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Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 8:57:28 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
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It is time to wind back the clock and try to remember how it felt when you found your 'calling' - 'position' - whatever you call it personally.

A couple of times I have found and met people who are dominant, who are just discovering themselves - new to BDSM - new to Sadism - and a common notion is the 'unworthiness'. Even though the pull and desire is there, theres a certain reluctance to accept submission or devotion. Is it nervousness? Those first few tender steps that sets in ones head slightly negative thoughts of 'what if I do it wrong?' - or is it the acknowledgement that ones 'superiority' is now discovered and that wonder on how any s-type may want to submit to someone as 'normal and down to earth' as one is? And what about that submissive who you knew could serve you well, but who could not accept their submission as being what you wanted?

For submissives - have you ever come across a dominant personality who found it difficult to accept your submission because of that feeling of 'unworthiness' and how did you cross that barrier? Or did you, as an s-type at the beginning of your journey - feel unworthy yourself? Feel that your submission could never be enough for that dominant with whom you felt a bond?

Should and does the feeling of unworthiness exist?

Peace and Rapture

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

Post #: 1

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 9:04:18 AM

Caretakr

Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline

It comes from performance anxiety when you read profile after profile with subs insisting on years of experience. Even when they have little or none themselves.

If you are a new bottom,you will be happily snatched up as fresh meat-new dom-you are going to have your work cut out for you breaking the barriers, and getting into the good old boy club.

The only way I got accepted as a Top was to first practice like hell with a flogger on furniture-then got a little bottom boy at one of the clubs, let me beat him publically. Looking back, it was pretty tame. But you have to start somehere.

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 2

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 9:20:51 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

Sometimes, we are most afraid of success, not failure, especially having been raised that our dream is just wrong. It can take time to overcome conditioning.

Master FIre

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 3

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 9:35:31 AM

MistressMelissa

Posts: 226
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline

Much of it comes from perceptions. The reality of a situation verses their perception of what the situation would require. As noted some things just take time and effort to learn and "master", hence the term. For the most part I am who I am and I'm just being me. Whether people see me as an example or a scourge appears to depend upon if they land on my friends list. One's status within a community is an interesting thing. While some feel they only have worth if they obtain some level of celebrity, others can just ignore the "community" and quietly live their lives.

Personally I have strong opinions about what this lifestyle means and how I chose to live it. So while that may chafe some, it also earns me the respect of others. Even as you read the boards here, you can listen to the echo of the "approved thoughts and/or views". For the little ones who seek the direction of an owner and have this miss conception that they must obey everyone who can type their name in capital letters it’s very difficult.

Worthy or unworthy, it begins with your own self worth. Also, it is up to me as owner of this house to determine if someone is “worthy” to serve in it. If I feel someone is correct for my house, on what grounds does a little one decline me stating they are unworthy; it’s not their place.

Melissa
Mistress of Ds Haven
www.dshaven.com

(in reply to Caretakr)

Post #: 4

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 9:38:24 AM

CrappyDom

Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

When I hit the scene I was young and hot and all the old submissives hit on me like crazy, the same ones who bitched about doms only wanting young things.

I felt horribly unworthy and despite an advanced case of arrogance often felt unsure of myself and at times still do.

I think I will die if I ever see an ad from a submissive saying something like "looking for inexperienced dominant to work with and grow together"!

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 5

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 10:13:35 AM

Caretakr

Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom

When I hit the scene I was young and hot and all the old submissives hit on me like crazy, the same ones who bitched about doms only wanting young things.

I felt horribly unworthy and despite an advanced case of arrogance often felt unsure of myself and at times still do.

I think I will die if I ever see an ad from a submissive saying something like "looking for inexperienced dominant to work with and grow together"!

Sing it guy.

I think I'd have an anuerism and fall over dead as well.

(in reply to CrappyDom)

Post #: 6

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 10:34:16 AM

KarbonCopy

Posts: 779
Status: offline

I thnk most of the I'm not worthy attitude comes from newbies trying to impress everyone with just how lowly submissive they are.

Its actually kinda funny. They come in here, thinking that if they come in as the lowest scum that some Dom/me will fawn over how pathetic they are.

>.o Too much TV

_____________________________

I am KarbonCopy's signature

(in reply to Caretakr)

Post #: 7

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 10:37:15 AM

Caretakr

Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline

Oh I don't know, the unworthy sub worm might be amusing.

I can just reply "Cool,then you won't have an issue with me diapering you, and locking you in the cage until tomorrow then?"

(in reply to KarbonCopy)

Post #: 8

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 11:01:53 AM

APerfectParadox

Posts: 95
Joined: 11/1/2005
Status: offline

When i was new to all this , i definately felt unworthy . It came from far too many conversations with "DOM's" who told me i was not submissive enough when it was simply that i was not the submissive for them . I finally met a Dom online one who gained my friendship and trust who offered to train me . I know how many feel about online training but in this case it wasn't an attempt to exploit me for jack off material .It was simply him showing me how it can work when the Dom is caring and capable of nurtuing submission rather than just demanding it . I came away from it with a new confidence in my identity as a submissive .. which was the whole point of the training.

NOTE :
Please no flaming , i am simply relating my experience in response to the op's question. I will add that i also came away from it with mixed feelings about him and the whole online training thing.. I will not respond to anyone who wishes to debate this issue. If there is a new submissive who is considering just such training and wants more info i am happy to discuss it thru email .
Lisa .

< Message edited by APerfectParadox -- 7/9/2006 11:04:00 AM >

_____________________________

“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.”

If there were dreams to sell, what would you buy?

(in reply to KarbonCopy)

Post #: 9

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 2:01:13 PM

krikket

Posts: 1183
Joined: 11/17/2004
From: Washington, DC Metro Area
Status: offline

One of the worst fights my first Master and i ever had (well, he talked loudly and i listened quietly..lol) was because i didn't believe i was good enough for him. Geez, did i catch hell for doubting his desires, wants, needs and opinions. It wasn't the only time we had "that" discussion over the years, but it did finally take. While i sure there are many now who wish it hadn't <g> he also taught me, that when it was time for him to leave, i would be strong enough to recognize not only my own strength, but my own worth. He said it would make my submission stronger and mean more than if i were a "worthless scrap of junk that's easy to toss away".

jimini

< Message edited by krikket -- 7/9/2006 2:02:07 PM >

_____________________________

"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to bloom."

by A. Nin

When your heart speaks take good notes.

(in reply to APerfectParadox)

Post #: 10

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 2:11:25 PM

litleone8620

Posts: 3669
Joined: 6/12/2006
Status: offline

I never felt unworthy. I understood that i was new, and would make mistakes. I made sure my dominant knew and understood that too.

I wasn't nervous either. I knew that this was what i wanted, and i was new (now i'm just repeating myself).

But, now 6 months into my relationship with Master, i'm feeling that unworthiness that you speak of happening at the beginning. That i might displease him in some way, and he'll move on. But that's just insecurities about myself and has nothing to with Master.

(in reply to krikket)

Post #: 11

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 2:15:14 PM

windchymes

Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline

Well, if you notice how often, when a new sub/slave comes in and starts the "unworthy lowly worm" thread, dozens of others will pounce on that and offer post after post of reassurance and advice and basically give them the attention and drama that they're so obviously craving.

And as far as never seeing "looking for an inexperienced dom to grow together with"....that goes against the fantasy of being taken by someone strong and masterful and being molded from unworthy worm crap into sub-perfection. (Think about that one, lol) Growing WITH a new dom would imply taking initiative and responsibility.

To answer the OP, no, I've never felt "unworthiness" when faced with a new relationship. Maybe nervousness, apprehension, trepidation, or anxiety, but if I truly felt "unworthy", I wouldn't be there at all.

Maybe it's because I keep in the back of my mind that even the most Masterly of Doms are still human beings who eat, sleep, burp, go to the bathroom and put their pants on one leg at a time (unless they're really nimble and ambitious) just like everyone else.

_____________________________

You know it's going to be a GOOD blow job when she puts a Breathe Right strip on first.

Pick-up artists and garbage men should trade names.

(in reply to krikket)

Post #: 12

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 2:17:42 PM

jezabelKH

Posts: 663
Joined: 5/21/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: darkinshadows

It is time to wind back the clock and try to remember how it felt when you found your 'calling' - 'position' - whatever you call it personally.

A couple of times I have found and met people who are dominant, who are just discovering themselves - new to BDSM - new to Sadism - and a common notion is the 'unworthiness'. Even though the pull and desire is there, theres a certain reluctance to accept submission or devotion. Is it nervousness? Those first few tender steps that sets in ones head slightly negative thoughts of 'what if I do it wrong?' - or is it the acknowledgement that ones 'superiority' is now discovered and that wonder on how any s-type may want to submit to someone as 'normal and down to earth' as one is? And what about that submissive who you knew could serve you well, but who could not accept their submission as being what you wanted?

For submissives - have you ever come across a dominant personality who found it difficult to accept your submission because of that feeling of 'unworthiness' and how did you cross that barrier? Or did you, as an s-type at the beginning of your journey - feel unworthy yourself? Feel that your submission could never be enough for that dominant with whom you felt a bond?

Should and does the feeling of unworthiness exist?

Peace and Rapture

i grew up in a M/s, poly, BDSM Leather Lifestyle home. i am in a 24/7 M/s, poly, BDSM Leather and Gorean Lifestyle home. i have never felt unworthy, truth, honor and self respect are not just words, but my way of life, after all i am my Masters most prized posession.

jezabel{KH}
just simply a slave
Property of Master Ken

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 13

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/9/2006 3:22:01 PM

truesub4u

Posts: 2949
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

My 2nd and last Master.... simply came home one day in a bad mood. I asked ... you ok?.. He stated.. I'm not happy no more. All I said was.. on your way out.. leave my house keys and car keys on the table. He looked at me funny asking if I was ending our relationship. I said no.. but if you're not happy.. no sense in hanging around. I am not one to think if i'm worthy or not. I either am or not to the one whom I am with. I've sense then met a few that weren't worthy of my submission. So it can work both ways.

_____________________________

Wisdom is knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it, and Virtue is doing it.

(in reply to jezabelKH)

Post #: 14

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 2:21:50 AM

KennelDeSade2

Posts: 210
Joined: 9/19/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: darkinshadows Even though the pull and desire is there, theres a certain reluctance to accept submission or devotion. - or is it the acknowledgment that ones 'superiority' is now discovered and that wonder

I played in private for almost two years before I went to my first event/party. From everything I had read and heard, I considered myself a medium to lightweight player. I figured with the experience I had, I was a little unprepared for exposure to prime time, but how bad could it be to expose my limited skill set to "real" people?

To this day, the APEX dungeon in Phoenix, and whipped into line by Master Seth, remains my standard against which all other clubs are measured. A good friend was going to brand his girl, and since I crafted the brand, it seemed only right I should be there to assist in it's application. (Quick aside here. Everything you have ever read about banding is most likely wrong, unless you got the info from BME. If you got your info from Gor, all you have are instructions on how to maim a human being.) When hit with the brand, the girl didn't even flinch. Subspace does have some anesthetic properties it seems.

By the time 6AM rolled around a new friend and I unchained our captive masochist so she could go to work (I am STILL amazed she could remember her name, let alone where she worked) it had been one of the most remarkable days ever. Then, she wrapped her arms around my neck, looked up and said. .. "How long have you known you where a sadist?" (No, she wasn't being coy, she was still having trouble keeping her feet under her)

Instant phiphlet. I was indeed a sadist, although I had been in denial because back then, it was still a bad word. I was not a lightweight, by virtue of the the opinions of several people who I respected, who had spend the evening in the same space. And that I was going to have to get over my own questions of my own skill set, because by the standards of real people who had much more time in scene than I did, I did pretty well. Did I suddenly realize I was a gifted genius? No. I wish I where. But I did learn that average was a lot less competent than I ever imagined, and that everything you could learn in online chatrooms in ten years would be about equal to attending one munch in real life. Worthy or not is useless baggage, when the only standard is effective, or not.

The top is a place where you find friends that don't abandon you should you survive the fall.

_____________________________

Rules? Just one: I say, she does.
Everything else, is just details.

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Post #: 15

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 2:48:19 AM

KennelDeSade2

Posts: 210
Joined: 9/19/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CrappyDom
I think I will die if I ever see an ad from a submissive saying something like "looking for inexperienced dominant to work with and grow together"!

I can think of three right now who pulled that theme out of profiles because it brings out a whole new level of hopefuls that can't take no thank you for an answer.
If you have an under 25 year old starter dom in your shed that is looking for a girl, and I approve of him, I'll assign him an outstanding girl. lol
Of course, no father with a pocket watch and a shotgun would keep a closer eye on how things went than I would, but some kids work well under pressure.

_____________________________

Rules? Just one: I say, she does.
Everything else, is just details.

(in reply to CrappyDom)

Post #: 16

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 4:03:41 AM

bandit25

Posts: 3029
Joined: 6/18/2005
Status: offline

I don't know if that's the case Caretakr. I wouldn't want to "play" with a new Top because I'd be afraid of getting hurt. I've seen it happen. In the "heat" of the moment, both parties get carried away. I've seen it happen with experienced tops and bottoms also, so I'm not slamming anyone; however, an experienced top knows how far s/he can go.

(in reply to Caretakr)

Post #: 17

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 5:53:33 AM

thegunslinger

Posts: 81
Joined: 6/4/2006
From: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: truesub4u

My 2nd and last Master.... simply came home one day in a bad mood. I asked ... you ok?.. He stated.. I'm not happy no more. All I said was.. on your way out.. leave my house keys and car keys on the table. He looked at me funny asking if I was ending our relationship. I said no.. but if you're not happy.. no sense in hanging around. I am not one to think if i'm worthy or not. I either am or not to the one whom I am with. I've sense then met a few that weren't worthy of my submission. So it can work both ways.

It takes a strong person to say something like that, but if your in an open relationship with your partner, it could happen. Good show, truesub

_____________________________

"The essence of domination is to take another's power and then use it for mutual pleasure." - John Warren

(in reply to truesub4u)

Post #: 18

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 6:28:57 AM

Caretakr

Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline

Which is why I said I'd probably have a heart attack if someone wrote saying something like that.

There's a world of difference between hurt and harm.

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 19

RE: Unworthiness in BDSM? - 7/10/2006 7:04:05 AM

ArtimisBlack

Posts: 154
Joined: 6/13/2006
Status: offline

You're supposed to put your pants on one leg at a time? You mean I've been doing it wrong all these years?!! (Sorry, I had to

)

Anyway, to the OP......
As a new and somewhat inexperienced Dom/Domme (does the spelling of this really matter?) Yes, I am little "nervous" or "insecure" for lack of a better term.
There are a few reasons why.
1) (and this may have already been mentioned) I don't know how far I'd go if I get carried away.
It is glaringly obvious (to me, anyway) that even though I know a little of what I'm doing, I don't have the experience (yet) to do everything I'd want.
That brings me to
2) I *know* abstractly what I want. I just don't know how to describe it. The terms are coming and so is the knowledge to use them correctly, but I'd be lying if I said I already knew what I was talking about.
How can I approach a prospective sub other then to be upfront and let them know I only have a general idea of what I'm doing? It's their body and emotions etc. they are putting in my hands, and even if I don't know a lot yet, I do know how to treat that gesture with the respect it deserves.
So even though I may be "nervous" or "insecure" that is not what is at my core. I feel those things about the limited knowledge I possess mainly because I haven't yet turned a lot of that knowledge into action and I feel like there is soo much more I've yet to learn. I certainly don't feel unworthy to be here, but I know I’m not Alpha Dom yet. Anyone can use a tool, but it takes somebody with experience (among other things) to use it correctly.

_____________________________

I wanted to put in my 2 cents but I only have a dollar. Do you have change?

The pain is free. Do not pick the scab.

(in reply to Caretakr)

Post #: 20

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