Another terror attack against China. (Full Version)

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BamaD -> Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 5:50:25 PM)

From CNN.com without comment so I don't bias the reading.

(CNN) -- Uncertainly over the fate of missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 was further compounded Saturday by reports that two men whose names matched those on the passenger manifest had reported their passports stolen.

Malaysian authorities apparently did not check the stolen documents on an international law enforcement agency database, CNN has learned.

After the airline released a manifest of the 239 people on the plane, Austria denied that one of its citizens was on the flight as the list had stated. The Austrian citizen was safe and sound, and his passport had been stolen two years ago, Austrian Foreign Ministry spokesman Martin Weiss said.

Similarly, Italy's foreign ministry confirmed that no Italians were on the flight, even though an Italian was listed on the manifest. Malaysian officials said they were aware of reports that the Italian's passport was also stolen but had not confirmed it.

On Saturday, Italian police visited the home of the parents of Luigi Maraldi, the man whose name appeared on the manifest, to inform them about the missing flight, said a police official in Cesena, in northern Italy.

A woman wipes away tears as she walks out of the reception center for family and friends of passengers aboard a missing Malaysia Airlines plane at Kuala Lumpur International Airport on Saturday, March 8. The plane was carrying 239 people from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing when contact was lost.

A Vietnamese Air Force plane found traces of oil in waters that authorities suspect to be from the missing Malaysia Airlines plane, the Vietnamese government online newspaper reported March 8.

Maraldi's father, Walter, told police that he had just spoken to his son, who was fine and not on the missing flight, said the official, who is not authorized to speak to the media. Maraldi was vacationing in Thailand, his father said. The police official said that Maraldi had reported his passport stolen in Malaysia last August and had obtained a new one.

U.S. law enforcement sources, however, told CNN they've been told that both documents were stolen in Thailand.

Still, the missing passports raised concerns about the possibility of terrorism.

A law enforcement official Saturday told CNN that various U.S. government agencies were briefed about the passports. The names of the persons whose passports were stolen have been circulated and checked, the official said. There's nothing at this point to indicate foul play on their part.

A team of FBI agents is heading to Malaysia to support the investigation because of the handful of Americans who were on board the plane, a U.S. official told CNN.

The FBI is not ruling out terrorism -- or anything else -- as a cause of the airliner's disappearance, the official said.

FBI agents stationed at the embassy in Kuala Lumpur, including an FBI legal attaché, were monitoring the situation closely, according to the official.

CNN law enforcement analyst Tom Fuentes, a former FBI assistant director, was told by sources at Interpol, which keeps a database of lost or stolen travel documents, that the stolen Italian passport was in the agency's database. The reportedly stolen Austrian passport was not. Malaysian authorities apparently did not check Interpol's database, sources told Fuentes.

"Interpol's database has 39 million records of stolen travel documents at the present time," he said. "One billion passengers a year board international flights where there's no inquiry made of that database. So it leaves an opening."

Referring to the stolen documents, Fuentes added, "You wonder who was using it? What were their motives? Were they using it to check luggage in that matched the tickets, and maybe the luggage contained explosives? So, it's a great concern when people use false documents to board international aircraft."

Traces of oil spotted near area plane lost contact

A U.S. intelligence official said authorities had established "no nexus to terrorism yet although that's by no means definitive. We're still tracking."

Malaysian authorities reiterated during a news conference that they are not ruling anything out regarding the missing aircraft.

In the United States, Fuentes said, passports are routinely checked against the Interpol database.

"Even in the United states, we have a tremendous problem with our documentation, our driver's licenses," said Mary Schiavo, former inspector general of the U.S. Department of Transportation. "Everything can be forged and faked here. We certainly have a problem with that as well. But that's why you have the various checklists to check against and had they been identified as stolen passports ... there was a way to flag them in advance. That's what is disturbing, as it apparently wasn't checked."

No one is sure what happened to the plane. Air traffic controllers lost track of it after it left Kuala Lumpur, the capital of Malaysia, on its way to Beijing on Friday. The plane was two hours into its flight, cruising during what experts consider to be the safest part of the journey, when it vanished.

Greg Feith, a former investigator with the National Transportation Safety Board, said there were multiple scenarios of what could have gone wrong, including structural problems with the wings or fuselage.

"Of course, you also have to look at in that part of the world and around the world there is still a potential for a terrorist act or an intentional act that could have rendered the airplane incapacitated," he said.

He added: "Whatever happened, happened very quickly. For them to have lost two-way radio communication with
(air traffic control), two-way radio communication with the company, and to lose any kind of radar data
with ground control facilities means that the airplane was compromised in a very quick manner and it may have
been well beyond the control of the crew to keep the airplane under control and make any kind of
emergency distress call or emergency landing."


edited to remove captions of unseen photos




CuckoldsQuest2 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 5:55:52 PM)

hmmm... sounds typical of a coming market crash...




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 5:58:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: CuckoldsQuest2

hmmm... sounds typical of a coming market crash...

?????????????????????????????




DomKen -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:23:59 PM)

Back on topic,
Looks bad. Stolen passports are a bad sign. Stolen European passports are weird though. You'd think someone would notice if the sorts you'd expect to blow up a plane bound for Beijing had bought tickets and boarded with European names and passports.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:30:45 PM)

Terrorists come in all colors, shapes and sizes.




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:41:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

Terrorists come in all colors, shapes and sizes.

And those that don't look like you would expect are being recruited.
This also assumes that nobody who looks Asian would have a European passport.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:48:43 PM)

That would be a piss poor assumption.




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:51:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

That would be a piss poor assumption.

And could get the airline in all kind of legal (civil law) problems.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:56:41 PM)

I'm still trying to figure out why names weren't run through the international data base. If that procedure would have been followed the outcome could have been a bit different.




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 6:59:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

I'm still trying to figure out why names weren't run through the international data base. If that procedure would have been followed the outcome could have been a bit different.


Maybe they aren't as smart as you are (no sarcasm).




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:06:07 PM)

It has nothing to do with smarts but rather procedure. At least one of the passports was reported as stolen which means when their name was run through it would have hit, you then check on other identifying items. At the least, the person should have been held for additional questioning and the flight possibly cancelled and luggage searched.




Lucylastic -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:08:46 PM)

Im sorry Bama but your sentance
From CNN.com without comment so I don't bias the reading.
Why is the headline
"Another terror attack against China"???




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:10:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

It has nothing to do with smarts but rather procedure. At least one of the passports was reported as stolen which means when their name was run through it would have hit, you then check on other identifying items. At the least, the person should have been held for additional questioning and the flight possibly cancelled and luggage searched.

From the story it looks like the U S flights do this, I suspect neither smarts nor procedure but greed.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:15:56 PM)

I'm curious as to how far out the oil traces in the water were and when last commo with ATC was and whether that communication was with the tower or with departure control (radar). That would give you an idea on how fast the incidents took place. An aircraft is normally switched to departure one half mile off the departure end of the runway.




tj444 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:37:48 PM)

if it was a terrorist attack/bomb then why has no group laid claim to the attack? so cuz no group has said a peep, I am thinking that's not the reason.. apparently there have been 2 planes that have gone down in the past which were caused by the pilot (the suggestion is those were suicides).. if that was the case in this plane going down, there wouldn't have been any distress calls.. they will (imo) need to find the wreckage to give any determination.. all they got now is a bit of oil.. we may never know..




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:48:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

I'm curious as to how far out the oil traces in the water were and when last commo with ATC was and whether that communication was with the tower or with departure control (radar). That would give you an idea on how fast the incidents took place. An aircraft is normally switched to departure one half mile off the departure end of the runway.

Haven't seen any of those details.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 7:54:51 PM)

I don't think that because no one has claimed responsibility that you can rule out a terrorist attack. I am familiar with the suicide crashes, Egypt Air and Mozambique Airlines. With Egypt Air, two different conclusions were made. The NTSB concluded that it was suicide and the ECAA concluded that there was a mechanical failure. In the Mozambique crash the Capt. manually changed the altitude settings three times and manipulated the auto pilot, in both cases drawing the attention of ATC. I'm not saying it was an act of terrorism but I do believe heads better freakin roll for not running names through a database. Whether to save time or money what the airline did was morally reprehensible.




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 8:05:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

I don't think that because no one has claimed responsibility that you can rule out a terrorist attack. I am familiar with the suicide crashes, Egypt Air and Mozambique Airlines. With Egypt Air, two different conclusions were made. The NTSB concluded that it was suicide and the ECAA concluded that there was a mechanical failure. In the Mozambique crash the Capt. manually changed the altitude settings three times and manipulated the auto pilot, in both cases drawing the attention of ATC. I'm not saying it was an act of terrorism but I do believe heads better freakin roll for not running names through a database. Whether to save time or money what the airline did was morally reprehensible.

I agree .
I don't think the Egypt Airlines was deliberate . The most damning evidence I heard on that was the pilot saying
anshahlllah (imperfect transliteration) roughly translating to it's Gods will but also used to say it is in God's hands
often used by Arabs when things have gotten so out of hand that only Devine intervention can save them.
No one has claimed credit for the knife attack in China either.

Bottom line. I agree with you. Particularly about something needs to be done about a security loophole you can drive a truck through.




DominantWoman65 -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 8:07:27 PM)

Hopefully the aircraft is intact enough that if found the black box can be retrieved. I will need more information before I can sum up some type of explanation. I didn't even see where radar contact was made and if it was did the controllers notice the loss of elevation and try to contact them or did the aircraft simply blow up and the aircraft disappeared from radar? I did see the Feds will be investigating because of the American lives lost.




BamaD -> RE: Another terror attack against China. (3/8/2014 8:09:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantWoman65

Hopefully the aircraft is intact enough that if found the black box can be retrieved. I will need more information before I can sum up some type of explanation. I didn't even see where radar contact was made and if it was did the controllers notice the loss of elevation and try to contact them or did the aircraft simply blow up and the aircraft disappeared from radar? I did see the Feds will be investigating because of the American lives lost.


FBI tends to be good at this stuff if the locals co-operate.
And we do need more facts.




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