stated. Jihad literally means struggle. In context in the Qu'ran it means to evangelize as a duty just as the New Testament requires the same behavior of Christians.

(in reply to Phydeaux)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 10:04:02 PM   
graceadieu


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Forget the poll: I'd be a lot more interested to hear how much oil the States are importing from Pakistan if we're talking bizarre statements with no connection to reality...


The better question would be how much oil Pakistan is importing from the United States. According to 5 minutes of research I just did on the CIA World Factbook website, Pakistan produces a small amount of oil, doesn't export any of it, and imports more than it produces.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 10:11:31 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: graceadieu


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Forget the poll: I'd be a lot more interested to hear how much oil the States are importing from Pakistan if we're talking bizarre statements with no connection to reality...


The better question would be how much oil Pakistan is importing from the United States. According to 5 minutes of research I just did on the CIA World Factbook website, Pakistan produces a small amount of oil, doesn't export any of it, and imports more than it produces.

Pakistan is not the middle east. It is a very long way from the areas that are oil rich and the underlying geography is not the sort where you would expect to find oil. The uplift of the Himalayas long ago destroyed any oil that was in the area. There might be oil shale or the like buried somewhere in the area but there hasn't been enough erosion to bring it to the surface.

(in reply to graceadieu)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 10:18:41 PM   
graceadieu


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

I think they are Bart Stupac: when pushed by the Party/Mosque they agree to whatever evil is required of them.

Then you really know nothing of Muslims. They run the gamut just as members of every other faith do. Following any aspect of sharia is no more required of Muslims than following the mosaic code is of Jews or Christians. All that is required of Muslims is obeying the five pillars, declaring there is no god but Allah, praying five times a day, fasting during Ramadan, giving a set percentage of your income to the poor and making the pilgrimage to Mecca once during their lifetime if that is feasible.

What you obsess over is the repugnant behavior of fundamentalist. Which faith the fundamentalists are is really immaterial. If Christian fundamentalists ever take over a nation you can expect the same sorts of atrocities you now attack Muslims for. Just look into the actions of Oliver Cromwell to see that even "civilized Christians" are capable of atrocities in the name of their faith.


And I've known Muslims that don't pray 5 times a day and don't fast the whole time and who knows if they give to the poor. A Muslim friend of mine gave me liquor for Christmas last year (which is funny, because neither of us are Christian), which I feel like is probably not, uh, kosher. Halal. Whatever.

It's true that, right now, generally speaking, Muslim fundamentalists tend to be more extreme and more likely to be violent than their Christian counterparts. But look back in the Middle Ages - it was the opposite. And look at America-born Muslims, who tend to be very, well, American. So I feel like it's probably not something inherent to Islam, but rather something with the modern culture and socioeconomic/geopolitical situation in the Middle East and Central Asia.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/29/2013 10:48:11 PM   
NoBimbosAllowed


Posts: 1450
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Status: offline 		meanwhile, those guys you mentioned from Missouri, graceadieu?

were they privileged varsity Troglodytes?

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Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 3:28:40 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Or:

How do you feel about the subway bombings and bombers?

A. I support them.
B. I have some sympathy for their actions.
C. I neither support them nor have sympathy for them.
D. I hate the bombers and think they should be executed by decapitation effected by high-powered streams of pigs blood, their bodies first encased in pig leather, then buried at an unknown location in the Marianas Trench in lead coffins filled with pig shit. Finally, their families should be charged the full cost thereof.

Like that. A continuum.



And so it continuums.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 3:33:41 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

People who are unable to see the difference in sharia- as practiced- and Christianity- as practiced- are fools.

How many Jews have been executed for violating the "Mosaic Code"? Go back as far as you like- say ten years- then reread the atrocities listed in just the one link posted above.

People who are unable to make moral choices see value in the puerile moral equivalence pablum you preach. I do not.

So you agree then that Muslims who do not follow every tenet of sharia, i.e. almost all Muslims, are not inherently all the bad stuff you ascribed to them?



I just love it when someone gets all upset because someone else is making sweeping generalizations about a group and then turns around and does the same thing himself.


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Afghanistan- and other parts of the Muslim world. Common fucking knowledge actually.

Bacha Bazi

That practice predates Islam as does very similar behavior on Greece and Rome predates Christianity but the practice continued for quite some time in the Greco-Roman sphere after Christianity became the dominant faith.

And I'll just leave for contemplation the institutionalization of pedophilia amongst the priests and ministers etc. of Christianity.



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Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 4:46:59 AM   
Lucylastic


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Status: offline 		I think that was his point.... Certainly how I read it, fact...not all pedophiles are priests, not all preists are pedos.... Not all muslims support rape of women.... not all rapists are muslims
I alluded to it myself. more than once

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Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 4:51:33 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

I think that was his point.... Certainly how I read it, fact...not all pedophiles are priests, not all preists are pedos.... Not all muslims support rape of women.... not all rapists are muslims
I alluded to it myself. more than once



You could be right. I may be getting him confused with another poster. If that is the case I apologize.

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Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 5:01:58 AM   
Lucylastic


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_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 7:01:20 AM   
tweakabelle


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From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Only historical moral equivalence is weaker than current moral equivalence.
The essence of being a moral person is being able to say: "A is better than B'; not "A and B are equally bad because of something A did a few centuries ago". That, imo, is the domain of the morally bankrupt.

This current, open, flourishing evil, not an historical exercise.


If you think that the "essence of being a moral person" is being able to rationalise judgements/prejudices that bignote your own worldview and help you feel superior to others, you have an awful lot to learn about morality.

You seem fond of Christian adages so here's one you might like to contemplate to help guide you in your quest for moral purity:
'Let those without sin cast the first stone.'

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 10/30/2013 7:02:56 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 10:22:35 AM   
VideoAdminChi


Posts: 3086
Joined: 8/6/2012
Status: offline 		FR,

A number of posts have been removed. As a reminder, you may attack the post, but not the poster.

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Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Another outrage from the R of P - 10/30/2013 10:49:57 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
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Status: offline 		Like 27% of British Muslims admitting to supporting the subway bombings there.

83% of non torries admitted to supporting the boston tea party.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 80
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