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BamaD -> RE: Anotther school shooting. (12/24/2013 9:56:38 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: EdBowie
I'm not sure what schools you are talking about. I'm used to seeing a good sized school have it's own bus garage which puts the drivers on campus 2 to 3 hours a day while checking in and checking out.
And one more time, it isn't the range of possible numbers that causes the worst case scenario, it is that a CCW doesn't prepare people to handle an active shooter situation without a large risk of making things worse
If it's 3 or 30 armed employees, in order to minimize the chance for things to go wrong, there needs to be a much higher level of training than a CCW class offers, and a much higher level of coordination than acting independently.
quote:
ORIGINAL: BamaD
quote:
ORIGINAL: EdBowie
Try 80 teachers per 1,000 students (schools teach more than one subject these days), plus administrators, plus the people I listed below. 12 to run the cafeteria, the physical plant, transportation, and all clerical? Nope, doesn't add up.
And bus drivers, etc. aren't employees? Says who?
And none of that addresses the fact that even a smaller pool of armed people with only CCW training, are more dangerous to everyone else during an active shooter situation.
quote:
ORIGINAL: BamaD
quote:
ORIGINAL: EdBowie
And for every hundred teachers, how many coaches, bus drivers, maintenance people, clerical staff, and so on?
The worst case scenario is still undesirable with even a handful of untrained people, especially the very people who would think that their 16 hours CCW class equipped the to be effective is n active shooter situation.
Part of the overall US gun culture is a widespread belief that all American males are born experts at driving, lovemaking, holding their liquor, and conquering evil in a crisis...
Reality disagrees.
quote:
ORIGINAL: BamaD
quote:
ORIGINAL: EdBowie
Why do you think that 20 - 30 is an unreasonable number to have carry permits?
I'm not envisioning the little red schoolhouse, I'm talking about a school of 1,000 or more kids, and a hundred or more employees.
As far as track record, I only know that Arkansas passed such a law, and most schools in that state opted out on a faculty vote.
quote:
ORIGINAL: lovmuffin
You're probably right about spending the money. If we dropped the gun free zones designations and just let school employees who have permits carry, there wouldn't be any additional costs. However if this is adopted by most schools, I'm sure some Zimmerman type of fuck up would eventually happen though certainly nothing to the extent of 30 teachers running around waving guns.
Now I'm curious what the history has been with the 3 states and parts of Texas that have been allowing concealed carry in their schools. I believe Utah has recently approved it and it's under consideration in other states.
Statistically with 100 teachers no more than 4 or 5 would be expected to have permits.
When you consider that educators tend to be liberal it could be even less.
For starters with 1000 students you would have not more than 40 teachers, to be generous 1 dozen more for clerical and maintenance , bus drivers don't count.
That gives us 52 people. Only about 5% of people get permits so you have maybe 3.
Double the staff ok. That brigs you up to six or seven eligible to carry.
Sure bus drivers are employees, but they don't count in this conversation because thy don't work INSIDE the schools.
Just pointing out the problems with your math.
Move the total employees to 200 and statistically that would still only have 10 people with permits.
With at least half of them teachers it cuts the number down more.
As I stated in another post armed guards are much better.
I have never been around a school system were each school has their own busses.
All of them I have seen shared busses among various levels of schools.
Thus the busses were in a centralized location, thus the bus drivers spend 0 time inside the schools.
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