RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer!

RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (Full Version)

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MrBukani -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 2:57:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Consider this. There is not a single Christian prayer that is not anti-semetic. [:D] So all christians who pray are anti-semetic?[:D]

Kirata -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 3:03:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Consider this. There is not a single Christian prayer that is not anti-semetic. Consider this: We have one militant anti christian Jew. Who can't spell. K.

farglebargle -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 3:10:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Consider this. There is not a single Christian prayer that is not anti-semetic. Consider this: We have one militant anti christian Jew. Or former Jew. Do you have, instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant?

Kirata -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 3:35:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Do you have instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant? If you think any tradition that rejects the Abrahamic covenant is anti-semitic, the notion that people like you are a blessing to the nations reflects a very droll sense of humor. K.

chatterbox24 -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 6:24:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Consider this. There is not a single Christian prayer that is not anti-semetic. Consider this: We have one militant anti christian Jew. Or former Jew. Do you have, instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant? I am sorry you feel that way, but we are not offended by your prayers, nor feel when you do pray, that it is anti-Christian. Although, we have a difference, in the fact you reject Christ, we do not take offense to your prayers. I do hope your views are not the average view of your faith.

Phydeaux -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 10:39:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Consider this. There is not a single Christian prayer that is not anti-semetic. Consider this: We have one militant anti christian Jew. Or former Jew. Do you have, instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant? Do you have any knowledge? There are thousands of christian prayers. The vast majority of them make no mention of Jesus. Here's the most common single prayer, prayed by christians the world over "Our father, who art in heaven, hallowed by thy name. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those that trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil. Amen". Not a single mention of jesus, the jews or whatever. The single most common prayer said at virtually every christian convocation in the last 2000 years. Theres so many others, its really hard to even get an idea where you get your hatred. But for example: Catholics earn an indulgence by reciting: "Come, Holy Spirit, fill the hearts of Thy faithful and enkindle in them the fire of Thy love. V. Send forth Thy Spirit and they shall be created. R. And Thou shalt renew the face of the earth. " Which comes from psalm 104... And for the record - mainline christians do not 'reject' jewish heritage or the abrahamic convenant. Bottom line: Jews look forward to a messiah. Christians know he already came. Christians believe god's promise to abraham (one of the reasons we support israel). We believe in the teaching of the law. We believe that righteous jews will be saved. We don't reject the covenants of abraham - we embrace them. However we believe that the promises to Israel have been fulfilled and there is a better way. We believe God can raise up sons to him from the very stones. And that God doesn't desire burnt offerings - he desires the hearts of his people.

DaddySatyr -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 10:54:52 AM)
Thank you for re-posting this, Phydeaux. It affords me an opportunity. The Prayer of St. Francis of Assisi Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace. Where there is hatred, let me sow love; where there is injury; pardon; where there is doubt; faith; where there is despair; hope; where there is darkness; light where there is sadness; joy. Oh, Divine Master, grant that I may seek not so much to be consoled as to console; to be understood as to understand; to be loved as to love. For it is in giving that we receive. It is in pardoning that we are pardoned and, it is in dying that we are born to eternal life. Amen. I believe this prayer to be even more "Christian" than "The Lord's Prayer" as, even in that prayer, we are given the model to ask for something "selfish" ("Give us, this day, our daily bread"). That's not the case with St. Francis. It's a litany of selflessness and a desire to serve God. Not even a hint of anything anti-Semitic. I also think it's worth pointing out that Jesus and his followers pretty much believed that their "new direction" was where Judaism was supposed to go. I'm reminded of the story where the woman comes to Jesus and asks him to heal her daughter. Jesus admonishes her that his faith and acts are not for the gentiles. Back in those days (and to some extent, today) "gentile" meant anyone "not Jewish". quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Do you have, instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant? Screen captures *still* RULE! Ya feel me?

Phydeaux -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 11:04:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr Thank you for re-posting this, Phydeaux. It affords me an opportunity. The Prayer of St. Francis of Assisi Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace. Where there is hatred, let me sow love; where there is injury; pardon; where there is doubt; faith; where there is despair; hope; where there is darkness; light where there is sadness; joy. Oh, Divine Master, grant that I may seek not so much to be consoled as to console; to be understood as to understand; to be loved as to love. For it is in giving that we receive. It is in pardoning that we are pardoned and, it is in dying that we are born to eternal life. Amen. I believe this prayer to be even more "Christian" than "The Lord's Prayer" as, even in that prayer, we are given the model to ask for something "selfish" ("Give us, this day, our daily bread"). That's not the case with St. Francis. It's a litany of selflessness and a desire to serve God. Not even a hint of anything anti-Semitic. I also think it's worth pointing out that Jesus and his followers pretty much believed that their "new direction" was where Judaism was supposed to go. I'm reminded of the story where the woman comes to Jesus and asks him to heal her daughter. Jesus admonishes her that his faith and acts are not for the gentiles. Back in those days (and to some extent, today) "gentile" meant anyone "not Jewish". But you missed the conclusion of that story Satyr. The samaritan woman answers jesus and says "Sir, but even the dogs are fed with scraps that fall from their master's table". And jesus looks with pity on her and says, your faith has saved her. There are actually 3 stories or so in the new testament of jesus acting to save non-jews even tho his mission was to the jews. This is why the great commissioning is relevant. Jesus's mission was to the jews and he had an obligation first to go to the people of god. This is why jesus, the stone the builder's rejected, has become the cornerstone. It was only when rejected that jesus instructs his followers to go to all ends of the earth and make believers. (The great commissioning).

DaddySatyr -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 11:15:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux But you missed the conclusion of that story Satyr... Nah. I didn't miss it at all. I thought the main thrust was that Christians were anti-Semitic. I was just showing that to an extent, Jesus was actually a "raging Semite" who, if anything at all was anti-gentile. [:D] Seriously, I understand that he did, indeed, eventually cure the woman's daughter and it was because he felt that her faith was very strong. I saw an interesting movie back around Easter called, simply: "Jesus". It aired on UP. It starred Jeremy Sisto whom I have never particularly cared for (I didn't not care for him, either. I saw him on "Law & Order" and just wasn't impressed). In this movie, he gives a *very* "humanistic" portrayal of Jesus; smiling, laughing, dancing, not really ready to step into his place until "pushed" there. I liked it a lot (enough to watch all four hours). In all seriousness; I was just trying to show that Jesus certainly wasn't an anti-Semite. He was, by all accounts, a Jewish kid that thought he could save the Jewish people from Rome's (and the world's) oppression. Screen captures *still* RULE! Ya feel me?

mnottertail -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 11:50:46 AM)
Yeah, Paul was the anti-Semite of the crew.

Kirata -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 12:11:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail Yeah, Paul was the anti-Semite of the crew. Jews sure got the last laugh on that one. K.

Musicmystery -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 12:18:05 PM)
~FR~ Why don't we all just pray on it? And if that won't help, then there's no point worrying about prayers. If there is a point, then that should do it. I'm always amazed at how often people don't believe in the things they believe.

chatterbox24 -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/9/2014 1:39:43 PM)
Disciples on cc? I think I'm ready to blow a gasket. Whatever!!! Loved the prayers[:D]

farglebargle -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 12:42:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle Do you have instead of a personal attack, and example of any prayer "In Jesus' Name" that does NOT reject the Jewish Heritage and Abrahamic covenant? If you think any tradition that rejects the Abrahamic covenant is anti-semitic, the notion that people like you are a blessing to the nations reflects a very droll sense of humor. K. So, you can't provide the example that supports your position. That does tend to support my point. Noted.

farglebargle -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 12:45:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux Bottom line: Jews look forward to a messiah. Christians know he already came. And how is that not a rejection? Oh, and "The Lord's Prayer". That "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those that trespass against us." Vengful G-d don't play that shit. You piss G-d off, you get plagues and boils. "Forgiveness" is what the space between Rosh Hasshonah and Yom Kippur is for, you know. Although you probably don't.

BecomingV -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 1:32:06 AM)
fucktoyprincess - yes, yes, everything that you wrote! You nailed it! I was just thinking, "God, when will the atheists be able to take over?" LOL, but seriously! Pray, if you must, but do it on your own time and under your own roof, or some private, outdoor space, or under-water or whatever... just keep it all out of my government gatherings. (and off the money, etc...) Yes, it violates my citizenship to have religion(s) embedded in government. What's with the tax breaks? And, call me jaded, but tax breaks - $$$ - is what the ruling is all about. Big religion is simply, big business. For that reason alone, I have no expectation of any progress towards ridding the government of religion, any time soon.

chatterbox24 -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 3:06:06 AM)
Those very things you fight against are the principles and teachings of our founding fathers that have instilled generosity and kindness. Those very things you want gone allowed many of us entry here. True Christians will not sit still and allow our rights as a nation to be dictated by ignorant intolerance. Be careful what you ask for, it may not bring the results you imagine. It may bring a day having In God we trust as such a small argument you wish you never argued the point.

chatterbox24 -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 5:12:43 AM)
I found this an interesting read. http://www.lawandliberty.org/founders.htm

thishereboi -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 5:55:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BecomingV fucktoyprincess - yes, yes, everything that you wrote! You nailed it! I was just thinking, "God, when will the atheists be able to take over?" LOL, but seriously! I don't see it happening any time soon no matter how much you and fucktoy seem to want it, but in the mean time there are many atheist websites where you oh so very tolerant folks can go and talk about how evil and ignorant everyone else is. Pray, if you must, but do it on your own time and under your own roof, or some private, outdoor space, or under-water or whatever... just keep it all out of my government gatherings. (and off the money, etc...) I just got out of the gay closet, you can kiss my ass if you think you are going to shove me back into another one. Yes, it violates my citizenship to have religion(s) embedded in government. What's with the tax breaks? And, call me jaded, but tax breaks - $$$ - is what the ruling is all about. Big religion is simply, big business. For that reason alone, I have no expectation of any progress towards ridding the government of religion, any time soon. Now we get to the real problem. Someone is getting something I am not and that's not fair. cry me a fucking river

DomKen -> RE: You can now violate someone else's religion with prayer! (5/10/2014 7:46:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chatterbox24 I found this an interesting read. http://www.lawandliberty.org/founders.htm Quotes taken out of context and historical documents misquoted. exactly what I'd expect from the RR. Take for example the use of the decision Church of the Holy Trinity vs. U.S. The author claims this quote appears in the ruling "Our laws and institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be otherwise. In this sense and to this extent, our civilization and our institutions are emphatically Christian." Here is the actual ruling http://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/143/457/case.html That quote does not exist. He simply lied.

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