RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault...

RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (Full Version)

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BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 4:54:28 PM)
We have repeatedly said that this is not acceptable but you fail to recognize this fact. Wrong we have a couple of pages of denial on this.

BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 4:58:20 PM)
I agree - that IS Hamas' goal. I don't agree with their goal, but I also don't agree that they should be held prisoner under siege for 8 years either. [ETA] Yes, Egypt also maintain a blockade too - but only Israel blockade both land and sea. As long as you play this moral equivalency game you are siding with Hamas even if you do not realize it. If this was a "Zionist" plot do you really think Egyptians would participate, that defies reason. Any blockade by Israel without the Egyptians would be a waste of time.

DomKen -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 4:59:25 PM)
I will note that there are many posts denying that Hamas violates the laws of war, that Hamas uses human shields, that Hamas hides weapons insides civilian structures, that Hamas doesn't launch rockets from inside civilian areas and now comparisons of the Israelis to the Nazis. Anybody wonder why someone might get the impression some posters support Hamas?

PeonForHer -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 5:25:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen I will note that there are many posts denying that Hamas violates the laws of war, that Hamas uses human shields, that Hamas hides weapons insides civilian structures, that Hamas doesn't launch rockets from inside civilian areas and now comparisons of the Israelis to the Nazis. Anybody wonder why someone might get the impression some posters support Hamas? Nobody gives a flying shit about Hamas, Ken. I think that what it's really about is that lots of posters here just don't buy into the story that Israel is all about fine, decent, civilised people, whereas the residents of Gaza are nasty verminous, deranged "terrorists". Gazan children may be just the children of vermin to you, Ken, but, nonetheless, we - that is, most of the world outside of the USA and Israel - just can't help seeing them as innocent, human, children. To put this as simply and as straightforwardly as possible, Ken: the Israeli army is killing children by the hundred and it, the Israeli government, and apparently most Israeli citizens, don't give a toss about it. Even if it were true about the line regarding 'human shields', it would still be irrelevant. Anyone who supports this mass killing of children is a revolting little cunt. Do you grasp that? You, whoever 'you' are, do not get to claim that killing lots of children is righteous and expect to be treated as other than a cunt. They are not subhumans, no matter how much the Israeli propaganda machine has pumped this message so hard and so long. That is true no matter how much your race suffered half a century before. Get over it. The Israelis are the oppressors here, abundantly clearly, and you have sided one hundred percent with them. Whatever socialist, left wing sensibilities you've had, have disappeared up their own anus.

BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 5:48:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen I will note that there are many posts denying that Hamas violates the laws of war, that Hamas uses human shields, that Hamas hides weapons insides civilian structures, that Hamas doesn't launch rockets from inside civilian areas and now comparisons of the Israelis to the Nazis. Anybody wonder why someone might get the impression some posters support Hamas? Nobody gives a flying shit about Hamas, Ken. I think that what it's really about is that lots of posters here just don't buy into the story that Israel is all about fine, decent, civilised people, whereas the residents of Gaza are nasty verminous, deranged "terrorists". Gazan children may be just the children of vermin to you, Ken, but, nonetheless, we - that is, most of the world outside of the USA and Israel - just can't help seeing them as innocent, human, children. To put this as simply and as straightforwardly as possible, Ken: the Israeli army is killing children by the hundred and it, the Israeli government, and apparently most Israeli citizens, don't give a toss about it. Even if it were true about the line regarding 'human shields', it would still be irrelevant. Anyone who supports this mass killing of children is a revolting little cunt. Do you grasp that? You, whoever 'you' are, do not get to claim that killing lots of children is righteous and expect to be treated as other than a cunt. They are not subhumans, no matter how much the Israeli propaganda machine has pumped this message so hard and so long. That is true no matter how much your race suffered half a century before. Get over it. The Israelis are the oppressors here, abundantly clearly, and you have sided one hundred percent with them. Whatever socialist, left wing sensibilities you've had, have disappeared up their own anus. I, for one, have never made any of the claims about Arab children you attribute to those who disagree with you. I think the children and most of the people of Gaza, not to be confused with Hamas, are victims. Hamas puts their weapons in the middle of these people, they attack primarily civilian targets in Israel and Israel naturally strikes back. The non-Hamas residents pay a disproportionate price and Hamas uses that for propaganda which those who turn a blind eye to this evil accept.

PeonForHer -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 6:01:31 PM)
The British mainland suffered for decades from IRA attacks, Bama. We didn't fire missiles that destroyed large chunks of Northern Ireland, though. In my book, if you claim to fight terrorists, you fight terrorists, and not the ordinary people, the women and the children, who happen to live nearby. Especially not if your military is state of the art and funded to the tune of $3 billion per year from a foreign government. It's a fucking cowardly, disgusting, disgrace.

thishereboi -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 6:08:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD Typical you claim not to take sides and then only one side is wrong, and what things the other side does that could be considered wrong is justified and caused by the first side. In other words you are doing exactly what you are accusing Ken of doing. Apparently it's ok as long as you choose the right side to back up. Except in this case (at least from what peon says) that would be the left side. And DK seems to be really confusing people because he isn't toeing the party line and parroting their beliefs. Perhaps things are not as black and white as some would like them to be. Pot kettle and black. Are you suggesting because some of use believe the same as Ken on some issues we have to march in lockstep. No but peons post here suggested that some might think he is out of line because he isn't following the rest you on this. quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: And by the 3rd GC Hamas is the guilty party for trying to use civilians to shield its military actions. But that isn't happening, Ken. It's just a load of Israeli dogshit propaganda. There's no corroborated evidence of this. Furthermore, it's next to impossible to imagine how the Israelis could possibly come by the intelligence of it, either. Jesus, the guff that Israel is pumping out can't stand up to even a minute's interrogation. It's utter bollocks. Come on - you can generally see through this kind of thing. You don't generally lap up every piece of right wing propaganda that's fed to you. Why do you come over all sponge-like when it comes to the subject of Israel and Palestine? quote: Todays question should be are you that fucking stupid...... its rhetorical question since most of us already know. What most of us already know that if you don't have a point to make you fall back on standard insults. You are certainly predictable if nothing else.

thishereboi -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 6:15:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer Gazan children may be just the children of vermin to you, Ken, but, nonetheless, we - that is, most of the world outside of the USA and Israel - just can't help seeing them as innocent, human, children. There really should be some kind of award for the most arrogant bullshit posted on the forums to date.

PeonForHer -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 6:43:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi There really should be some kind of award for the most arrogant bullshit posted on the forums to date. Nup, not worth it. THB, I don't know what you're getting at, nor why, and now I no longer care.

BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 7:14:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer The British mainland suffered for decades from IRA attacks, Bama. We didn't fire missiles that destroyed large chunks of Northern Ireland, though. In my book, if you claim to fight terrorists, you fight terrorists, and not the ordinary people, the women and the children, who happen to live nearby. Especially not if your military is state of the art and funded to the tune of $3 billion per year from a foreign government. It's a fucking cowardly, disgusting, disgrace. How soon we forget, the British army was based in Northern Ireland. For Israel to handle it like the Brits did, which drew a lot of criticism, they would have to take over Gaza. Is that what you want? Or do you want them to just ignore the missiles? Or maybe send a substantial military force in and invade every time there is an attack.

BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 7:20:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: thishereboi There really should be some kind of award for the most arrogant bullshit posted on the forums to date. Nup, not worth it. THB, I don't know what you're getting at, nor why, and now I no longer care. Has it even occurred to you that those of us who disagree may not be heartless, disgusting, monsters. And again genocide is worse than anything Israel has done.

PeonForHer -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 7:42:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD For Israel to handle it like the Brits did, which drew a lot of criticism, they would have to take over Gaza. Is that what you want? Or do you want them to just ignore the missiles? Or maybe send a substantial military force in and invade every time there is an attack. I'm not a nationalist, Bama. I wouldn't be, as a lefty, would I? Therefore nothing I say about what Britain does, or once did, should be taken as implicitly 'the right thing to do and what every other country should do'. The British government made a pig's ear of things in Northern Ireland for decades. The British Army was in there, arrogantly riding roughshod over ordinary people, being arrogant, blatantly racist and general creating ten more new terrorists for every one terrorist that it managed to catch or kill. But the British Army did not fire missiles and destroy buildings, including hospitals and schools. It never gave the world good reason to say, 'The Brits are waging war against the Northern Irish people'. Israel claims to know precisely where the terrorists are. Supposing that this isn't bullshit (which I'm pretty sure it is), then why can't it send in tanks to pick up these people? Why fire missiles from afar and destroy essential infrastructure? It just seems absolutely, abundantly, clear to me that Israel wants to attack Gaza as though it's attacking another nation, as though it's a two-nation, symmetrical war - like England versus Germany in WW2. But it's not that. Gaza really is nothing more than a big prison. It has far too much dependency on Israel, and is controlled far too much by it, to be anything else. So what we have here is, in effect, a prison riot, in which some prisoners are getting aggressive, but can't do much, while most of them are just plain terrified. The 'prison warders', meanwhile, are using their state of the art weaponry to shoot at all inside the prison, regardless.

PeonForHer -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 7:48:01 PM)
quote: Has it even occurred to you that those of us who disagree may not be heartless, disgusting, monsters. And again genocide is worse than anything Israel has done. OK. Actually, I wouldn't for a minute imagine you, or most people, being in charge of an army and ordering that missiles be fired at some distant target, in the knowledge that lots of innocents, including children, might be killed as a result. But I don't get why it's somehow OK for Israel to do this. There's a disconnect that I can't grasp, there.

DomKen -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 8:16:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen I will note that there are many posts denying that Hamas violates the laws of war, that Hamas uses human shields, that Hamas hides weapons insides civilian structures, that Hamas doesn't launch rockets from inside civilian areas and now comparisons of the Israelis to the Nazis. Anybody wonder why someone might get the impression some posters support Hamas? Nobody gives a flying shit about Hamas, Ken. I think that what it's really about is that lots of posters here just don't buy into the story that Israel is all about fine, decent, civilised people, whereas the residents of Gaza are nasty verminous, deranged "terrorists". Gazan children may be just the children of vermin to you, Ken, but, nonetheless, we - that is, most of the world outside of the USA and Israel - just can't help seeing them as innocent, human, children. To put this as simply and as straightforwardly as possible, Ken: the Israeli army is killing children by the hundred and it, the Israeli government, and apparently most Israeli citizens, don't give a toss about it. Even if it were true about the line regarding 'human shields', it would still be irrelevant. Anyone who supports this mass killing of children is a revolting little cunt. Do you grasp that? You, whoever 'you' are, do not get to claim that killing lots of children is righteous and expect to be treated as other than a cunt. They are not subhumans, no matter how much the Israeli propaganda machine has pumped this message so hard and so long. That is true no matter how much your race suffered half a century before. Get over it. The Israelis are the oppressors here, abundantly clearly, and you have sided one hundred percent with them. Whatever socialist, left wing sensibilities you've had, have disappeared up their own anus. You're full of shit. You're attacking me simply because I've shown you to be wrong and it makes you uncomfortable. I've never made any such disgusting claims about the Palestinian people and never would. I have always and will say that I would prefer that no civilians be killed but that I can read the laws of war.

DomKen -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 8:22:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer The British mainland suffered for decades from IRA attacks, Bama. We didn't fire missiles that destroyed large chunks of Northern Ireland, though. In my book, if you claim to fight terrorists, you fight terrorists, and not the ordinary people, the women and the children, who happen to live nearby. Especially not if your military is state of the art and funded to the tune of $3 billion per year from a foreign government. It's a fucking cowardly, disgusting, disgrace. The British took actions just as harsh, including collective punishment, don't try and pretend otherwise. How many Irish women and children were killed by British forces during the troubles? Is there even an estimate?

BamaD -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 8:30:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: Has it even occurred to you that those of us who disagree may not be heartless, disgusting, monsters. And again genocide is worse than anything Israel has done. OK. Actually, I wouldn't for a minute imagine you, or most people, being in charge of an army and ordering that missiles be fired at some distant target, in the knowledge that lots of innocents, including children, might be killed as a result. But I don't get why it's somehow OK for Israel to do this. There's a disconnect that I can't grasp, there. So the only alternative is to send troops in each time, are you aware that civilian casualties would be even greater? Better 1000 of theirs than 1 of mine.

Musicmystery -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 8:31:34 PM)
Ah. The road to endless war. Well, the weapons manufacturers will be happy.

Kirata -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 9:30:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD I have not allowed the fact that you are wrong lead me into attacking your character or your honesty. DomKen has that part covered. So you're defending comparing a couple of hundred deaths to a couple of hundred thousand. How utterly unsurprising. Is this just more of your usual attacking anything I post or are you really agreeing with that vile crap? I guess it will be impossible to find out. Pay attention to the pretty red words. I was commenting on your tactic of launching personal attacks against people who hold views that differ from your own. See how that works? It's called English, Ken. Now go crawl back under your bridge. K.

DomKen -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 9:49:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD I have not allowed the fact that you are wrong lead me into attacking your character or your honesty. DomKen has that part covered. So you're defending comparing a couple of hundred deaths to a couple of hundred thousand. How utterly unsurprising. Is this just more of your usual attacking anything I post or are you really agreeing with that vile crap? I guess it will be impossible to find out. Pay attention to the pretty red words. I was commenting on your tactic of launching personal attacks against people who hold views that differ from your own. See how that works? It's called English, Ken. Now go crawl back under your bridge. Sure. It's called tone trolling. You jumped into something you haven't been involved in to take a gratuitous swipe. It was as obvious as boi's trolling. I'll note that you failed to make a snide snarky post about the assault on my character that just occurred. Kind of shows you are not actually commenting on the tactic at all.

Kirata -> RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... (7/30/2014 10:24:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen It's called tone trolling. You jumped into something you haven't been involved in to take a gratuitous swipe. Yep, did that. But let's define our terms here... A tone troll is an internet troll that will effectively disrupt an internet discussion, because they feel that some of the participants are being too harsh, condescending, or use foul language. ~Urban Dictionary My comment was addressed to none of these things. It was addressed to your intellectual dishonesty. And it doesn't seem to have disrupted the discussion at all, unless of course you're planning to now. quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen I'll note that you failed to make a snide snarky post about the assault on my character that just occurred. Kind of shows you are not actually commenting on the tactic at all. That's true. I'm commenting on the regularity and frequency with which you can be counted upon to employ it. Now put your big boy panties on and chalk it up as social feedback. We all get it. You'll live. K.

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