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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/5/2014 4:03:02 AM   
ARIES83


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I find this thread very interesting, mainly because... Although I haven't had a emotionless service kind of arrangement. From what I'm imagining it as... I could see that being a pretty very cool experience for both sides of the equation.

If someone had these kind of service needs... Then going somewhere to be told what to do and carry out tasks, in an authoritative, personal situation. Could probably fill those needs.

And personally. I could see myself doing this for someone... Being the authoritative presence, directing the person... And it being a purely non-intimate arrangement.

I'd probably enjoy it, I'd probably even drag them around town like a sidekick or intern.

And also, I see this as an interesting method of testing the waters, or seeing if serving a certain person feels right, and is something you enjoy, before getting further involved with them.
I would normally advocate starting off a vanillaish relationship with a prospective D/s partner. But setting out a non-intimate, non-physical period of a pure service arrangement could be equally appropriate, for some.

It would be an interesting and probably fun! experiment for me if nothing else.

As for Doms wanting this from subs... Like everything I'd just advise people to have their bullshit detector on. There was a guy not long ago who was looking for "skilled slaves" to work for him for free as a part of their slavery...

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/5/2014 5:50:08 AM   
LadyConstanze


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FieryOpal

No, I absolutely cannot imagine myself having a non-sexual service sub, much less one without an emotional involvement. It seems to me some subs want to become part of a family structure, a sense of belonging to an adoptive family dynamic. Not always the young ones either. I can't really fathom an emotionless bond, as this to me would be paradoxical, or an M/s oxymoron.



It can actually work really really well, I had a guy who had a fetish for cleaning shoes, it was a bit difficult for me to get my head around, I felt like I was exploiting him, leaving my dirty shoes (any kind really but boots were a special treat for him) at the back door, he would pick them up after work and take them home with him, the next day before he went to work, he would leave them at my back door, highly polished, if they needed soles or heels, he would take them to the cobbler, I wanted to pay for it because I felt like a free-loader, he acted like I insulted him...
You know why it ended? He also sometimes left presents, while I was still smoking a packet of cigarettes (quite expensive in the UK and the brand I like was about £9) in return he on rare occasions asked to be my ashtray), bottles of very nice red wine, new liners for my Hunters (in return he took the old sweaty ones)... I thanked him (manners really) and that really threw him off his stride and ruined the experience for him. He wanted to be the faceless shoe slave and I shouldn't give a toss about him, by thanking him, I ruined his fantasy and fetish...

So should I find a guy like that again, I'll do my best to not ruin his fetish ;) My shoes have never been that shiny and well cared for ever since!

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/5/2014 5:59:35 AM   
DaddyMax4you


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I don't emotions are preventable. I think it probably be more accurate to set limits on the type of relationship that people may want. A person may want an emotional relationship, but not want some one who is seeking marriage. A person might not want to have a more romantic experience, but will want to have emotionally intimate dynamics. It's really more of a how much d/s vs how much vanilla type of debate. Some people need more vanilla, some people need less. But emotions are natural, normal human experiences unconnected to relationships. Perhaps, emotional bonds between the two people is the more accurate term.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/5/2014 9:41:59 PM   
littlewonder


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quote:

ORIGINAL: breagha

hello all...

it has come to my attention recently that some D types require service without emotions attached. i'm not talking about kinky playtime. i'm talking about things that happen on a daily routine basis. Cleaning, chores, tasks... whatever you want to call it.

i'm writing here to ask... is it possible to serve your Owner without emotional attachment? If so, how does one separate the adoration/love that usually develops within a M/s relationship and keep it from developing?



I had a relationship like this in the past but he wasn't my Master or owner. He was simply a Dom that I served. I did chores and such as you mentioned and he was a nice guy to talk to so I did things for him. There was no emotional connection between us other than two people liked to talk to one another and I had a need to be of service to someone at the time. Since I was single and not really looking at the time, it just was something that worked for us at the time.

We both eventually moved on though because we both found someone else to be with in a committed, long term relationship.

It's possible but you have to be sure it's someone that you won't fall in love or lust with. Some people seem more prone to this than others, especially newbies who get sub frenzy. If you are this type of person or a person who falls in love or lust at the drop of a dime and are extremely sensitive then I would suggest you not go this route at all. Beware!

Basically if you cannot compartmentalize people in your life then this is not something you should do.


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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 2:37:13 AM   
FieryOpal


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

ORIGINAL: FieryOpal

No, I absolutely cannot imagine myself having a non-sexual service sub, much less one without an emotional involvement. It seems to me some subs want to become part of a family structure, a sense of belonging to an adoptive family dynamic. Not always the young ones either. I can't really fathom an emotionless bond, as this to me would be paradoxical, or an M/s oxymoron.

It can actually work really really well, I had a guy who had a fetish for cleaning shoes, it was a bit difficult for me to get my head around, I felt like I was exploiting him, leaving my dirty shoes (any kind really but boots were a special treat for him) at the back door, he would pick them up after work and take them home with him, the next day before he went to work, he would leave them at my back door, highly polished, if they needed soles or heels, he would take them to the cobbler, I wanted to pay for it because I felt like a free-loader, he acted like I insulted him...
You know why it ended? He also sometimes left presents, while I was still smoking a packet of cigarettes (quite expensive in the UK and the brand I like was about £9) in return he on rare occasions asked to be my ashtray), bottles of very nice red wine, new liners for my Hunters (in return he took the old sweaty ones)... I thanked him (manners really) and that really threw him off his stride and ruined the experience for him. He wanted to be the faceless shoe slave and I shouldn't give a toss about him, by thanking him, I ruined his fantasy and fetish...

So should I find a guy like that again, I'll do my best to not ruin his fetish ;) My shoes have never been that shiny and well cared for ever since!

That would feel so creepy...stalkerish. Almost like having some guy take (steal, if non-consensual) your underwear, sniff it & rub it over parts of his body, then return it to you washed & folded.

The gift-leaving part reveals an emotional attachment. These were personal gifts for you. Being emotionless or detached, and hiding or suppressing your emotions is not the same. Kinda sends off alarm bells, so maybe your unanticipated courteousness chasing him off was a good thing in the long run.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 4:20:38 AM   
LadyConstanze


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Nope, he wasn't stealing or taking my shoes, he asked me to leave them there for him to clean. At the time this happened I didn't understand that his fetish was to be the "shoe cleaner", strictly a service and so low on the pecking order that he had to leave gifts basically his way of "paying" for having his fetish needs met.

Nothing stalkerish about it at all, it was all very consensual, he asked me to clean my shoes, he was always very very respectful, he WANTED to feel like a lowly servant, that was his deal, basically "not worthy to even clean the shoes for free", that's how he got his rocks off, that is not a bad thing at all. And cleaning shoes is a bit different than a guy taking and sniffing my undies....

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 4:26:40 AM   
pg4g


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I suppose in a way I find that... nice. Not stalkerish.

The Christian in me that sees such a desire to serve and thinks of Christ washing his disciples' feet.

I am curious though, LadyContanze... How did you find all this out about how he functioned? Did you ask him? It would surprise me if he'd divulge this information.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 5:08:21 AM   
LadyConstanze


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Well I met him online on another board, he was the collared submissive of a domme but she got married, things got in the way, he got released, that was 6 or 7 years ago, I moved to the UK and it turned out that I moved into the same town where he lived. He asked me about cleaning my shoes and suggested the arrangement which worked well for about a year or so.

When it ended, I was puzzled and sat down, actually I only recently figured out what happened, but looking back how his relationship with his previous dominant was, the way he acted and things he said, it was pretty clear what was going on, at the time I really didn't see it, so hindsight 20/20

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 5:17:12 AM   
kalikshama


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama
quote:

it has come to my attention recently that some D types require service without emotions attached.




I've had several service-only relationships and none of them required no emotional attachment, in fact, all of them preferred that I have feelings for them.

What an excellent opportunity for discussion!

Would that be emotional attachment on your part or on their part?




By "none of them required no emotional attachment" I meant "none of them required that I not be emotionally attached to them." Two of them definitely had feelings for me, possibly love, but not "in love." As for the third, I couldn't tell, which is one of the reasons I ended the relationship.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:04:48 AM   
FieryOpal


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

Nope, he wasn't stealing or taking my shoes, he asked me to leave them there for him to clean. At the time this happened I didn't understand that his fetish was to be the "shoe cleaner", strictly a service and so low on the pecking order that he had to leave gifts basically his way of "paying" for having his fetish needs met.

Nothing stalkerish about it at all, it was all very consensual, he asked me to clean my shoes, he was always very very respectful, he WANTED to feel like a lowly servant, that was his deal, basically "not worthy to even clean the shoes for free", that's how he got his rocks off, that is not a bad thing at all. And cleaning shoes is a bit different than a guy taking and sniffing my undies....

Of course this arrangement you had with this gentleman was consensual, you left shoes out I take it for him to pick up. I could be wrong but it sounds as if there was a ladies shoe fetish involved, not simply a shoe-cleaning fetish. As long as you both felt comfortable with this arrangement, I wasn't trying to imply that there was anything wrong with it in your case, other than you felt somewhat guilty for the imbalance, and he ended up not wanting to be shown any appreciation. There's a difference between having genuine humility in serving others and having a humiliation fetish. His motivation was apparently not the former because while those with genuine humility do not mind being taken for granted (in that they can overlook deficits in others), they do not insist upon it to the extent that it becomes a matter of angst to them.

Besides, I spoke of how it would make me feel. Footwear is not as intimate as underwear, but for someone to want to have access to my private belongings would make me feel singled out in some way. Hence my use of the word "stalkerish," the wild card being whether or not I could know with certainty what someone's motivations were or whether their intentions were honorable. That would make me feel uncomfortable is what I meant by it. I happen to be a very private person and while I am friendly, I am still wary and cautious of whom I can trust. I am so protective of my pets that I wouldn't trust just anyone to look after them, for instance.

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Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage. - Lao Tzu
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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:09:46 AM   
LadyConstanze


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I wouldn't let anybody look after my pets unless I know the person really well, which kind of limits travel (not all hotels are happy if you bring 2 large dogs along).

You seem to be a bit down on fetishes and everything should be about you in a relationship, isn't that how a person with a fetish feels about their fetish? I really don't think there is much difference there, you want your needs met, the fetishist wants to have their needs met. As long as everything is consensual, it's pretty fine by me.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:16:59 AM   
FieryOpal


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I wouldn't let anybody look after my pets unless I know the person really well, which kind of limits travel (not all hotels are happy if you bring 2 large dogs along).

You seem to be a bit down on fetishes and everything should be about you in a relationship, isn't that how a person with a fetish feels about their fetish? I really don't think there is much difference there, you want your needs met, the fetishist wants to have their needs met. As long as everything is consensual, it's pretty fine by me.

I'm only understanding part of your message. In what way is it "everything should be about" me "in a relationship"? My having standards is a separate issue, my having tight boundaries is my choice. I expect the same in my partner, and I do mean partner, because I don't take on a sub for the sake of having subs. Again, that is my personal standard, others can have their own.

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:28:36 AM   
LadyConstanze


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I was thinking about your comment in another thread, where you do seem to have issues with how other people handle it and that if a guy dares to be open about his fetishes. You seem to expect them to make their whole life about you, which is fine, your fetish so to speak and good for you if you can find it.

quote:

OMG, are there any non-fetishists to be had, Rawni? Because fetishists can't be reasoned with. They are slaves to their fetish, which is why I don't want to own one. Being a slave to two Masters cheats me out of the full ownership I am entitled to as a Mistress. Otherwise, I am Mistress in name only, an empty title.


http://www.collarchat.com/m_4650312/mpage_2/key_/tm.htm#4652128



_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
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http://exdomme.blogspot.com/2012/07/public-service-announcement.html

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:36:20 AM   
FieryOpal


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I was thinking about your comment in another thread, where you do seem to have issues with how other people handle it and that if a guy dares to be open about his fetishes. You seem to expect them to make their whole life about you, which is fine, your fetish so to speak and good for you if you can find it.

quote:

OMG, are there any non-fetishists to be had, Rawni? Because fetishists can't be reasoned with. They are slaves to their fetish, which is why I don't want to own one. Being a slave to two Masters cheats me out of the full ownership I am entitled to as a Mistress. Otherwise, I am Mistress in name only, an empty title.


http://www.collarchat.com/m_4650312/mpage_2/key_/tm.htm#4652128


Yes, that is my choice to not get involved with a guy who is wrapped up in his fetish(es). I don't really see where that is any concern of yours. This is a chastity slave thread where there is a general consensus among the Dommes posting that we're not much into that. As you can see, I addressed my remark to Rawni based on her post. If you have any questions, interest or natural curiosity, I wouldn't mind it if you would be so kind as to PM me for clarification or further discussion. That is all.

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Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage. - Lao Tzu
There is no remedy for love but to love more. - Thoreau

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:42:05 AM   
LadyConstanze


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My my, are we a bit defensive? It's none of my concerns, I'm not the one searching, it's just something you put out on an open message board and apparently you forgot to send me the memo that I'm not allowed to read your posts or form my own opinion - while you tend to give your opinion quite frequently on other people's fetish.

As for PMing you, not really, I'm seriously not interested in personal stuff, I was only commenting what you put out there, but it does strike me that there's a bit of only twue and weal way going on. There are a ton of things that don't float my boat, not a problem and also saying I'm not into them, however I hope I don't ever give the impression that a kink isn't valid because it doesn't happen to be my kink and the person needs to be belittled for their kink...

That clear enough?

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There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
Those who do and those who don't!

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 6:58:33 AM   
MAINEiacMISTRESS


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I am very up front with it being *ALL* about the Service and that there is no sexuality involved. That being said I cannot say there is no EMOTION involved. In My experience there certainly is FRIENDSHIP that develops between Myself and My submissives...there is definitely laughter.

When you think of a Service-oriented D/s relationship as being humiliating, remember that for many people humiliation just happens to be a pleasurable fetish for them. That in itself can be sufficient fuel to drive them in performing domestic Service.

Some males who contact Me say their wife is vanilla and has no desire to have them Serve, not even to give them a "Honey Do" list. They get love and sexuality from their wife, but not the Domination, Direction, Management, Discipline, Humiliation, or whatever else they happen to desire, so they turn to someone (like Me and others like Me) who will give them that situation, without any sexuality involved.

It also doesn't mean ATTACHMENT cannot form from this, for do not FRIENDS form attachments, just as FRIENDS? You'd help a friend do spring cleaning, paint a room, plant a garden, or repair a roof, all without being paid or getting sex, yet you'd derive some pleasure from knowing you made a difference now wouldn't you?
quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
It will only work if the person has a fetish for the service...


Yup. I have a couple of friends that have service only relationships.




< Message edited by MAINEiacMISTRESS -- 3/6/2014 7:04:27 AM >

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 7:05:45 AM   
FieryOpal


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

My my, are we a bit defensive? It's none of my concerns, I'm not the one searching, it's just something you put out on an open message board and apparently you forgot to send me the memo that I'm not allowed to read your posts or form my own opinion - while you tend to give your opinion quite frequently on other people's fetish.

As for PMing you, not really, I'm seriously not interested in personal stuff, I was only commenting what you put out there, but it does strike me that there's a bit of only twue and weal way going on. There are a ton of things that don't float my boat, not a problem and also saying I'm not into them, however I hope I don't ever give the impression that a kink isn't valid because it doesn't happen to be my kink and the person needs to be belittled for their kink...

That clear enough?

No, that was simply a statement. If anyone is being defensive, it is you, and for no reason. I share what is relevant to me. Your style may be different, perhaps more on the passive-aggressive side at times, or in taking things a bit too personally, when it isn't all about you.

My invitation stays open. For someone who says she's not interested in personal stuff, some of your posts often show otherwise in terms of taking a personal interest in several posters. What is true and real for me is purely subjective, imparted on an experiential basis on its own merit, but I don't believe I need to spell that out in my sig line for those who cannot discern this for themselves.

_____________________________

Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage. - Lao Tzu
There is no remedy for love but to love more. - Thoreau

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RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 7:44:39 AM   
LadyConstanze


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You are talking on a public board, now I can't help reading what you put out (and while I find some of the stuff really a bit funny as unintentional comedic value, not annoying enough to put you on ignore), I'm sorry if you think that you are so important that it's an interest in you if somebody reads a discussion, that's a bit of an inflated ego, but if it makes you feel better to tell yourself that I'm THAT interested in you, you're welcome, I consider it my good deed of the day.

Your sig line had nothing to do with it, it has to do with that you are continuously down on others, especially guys who don't share your "me" fetish and aren't looking to give what you seek. Again not a problem with saying something isn't your thing, but you act like you're the high priestess of all things D/s and if it doesn't float your boat, how do the guys even DARE to bring it up. I'm not talking about the usual "Here I am, women fulfill my fetish" guys, but guys who come with a question and do have a fetish and the replies you give (the fact that I quoted what you said should give you an idea what I am on about, or are you being obtuse on purpose?) tend to devalue their kinks or fetishes completely. Have you ever considered that it *might* not be the easiest thing for a guy to be open about their fetishes? So not a problem if their fetish doesn't float your boat (unless of course they were applying to you in a personal mail, but again, I wouldn't know about the mails you get, I only see what you put out for the general public to see), but you tend to react as if searching for somebody who's fetish meshes with their's is a crime that disgusts every twue and weal Domme. Here's a surprise for you, some women might actually have fetishes and preferences as well.

Hell, I have no problem with you wanting what you want (though I can't quite understand why you don't see the problem why you don't seem to be able to find it), I haven't paid all that much attention, but from the few things I couldn't avoid seeing, it seems you have a bit of a Princess thing going on, where everything is about you and how you want things, which is great, there are guys who are into that stuff, again, I don't know how you look or how old you are, but the guys looking for that usually tend to be into hot 20 somethings with killer bodies. Again, a valid fetish, kink, dynamic, only that it's (like every relationship) a demand and supply thing. You pick an arena where the men outnumber the women by far, your chances tend to be better than when it comes to vanilla dating.... Good luck in your search...

As for passive aggressive, I do tend to notice that glasshouses have awfully strong reflections.

Now that wasn't passive aggressive, that was me trying to avoid a gold letter, which I would surely get if I'd answer you a bit clearer and more to the point.



_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
Those who do and those who don't!

http://exdomme.blogspot.com/2012/07/public-service-announcement.html

(in reply to FieryOpal)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 7:56:42 AM   
FieryOpal


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From: Maryland
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

You are talking on a public board, now I can't help reading what you put out (and while I find some of the stuff really a bit funny as unintentional comedic value, not annoying enough to put you on ignore), I'm sorry if you think that you are so important that it's an interest in you if somebody reads a discussion, that's a bit of an inflated ego, but if it makes you feel better to tell yourself that I'm THAT interested in you, you're welcome, I consider it my good deed of the day.

Your sig line had nothing to do with it, it has to do with that you are continuously down on others, especially guys who don't share your "me" fetish and aren't looking to give what you seek. Again not a problem with saying something isn't your thing, but you act like you're the high priestess of all things D/s and if it doesn't float your boat, how do the guys even DARE to bring it up. I'm not talking about the usual "Here I am, women fulfill my fetish" guys, but guys who come with a question and do have a fetish and the replies you give (the fact that I quoted what you said should give you an idea what I am on about, or are you being obtuse on purpose?) tend to devalue their kinks or fetishes completely. Have you ever considered that it *might* not be the easiest thing for a guy to be open about their fetishes? So not a problem if their fetish doesn't float your boat (unless of course they were applying to you in a personal mail, but again, I wouldn't know about the mails you get, I only see what you put out for the general public to see), but you tend to react as if searching for somebody who's fetish meshes with their's is a crime that disgusts every twue and weal Domme. Here's a surprise for you, some women might actually have fetishes and preferences as well.

Hell, I have no problem with you wanting what you want (though I can't quite understand why you don't see the problem why you don't seem to be able to find it), I haven't paid all that much attention, but from the few things I couldn't avoid seeing, it seems you have a bit of a Princess thing going on, where everything is about you and how you want things, which is great, there are guys who are into that stuff, again, I don't know how you look or how old you are, but the guys looking for that usually tend to be into hot 20 somethings with killer bodies. Again, a valid fetish, kink, dynamic, only that it's (like every relationship) a demand and supply thing. You pick an arena where the men outnumber the women by far, your chances tend to be better than when it comes to vanilla dating.... Good luck in your search...

As for passive aggressive, I do tend to notice that glasshouses have awfully strong reflections.

Now that wasn't passive aggressive, that was me trying to avoid a gold letter, which I would surely get if I'd answer you a bit clearer and more to the point.


So now you're trying to avoid getting a gold letter. Conscience much?

It didn't seem to bother earlier within the last 24 hours thereabouts when you got into it with a couple forum posters on two other threads. I won't go as far as to call you a Drama Queen, but you sure do like to make personal attacks or why else would you be making a virtual hobby of it.

As for your advice, didn't ask, don't care, and you don't have my consent to be in a dynamic with me. You live your life as you have been doing. There is a famous saying by one of your countrywomen Margaret Thatcher: "Being in power is like being a Lady. If you have to tell people you are...You aren't."

_____________________________

Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage. - Lao Tzu
There is no remedy for love but to love more. - Thoreau

(in reply to LadyConstanze)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: service... without emotion?? - 3/6/2014 8:03:20 AM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline
You know, good luck in your search, and as for my countrywoman, has it ever occurred to you that I'm not British and Maggie isn't particularly liked in those parts? Guess not....

I'm trying to find a polite way to respond, but I admit I give up, you fill in the blanks yourself, darling, since jumping to conclusions and not being able to comprehend seems to be a speciality of yours.

You seem to be a true legend, at least in your own mind.

_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
Those who do and those who don't!

http://exdomme.blogspot.com/2012/07/public-service-announcement.html

(in reply to FieryOpal)
Profile   Post #: 40
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