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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 7:44:07 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: njlauren

Freedom of speech has been turned by some, especially on the hard right, into 'freedom from consequences' and it doesn't work like that. You have the right to say what you wish, but others have the right to respond, and also to take action if they feel the speech is inappropriate.

If someone says something you find offensive, you are certainly entitled to stand up and speak your mind about it. But to crank up a self-righteous tantrum and set about destroying the man's life and career, simply because something that he said "offended" you, elevates childish nastiness to a virtue.

K.


I tend to agree with you on this. So, consider the parallels in the case of Donald Sterling. Perhaps that is also a bit of much to do about nothing ??

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 7:46:54 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Does this police commissioner have a duty to avoid expressing his racial epithets in public? Should he have to resign as some townspeople wish? Isn't he protected by the First Amendment as an elected official? Or does he have a greater duty to racial equality and equal justice as a law man?


I think what struck me about this was that he was overheard in a restaurant by someone who had moved to the town four months earlier. He's an elected official, so I would imagine he's probably been living in this small town for quite some time. Is this the first time that anyone has heard him use a racial epithet? He's 82, so it's likely not a habit he only just recently started. But now, it's reached national attention - and not very favorable attention at that.

I would say that he's certainly protected by the First Amendment in the sense that he can't be prosecuted or jailed just for using a racial epithet. But the townspeople can certainly call for his resignation or vote him out of office. I'm not sure if recall elections are allowed there or whether there are other local provisions for removing someone from office.



Age is no excuse and as an old guy myself I find the age factor a little condescending, although he does look like a mean old member of the KKK stereotype.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 8:33:43 AM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

You might want to check the recent guidance about those broad-brush attacks that get you off when posting, Lauren. You sound like a "racist" to me.

This post sounds like an ignorant unsubstantiated opinion


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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 8:41:03 AM   
dcnovice


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FR

For me, the case raises two thorny questions:

(a) Was Copeland's utterance "public" or "private"? He wasn't speaking in an official capacity, yet he was in a public place, and someone overheard him.

(b) Is someone who has unapologetically announced that he has "criteria" for defining whom the N-word fits an appropriate choice for having power over town employees?

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 8:41:41 AM   
thompsonx


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real factual opinions aye, you mean like the very first line of her post where she said "He can't be jailed or prosecuted, but he can be fired" because according to the article...

"Town Manager David Owen said Thursday that while he finds Copeland's comment "reprehensible," he and the board of selectmen have no authority to remove an elected official. He said he expected a large number of residents would call for Copeland's resignation at the police commission meeting, and they did."

he can't be fired.

So I agree that those are her opinions but I am going to have to call bullshit on the factual part.


Being voted out of office is not being fired in your zip code???



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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 8:43:03 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

A white American older southern gentlemen about 70 yr old once told me that, at one point of American history. It was the blacks who wanted to be called the "N" word. And that's how it started. It was only later that they changed their minds and prefer to be referred as African Americans.
I don't know any thing about American history but any black origin person know if this was true?


The white guy lied to you.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 9:18:43 AM   
chatterbox24


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Greta, whites like to be called Creepy Crackers in the USA. IT gives us a warm fuzzy feeling.
Gotcha! That's a lie too.
Oh I just had to say it again!!!! Doesn't take much to entertain me, I think.
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

A white American older southern gentlemen about 70 yr old once told me that, at one point of American history. It was the blacks who wanted to be called the "N" word. And that's how it started. It was only later that they changed their minds and prefer to be referred as African Americans.
I don't know any thing about American history but any black origin person know if this was true?


The white guy lied to you.


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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 9:22:22 AM   
chloryformME


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hate speech only exist in one direction. No black man will ever be convicted for hate speech.
the fact the phrase hate speech exist means free speech is dead.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 9:54:18 AM   
Musicmystery


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Not in formal settings.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:10:56 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
The white guy lied to you.

But Wikipedia says it is true! At one point of time, that word was not derogatory but simply a factual word to describe a specific race. So he said at one point of time, black people were okay with it. He said it started with Negro, then Nigger, and then later African American.

Among Anglophones, the word nigger was not always considered derogatory, because it then denoted "black-skinned", a common Anglophone usage.[4] Nineteenth-century English (language) literature features usages of nigger without racist connotation, e.g. the Joseph Conrad novella The Nigger of the 'Narcissus' (1897). Moreover, Charles Dickens and Mark Twain created characters who used the word as contemporary usage. Twain, in the autobiographic book Life on the Mississippi (1883), used the term within quotes, indicating reported usage, but used the term "negro" when speaking in his own narrative persona.[5]

During the fur trade of the early 1800s to the late 1840s in the Western United States, the word was spelled "niggur", and is often recorded in literature of the time. George Fredrick Ruxton often included the word as part of the "mountain man" lexicon, did not indicate that the word was pejorative at the time. "Niggur" was evidently similar to the modern use of dude, or guy. This passage from Ruxton's Life in the Far West illustrates a common use of the word in spoken form—the speaker here referring to himself: "Travler, marm, this niggur's no travler; I ar' a trapper, marm, a mountain-man, wagh!"[6] It was not used as a term exclusively for blacks among mountain men during this period, as Indians, Mexicans, and Frenchmen and Anglos alike could be a "niggur".[7]

By the 1900s, nigger had become a pejorative word. In its stead, the term colored became the mainstream alternative to negro and its derived terms.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigger

So there was a progression where "nigger" was once simply a word like, "Africans". Until today, it's seen as an insult.

LOL!!! First time I see CollarMe Censor words!! Wow! Anyway, the **** is the N word. So you have to type it in replacement of the **** in the wikipedia link.

Testing Gook! Ahh can't use the N word but okay for the G word. How about Wetback? Wow! That's acceptable too! The N word is really heavy duty huh?

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/16/2014 10:27:59 AM >

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:33:07 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

Testing Gook! Ahh can't use the N word but okay for the G word. How about Wetback? Wow! That's acceptable too! The N word is really heavy duty huh?

Probably as a result of seeing all those signs held by anti-segregationists on television during the 1960s.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:42:15 AM   
chatterbox24


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ok ok!!! waves hand in the air.

Why in a lot of rap music do black/African americans call your own selves the N=naughty word?

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:48:00 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

ok ok!!! waves hand in the air.

Why in a lot of rap music do black/African americans call your own selves the N=naughty word?

What's the racist word for white people?
In my country, it's Ang Moh Kao, or Ang Moh Kuai which really just means, Red Hair Dog or Red Hair Ghost. Not sure if it's really insulting.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:49:05 AM   
Moderator3


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I guess I have some work to do on the word filter. Please don't try to test it or get around it. It is better that the word filter catches it than a moderator.

Just don't call people or groups of people names that diminish them based on race or origins.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 10:59:55 AM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: Greta75

So there was a progression where "nigger" was once simply a word like, "Africans". Until today, it's seen as an insult.


I am sure you are aware of the "validity" issues that exist with wiki.
Suppose for a moment you are a black slave in the rural u.s. and your owner refers to you with that word,what are your options? So to say that it was acceptable at that time is to ignore the fact that it was only acceptable to the white guys.



Testing xxxx! Ahh can't use the N word but okay for the G word. How about xxxxxxx? Wow! That's acceptable too! The N word is really heavy duty huh?


Is it possible that anyone with an iq greater than 50 could come up with other ethnic slurs that might bypass the filters and yet leave the bigots purpose clear?


< Message edited by thompsonx -- 5/16/2014 11:05:27 AM >

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 11:02:03 AM   
Moderator3


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Please stop repeating it all or I will lock the thread.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 11:02:45 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

ok ok!!! waves hand in the air.

Why in a lot of rap music do black/African americans call your own selves the N=naughty word?



This is really a peurile question. I have seen your profile and you claim to be over 21. You are an articulate person and not computer illiterate. Perhaps you mght seek help from google. Then you may be disabused of your ignorance either feigned or real.

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 11:07:51 AM   
Greta75


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Suppose for a moment you are a black slave in the rural u.s. and your owner refers to you with that word,what are your options? So to say that it was acceptable at that time is to ignore the fact that it was only acceptable to the white guys.

I kinda see it more like, typical American to change the spelling of words. Started with Negro, and then change it to the evil N word that we all know now.
I reckon at that time if chinese were slaves, they would use the word "chinese" with derision as well, but that's not the point. Why let another stupid race define what that word means.

Fact that black americans are able to to use the N word among themselves lovingly, tells me it's origin is not meant to be derogatory.

I ask about what are white racist words because I notice something in chinese countries, alot of white folks would approach me, introducing and addressing himself by the cantonese racist slur lol, and they always feel like that would break the ice, well it always made me smile because they don't take themselves seriously.

It's like a black guy telling a white girl that his the N word. Like, "Hi, I'm a N****, nice to meet you." I kid you not, white guys do this in Asia as pick up line. I mean introducing themselves as the cantonese white men slur word.



< Message edited by Greta75 -- 5/16/2014 11:14:02 AM >

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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 11:09:30 AM   
subrob1967


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FR

There is no such thing as hate speech, there is only speech. You don't have a right to be offended, you have a choice.

< Message edited by subrob1967 -- 5/16/2014 11:10:27 AM >


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RE: Hate speech or free speech or both? - 5/16/2014 11:11:10 AM   
crazyml


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

FR

There is no such thing as hate speech,


Yes there is, and there's a pretty well understood definition of what it is.

Perhaps you should google it if you're confused?


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