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pg4g -> Fallout (2/6/2014 12:27:00 PM)

Ok, now I'm hazardous to start a thread specifically about me, but here goes.

I recently had a scene with my partner, unrestrained, where he pretty roughly destroyed me inside and out. I was ok, but asked for just some closer, slower, less painful things. He accidentally went way too rough real quick and I safeworded instantly, and left and sat in a running shower to cool off. My emotions were pretty tough at that time. He then proceeded to blame me and tell me I was being selfish for trying to avoid him locking myself in the bathroom to avoid him.

Since then, I'm hesitant to even let him touch me, and I'm doubtful I'll ever come around to being under someone's control again.

Is this normal fallout from a particularly rough experience? I know he didn't mean to harm me but I feel extremely vulnerable and weak.



SpyUnderCover -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:01:32 PM)

I can understand you feeling vulnerable, but you don't seem weak to me. You sound like you've done a very good job of setting limits and taking care of yourself under the circumstances. I'm hesitant to say what a "normal" reaction is but I think you've been true to yourself through this experience. Your partner had no business blaming you or calling you selfish. It sounds like he's either not very experienced at domination, or not in tune with your needs and limits, or both. What you needed was some aftercare and he fell far short of that, IMO.

Spy



ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:11:00 PM)

This, in spades:

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpyUnderCover

I can understand you feeling vulnerable, but you don't seem weak to me. You sound like you've done a very good job of setting limits and taking care of yourself under the circumstances. I'm hesitant to say what a "normal" reaction is but I think you've been true to yourself through this experience. Your partner had no business blaming you or calling you selfish. It sounds like he's either not very experienced at domination, or not in tune with your needs and limits, or both. What you needed was some aftercare and he fell far short of that, IMO.

Spy


The accidentally got too rough I question, it says he wasn't paying close attention to you during the scene. That his or her job as the dominant. Now, everyone makes mistakes, I have made some doozies. This man compounded it exponentially by blaming you and calling you selfish for locking yourself away.

And yes, what you needed was some serious aftercare, not a baby dom tantrum. It may take some time to get over that session, reasons to know who you play with.

I agree that you took care of yourself *very* well, and though I know the entire thing is sucky, give yourself some major credit for that, please.



Rawni -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:22:17 PM)

Blame the submissive! Blame the submissive and if your punk ass is successful, the submissive will blame themselves. [8|]

It is one thing to hurt someone... but to go this far that he would not care for you, take care of you and own up to his childish behavior, you don't have a dom, you have a punk ass. (I love taking punk asses down... they were my favorite prey once upon a time.)

Hugs... I hope you will be able to trust again... but give yourself time to heal and maybe one day you will meet someone more considerate and healthy for you.

Personally... in my mind I think what he has done is criminal... whether criminal or not. He has caused you life wounds and I am so sorry that happened.



pg4g -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:45:17 PM)

Is he inexperienced? Yes. Did he make some mistakes? Yes. But he misread a physical cue from me, and I personally understand I did give off the wrong impression which he read and thought "oh ok, you want rougher than this." I'm not blaming myself, but I did make a bad move that he misread. I just don't want you to think he's a bad guy, cos my god no one in my life have I ever seen more caring than him. He was just overly stressed and was going "I'm the one who's had a bad week and you're the one in a bad mood? Stop being selfish."

But I do feel vulnerable, and as a switch, my head is swimming with "be a man and dominate" and "you're such a weak bastard you couldn't handle it. Don't make yourself that vulnerable again. Go vanilla or dominate only." [&:]



Rawni -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:50:03 PM)

Don't excuse poor behavior. You may have sent off a miscue, but... BUT, I don't care how bad your week goes.. when you have hurt someone the response of... me, me, me... and not, you, you you and what I did to hurt you, is childish at best.



RedMagic1 -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 1:55:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pg4g
He was just overly stressed and was going "I'm the one who's had a bad week and you're the one in a bad mood? Stop being selfish."

This is a guaranteed way to lose a submissive. As in, end of relationship, and the sub decides "nope, no more subbing." So it doesn't really matter how stressed he was. This is one of the few cardinal sins you never, ever do.

The worst time I hurt someone more or less involved going into her butt with insufficient lube. She started screaming in a very not-fun way and I stopped everything immediately. A few days later, we were in the kitchen and I noticed she was limping. I said, "Wow, you're still limping." She smiled and replied, "Oh, don't worry about it, I can barely feel it anymore." One of the most touching moments I've ever felt. She was trying so hard to support me, to reassure me I was doing a good job. But I don't think we would have been at that point if I had been selfish or defensive. I put her safety and comfort as a priority and to hell with my sex drive. And she appreciated it. (I still felt like shit, and she probably felt worse, but there was no long-term emotional damage.)



Blueswordsman -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:14:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pg4g

Ok, now I'm hazardous to start a thread specifically about me, but here goes.

I recently had a scene with my partner, unrestrained, where he pretty roughly destroyed me inside and out. I was ok, but asked for just some closer, slower, less painful things. He accidentally went way too rough real quick and I safeworded instantly, and left and sat in a running shower to cool off. My emotions were pretty tough at that time. He then proceeded to blame me and tell me I was being selfish for trying to avoid him locking myself in the bathroom to avoid him.

Since then, I'm hesitant to even let him touch me, and I'm doubtful I'll ever come around to being under someone's control again.

Is this normal fallout from a particularly rough experience? I know he didn't mean to harm me but I feel extremely vulnerable and weak.

A Dom should know what his lady is capable of and how far she can be pushed. Yours went too far to fast and your self defense mechanism caused you to lock the door. I think he called you selfish because he did know how to react. You both need to talk about what happened and make sure things like that never happen again.



SeekingTrinity -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:17:15 PM)

~FRing it~

First rule of dominance is owning your shit, not blaming or berating your s-type for your screw ups. Since you are a switch too, OP...what would you have done if you were in a dominant position and this Dom person was in a submissive role? This was a shitty way to handle the situation on his part. Period. End of story. Don't own his fuck up as your fuck up. Submitting can trigger some powerful feelings and emotions. Even if a cue was misread, the last thing that should have been done was belittle you the way you were belittled. There is no harm in realizing I hurt someone, apologizing profusely for that error, sucking up my "I had a shitty week" insignificance, and providing the one I hurt with the proper aftercare they needed. Sometimes a dominant has to step away from "me, me, me" for a bit.



RedMagic1 -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:20:46 PM)

Agree with SeekingTrinity.

Another way to think about it is: a safe word needs to create a safe situation. If it doesn't, the foundation of BDSM trust is gone.



FieryOpal -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:22:41 PM)

My comments are specifically geared toward what little I know about you and do not apply to anyone else whatsoever. You seem shaken up, and I truly hope that you can trust your partner again because from other posts you've made, it seems that you have found a suitable match to switch with. I'm sure that isn't easy to find.

You are the more Dominant one in this relationship, from what I've gathered. Therefore, your partner looks to you for leadership and guidance. What he did was wrong, which he compounded by reacting improperly and caused more damage as a result.

I really want to be of some help to you in this situation. I apologize in advance if I make any erroneous assumptions. You prefer your partner to overpower you while you are overpowering him. This can get tricky. He may have misread you, and neither of you want your vulnerabilities exposed in this pseudo-macho dynamic. It's great that you both use a safe word. May I suggest that you both agree to use a preliminary safe word as well with one another? Yellow for caution prior to finally saying Red? This would send a clear message that you or your partner needs to back off at that point before anything escalates or spirals out of control.

It doesn't serve any purpose for either of you to blame yourselves or one another. Think of this incident as a learning experience and hopefully, in time, trust can be regained between the two of you. Another recommendation is to make sure you clear the air between yourselves prior to engaging in intense, edgy play. No bottled up resentments or reasons for one-upsmanship in your fighting/wrestling-for-control matches. Forgiveness goes a long way and so does tenderness, which should be incorporated into any relationship. After any scene, don't neglect to make aftercare a priority, a mandatory ending to restore equilibrium.



SeekingTrinity -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:25:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

Another way to think about it is: a safe word needs to create a safe situation. If it doesn't, the foundation of BDSM trust is gone.


Amen, RedMagic! Beautifully put



DesFIP -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:34:10 PM)

Anybody can make a mistake. However, calling you selfish compounds it and that isn't acceptable. He fucked up and then decided the best way to cover his ass was to blame the victim. I can't blame you for not trusting him anymore.

Now if this all happened in the immediate aftermath, then topdrop could be why he reacted so badly. If so, then assuming you had a strong relationship beforehand, what you folks need to do is go out for coffee and talk about it calmly. Not about what happened but what both of you were feeling. And about what you both need in terms of aftercare.

If it wasn't a relationship, just a casual play partner, then how to develop trust in the future comes in discussing the aftercare before the need for it happens. If he knew that you need some alone time for a half an hour, and then need to cuddle, he might not have been such an ass. If he had insisted that cuddling had to happen right away even when that makes things worse for you, then you would have known ahead of time that you aren't compatible.

So for next time, have the discussion first. Determine compatibility first.



Rawni -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 2:39:41 PM)

Since this incident, has he tried to talk to you or apologize?



orgasmdenial12 -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 3:09:25 PM)

Just to give an alternative perspective.

Imagine you're with someone who wants you to hurt them. So you do it, maybe you get it a bit wrong, and they instantly stop the scene, are mad at you, run off into another room and lock themselves in and refuse to come out and talk to you, and seem really furious at you.

How are you going to feel? You're probably going to feel a bit hurt and angry.

And now that person is acting all traumatised and saying they doubt they can ever trust anyone again.

Isn't it going to seem like a teensy bit of an overreaction? Isn't it all going to be a little bit annoying?

Yes, I have flipped out at Doms in the past. I have sworn, thrown things, cried, blamed them, complained about them - all of it. I'm not being judgmental.

But it's really easy to forget that being a Dom is stressful and scary and emotionally demanding and that sometimes, they don't always get it right.

In any relationship, love, forgiveness, compromise, understanding and empathy go a long way. I would say that it's probably no different in your relationship.

Take a deep breath and get back on the horse, it'll be the best thing for both of you.



pg4g -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 3:11:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FieryOpal
You are the more Dominant one in this relationship, from what I've gathered. Therefore, your partner looks to you for leadership and guidance. What he did was wrong, which he compounded by reacting improperly and caused more damage as a result.

I apologize in advance if I make any erroneous assumptions. You prefer your partner to overpower you while you are overpowering him. This can get tricky. He may have misread you, and neither of you want your vulnerabilities exposed in this pseudo-macho dynamic.


Thanks Fiery, yeah you do get me (and him) a lot. Actually surprised me.

In this particular instance, our fighting dynamic didn't apply. He was too exhausted and I knew the only way to actually have any intimacy was for me to willingly agree, which made this far harder. It pushed my mind to go "see, this is what happens when you're weak and you give in" which wasn't helpful and I know is just myself getting emotional.

I've considered traffic lights before, but I thought it was a little corny. But in this situation because the intensity and pain was that intense, I wouldn't have had a chance to Yellow then Red. Literally 2 seconds and I was almost in tears. He asked me if I was ok. I said "I'm fine, not injured" and then he wouldn't accept that so I left to get some alone time and get composed as I'd started shaking and my head was awash.

It's a very difficult time for us emotionally anyway. I'm about to head out on deployment for 5 months, with another 6 month deployment slated for directly after it, and it's our last 2 weeks together. He hasn't seen me due to his work for a week, which leaves us 7 days of enjoying our company and then I'm away for a long time. We're pretty close in a 5 year relationship, so this is going to be tough. My head's awash with a lot, and mixing these emotions with that stuff is hard.


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Now if this all happened in the immediate aftermath, then topdrop could be why he reacted so badly. If so, then assuming you had a strong relationship beforehand, what you folks need to do is go out for coffee and talk about it calmly. Not about what happened but what both of you were feeling. And about what you both need in terms of aftercare.



Aftercare was a significant issue here. He just left me there and I was thinking "ok, mate, I need you holding me" and he'd just left me there.

Nevertheless, I'm cognisant of the fact I have limited time with him before I deploy, so I decided I'd like to...well... be intimate, and I let it slide. Instead, I ended up impaled, in pain, screaming for it to stop, already tender and being roughly destroyed. The emotions of both elements of the event left me feeling extremely vulnerable, and I sort of fell apart.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rawni

Since this incident, has he tried to talk to you or apologize?



Talk, yeah. He wanted to understand what I was upset about because he had no idea, and he didn't seem to catch the fact that while I'm actually a strong guy, after that type of play it can leave me emotionally a little messed up and in need of aftercare and intimacy (which is rare for me - I hold men at arms distance, or fight them), and instead I just got... slammed and blamed.

I tried to explain that that's the one spot where I feel vulnerable and need intimacy and he just... didn't seem to get that there was any issue. He thought that's how I'd wanted it.

I appreciate why he feels that way, and we have talked it out, but I still feel messed the hell up. Like I shouldn't let myself get that vulnerable again.



pg4g -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 3:20:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: orgasmdenial12

Just to give an alternative perspective.

Imagine you're with someone who wants you to hurt them. So you do it, maybe you get it a bit wrong, and they instantly stop the scene, are mad at you, run off into another room and lock themselves in and refuse to come out and talk to you, and seem really furious at you.

How are you going to feel? You're probably going to feel a bit hurt and angry.

And now that person is acting all traumatised and saying they doubt they can ever trust anyone again.

Isn't it going to seem like a teensy bit of an overreaction? Isn't it all going to be a little bit annoying?

Yes, I have flipped out at Doms in the past. I have sworn, thrown things, cried, blamed them, complained about them - all of it. I'm not being judgmental.

But it's really easy to forget that being a Dom is stressful and scary and emotionally demanding and that sometimes, they don't always get it right.

In any relationship, love, forgiveness, compromise, understanding and empathy go a long way. I would say that it's probably no different in your relationship.

Take a deep breath and get back on the horse, it'll be the best thing for both of you.


Thanks for that, and I completely agree. Heck, I'm a lot stronger, and had I been restrained and gagged, I could have handled it. The fact was I had the CHANCE to stop it easily, and I flipped. I could have handled this, and I am angry that I didn't just grit my teeth and bear it.

I agree that it is stressful for him, and I understand and comprehend entirely the issue he had with it. My head, however, is just so angry that I didn't endure and grit through it, and I should have, and now I feel:

a) angry at myself
b) ashamed that I was even willingly subbing in the first place - I don't do that
c) ashamed that I reacted as childishly as I did
d) ashamed that I didn't hack something I really could have grit my teeth and endured
e) a little annoyed at the lack of aftercare that he simply didn't understand me about
f) defensive. I want to protect myself from having to feel these things again and the idea of losing control at all right now makes me want to throw up.



GoddessManko -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 3:22:36 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pg4g

Ok, now I'm hazardous to start a thread specifically about me, but here goes.

I recently had a scene with my partner, unrestrained, where he pretty roughly destroyed me inside and out. I was ok, but asked for just some closer, slower, less painful things. He accidentally went way too rough real quick and I safeworded instantly, and left and sat in a running shower to cool off. My emotions were pretty tough at that time. He then proceeded to blame me and tell me I was being selfish for trying to avoid him locking myself in the bathroom to avoid him.

Since then, I'm hesitant to even let him touch me, and I'm doubtful I'll ever come around to being under someone's control again.

Is this normal fallout from a particularly rough experience? I know he didn't mean to harm me but I feel extremely vulnerable and weak.


OK, just from what I'm reading and not knowing either one of you I'm going to say two things. #1: I'm sure he might be a nice guy, but NOT all nice guys are good and responsible Doms.
I know some really nice people I would never leave to be in charge of a small child or pet, EVER. It's just the way it is and it doesn't mean they are bad people.
#2: It seems like you are generally new to the lifestyle in general and perhaps this is your first Dom and that you are not even sure yourself of where the line between masochism and self preservation lies.
I am seeing some HUGE red flags waving.
Firstly, if he is as nice a guy as you say and you guys value the relationship (generally like each other in most settings) and the kink is merely a perk, then you should definitely lay some HARD limits, ground rules and he needs to be receptive to what YOUR needs and YOUR pace may be as a sub.
I really think a bad experience can not only cause a fallout (possibly permanent) with your Dom but also turn you off to the lifestyle completely.
It has happened to me where subs offer body dismorphic activities, they literally said I can distort their bodies any way I choose.
I also remember on some of the old yahoo message boards more than half of Doms when asked if they would castrate a sub (of those who answered) said yes.
Now I always thought I was on the stricter side of the lifestyle but even some of these activities were a bit further than I was willing to push the envelope. (If as a sub I'm considering, I'm cringing at the thought of viewing your previous Domme's handiwork it's a sign because I have seen fun things done with saw saws.)
Bottom line is every sub's limit differs and part of the REALLY HUGE job of being a Dom is being able to be IN TUNE with your sub and guage their limits through careful observation and a gentle pushing of the envelope, not a thoughtless dumping in a paper shredder.

I love my subs, this is ridiculous to even read, but I really do admire your continued respect for your Dom despite all that and your hopefulness that you can both overcome this really huge speed bump.
[sm=ballchain.gif][sm=crop.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=domme.gif]



pg4g -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 3:49:10 PM)

Ok guys thanks for your advice. I will chat with him some more. Just discuss needs of aftercare and limits and not blaming someone if they need some alone time.

Hopefully it'll all sort out. Should be fine, and hopefully I can get comfortable with that again.

Thanks for your wise words.



littlewonder -> RE: Fallout (2/6/2014 5:13:55 PM)

You both are stressed out! I mean you're leaving for deployment and neither of you have had time to spend together before you leave. You're both emotionally vulnerable right now...not just you, not just him. You both took your emotions out on the other because you both have been holding it all in. And then wham! You get this time together and you both emotionally break down and you both are now afraid to bring up some tender subjects and intimacy that needs to be cleared up before you leave.

This wasn't just your fault or his. It was naturally something that was bound to happen from all the tension in the air between you two.

Now, how to fix it? Talk, talk, talk and talk some more. Talk about all those little touchy subjects neither of you want to bring up, talk about how you both will miss each other, how rough it's going to be, etc....

I remember how tough it was when deployments happened and one was left far away either till he came back or I moved to be with him. It's stressful!

So do both of yourselves a favor and sit down like two rational adults and talk about what happened and anything else that needs to be said. No arguing! No getting mad! No walking out! Listen to each other. Really listen....no half assed listening. Be each other's support.



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