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RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:09:47 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
I'm really not concerned about terrorism in regard to this issue. Ebola is already here, in storage, and has been for some time... so the vulnerability is pre-existing.
However, I am surprised that "they" transported infected people TO the U.S., or really, away from the origin of the infection. Here's why...
In a biological ethics class I took some years ago, genetic engineering was covered. An example, was manipulating the gene that causes? sickle cell anemia. We can do that. But, then they discovered another expression of the same gene... that in Africa, it protects against malaria. Apparently we humans adapt to our environment. There can be unintended effects in science and medicine.
So, I would need more information to allay my fears about this question... by transporting the ill person(s) from the location of original infection, are we changing something important? It does bring up fears like the effect Europeans had on Native Americans, or American missionaries introducing venereal diseases to previously robust and healthy Amazonian tribes.
I travel. I always thought I was taking health risks in doing so and assumed the American government would NOT be coming to my rescue, should I become infected with a disease as potentially deadly as Ebola.
Mixing issues is rarely productive, but seriously, if we care about the "threat of illegal alien children," why is this okay?


Perhaps the virus in the body is better able to be studied here than there?

The illegal alien children are bringing some infectious diseases with them, too. While they probably aren't bringing in anything with the lethal effects of ebola, they are being shipped all over the US. We will have brought in 2 people infected with ebola, in separate aircraft, and transported them in a very controlled, confined manner. There is a huge difference between two controlled, confined transports to medical facilities that can treat and study a disease and thousands of kids being sent to several US cities to not-medical living quarters.




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(in reply to BecomingV)
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RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:11:10 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
Sarcasm is lost on me

So is reason, rationality, and anything else that doesn't fit your bigoted little view of the world.
Maybe ebola should go global. The fucking herd needs some serious culling anyway. Just think of how much it would decrease our carbon output...

That's an interesting way of thinking.
Who were you thinking of culling??
Just as long as it's not you or your circle of friends and family. Eh??


Survival of the fittest, no?


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:18:17 PM   
FelineRanger


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Maybe ebola should go global. The fucking herd needs some serious culling anyway. Just think of how much it would decrease our carbon output...



Is it just me or does that sound like a volunteer?

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:23:33 PM   
BecomingV


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
I'm really not concerned about terrorism in regard to this issue. Ebola is already here, in storage, and has been for some time... so the vulnerability is pre-existing.
However, I am surprised that "they" transported infected people TO the U.S., or really, away from the origin of the infection. Here's why...
In a biological ethics class I took some years ago, genetic engineering was covered. An example, was manipulating the gene that causes? sickle cell anemia. We can do that. But, then they discovered another expression of the same gene... that in Afrca, it protects against malaria. Apparently we humans adapt to our environment. There can be unintended effects in science and medicine.
So, I would need more information to allay my fears about this question... by transporting the ill person(s) from the location of original infection, are we changing something important? It does bring up fears like the effect Europeans had on Native Americans, or American missionaries introducing venereal diseases to previously robust and healthy Amazonian tribes.
I travel. I always thought I was taking health risks in doing so and assumed the American government would NOT be coming to my rescue, should I become infected with a disease as potentially deadly as Ebola.
Mixing issues is rarely productive, but seriously, if we care about the "threat of illegal alien children," why is this okay?


Perhaps the virus in the body is better able to be studied here than there?

The illegal alien children are bringing some infectious diseases with them, too. While they probably aren't bringing in anything with the lethal effects of ebola, they are being shipped all over the US. We will have brought in 2 people infected with ebola, in separate aircraft, and transported them in a very controlled, confined manner. There is a huge difference between two controlled, confined transports to medical facilities that can treat and study a disease and thousands of kids being sent to several US cities to not-medical living quarters.





Point taken. I should have clarified. I meant the kids who are born here "off the books." ANYONE who travels can become a carrier.

I lived in the UK in the 80's... and although I am almost a vegetarian, it's challenging to avoid meat products, so neither I, nor my children, can donate blood in the U.S. now. So, I have to wonder at why bringing in known, infected people... to help them, of course, tips the scales in terms of putting the rest of us at risk.

I admit to only having limited knowledge of the containment of Ebola, but I have studied International Relations, in depth, in graduate school. This entailed research with WHO (the world health organization), the CDC (the center for disease control) and the UN (United Nations) initiatives. So, my sources which inform my fear over this, are as good as they get. The UN studies involved containment responses to crises such as: epidemics, natural disaster and violent conflicts.

My point is, last I heard, we DO NOT have the experience or knowledge or skills to insure protection against the spread of contagious disease, yet. I was kind of hoping that someone here knew of some developments in this area. I'd seriously like to know that my concern is no longer valid.

Anyone?

ETA - Is this a case of us studying someone so we may develop an antidote because it IS likely to spread? Is this about the status or wealth or influence of the individuals they brought to the U.S.? I haven't seen anything on the "why" of it.


< Message edited by BecomingV -- 8/2/2014 3:27:47 PM >

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:27:55 PM   
TheHeretic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri


Perhaps the virus in the body is better able to be studied here than there?




From what I read about the infected Dr. walking into the hospital on his own, we may have better than that, DS - a recent survivor to poke, prod, drain, and biopsy.

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Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:40:02 PM   
TheHeretic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
Is this a case of us studying someone so we may develop an antidote because it IS likely to spread? Is this about the status or wealth or influence of the individuals they brought to the U.S.? I haven't seen anything on the "why" of it.




I'd like to believe it is about being able to bring our people home. These are Americans who went into dangerous places, to try to make a difference. It's the right thing to do. But having cases that can be safely studied directly by the best minds around certainly is a plus I doubt will be allowed to go to waste.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to BecomingV)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 3:57:37 PM   
BecomingV


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Heretic - that may just be the most positive thing you've ever written here. :)
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
Is this a case of us studying someone so we may develop an antidote because it IS likely to spread? Is this about the status or wealth or influence of the individuals they brought to the U.S.? I haven't seen anything on the "why" of it.




I'd like to believe it is about being able to bring our people home. These are Americans who went into dangerous places, to try to make a difference. It's the right thing to do. But having cases that can be safely studied directly by the best minds around certainly is a plus I doubt will be allowed to go to waste.


I'm supportive of offering them all of the support and medical help we can offer. However, I'm questioning the... I guess call it... cost/benefit analysis of doing that here. Or, anywhere, away from the origin of infection. And, I question that because:

1) we aren't perfect at containment of disease and this one's a whopper

2) humans change in response to their natural environments, as I describe in the genetic manipulation example
ie/ manipulating the gene that causes sickle cell anemia, which is a killer among African Americans, in particular, has unknown consequences. They discovered the exact same gene, PROTECTS Africans, living in Africa, from malaria, which is a major killer there. Biological ethics asks... what do we value and at what cost? And, cautions against changing our genetics BEFORE we know about unintended results.

So, when it comes to flying Ebola from one continent, to another... it appears to be a major gamble.

Unless... and I'm hoping this is the case, I am missing a part of the picture here.

Is there a reason why we should NOT be concerned about the spread of Ebola, here?


< Message edited by BecomingV -- 8/2/2014 4:10:17 PM >

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/2/2014 4:40:57 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: KYsissy

It's not like viruses can mutate rapidly. . . . .

It will more than likely be just fine, but if it isn't, things could get bad real fast.

Really??

Try telling that to the 'Flu virus that mutates several times a year.
That's why any 'Flu vaccination can only boost against last year's variety.

Admittedly, not every virus is quite that bad, but we don't know an awful lot about Ebola either.
Who is to say that it can't mutate and re-attack just like the various Bird 'Flu viruses did?

We won't know until it happens.


ETA: Ebola's 90% kill rate ain't to be sniffed at - that's some serious deaths to consider!



Just to get the hysteria under some sort of control.

Yes, a virus can mutate very rapidly. However Ebola is a very simple virus (it only codes for 7 proteins, influenza codes for 11). It is so lethal because it is so simple. To become airborne it would have to pick up a bunch of new genes from some where, not impossible but it would make it bigger and slower to reproduce and more "visible" to our immune systems which would tend to make it less lethal.

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/3/2014 4:18:08 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

Ebola patients are heading to or are currently in the U.S. in a plastic room to keep the deadly virus from killing at least sixty precent of the U.S. should it get out of containment. So, given jihad terrorists willingly blow themselves up to achieve their goal, isn't this their opportunity to attack the hospital and effect the spread of this virus to the general U.S. and eventually the North and South American continents? How easy we have made it for them, we actually brought the 'bomb' here ourselves and protected it with plastic.



Obviously just brain dead, judging from the tripe you have written.

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/3/2014 6:43:48 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Perhaps the virus in the body is better able to be studied here than there?

From what I read about the infected Dr. walking into the hospital on his own, we may have better than that, DS - a recent survivor to poke, prod, drain, and biopsy.


Wasn't the report that he was leaning heavily on the two other bio-hazard-suit clad people?




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What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Are we dead? - 8/3/2014 6:48:33 AM   
Lucylastic


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well he wasnt horizontal, or in a chair...so its semantics....

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 4:13:33 PM   
Arturas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Ebola isn't easy to catch. It's only spread by bodily fluid exchange. you guys can relax.

and avoid any fruit bats if you see any.


So, the ticks and mosquitoes now know to stop exchanging bodily fluids with us?

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 4:33:57 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

So, the ticks and mosquitoes now know to stop exchanging bodily fluids with us?



Is your Google broken...... ticks and mosquitoes dont transmit the virus.

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 4:36:00 PM   
deathtothepixies


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Ebola isn't easy to catch. It's only spread by bodily fluid exchange. you guys can relax.

and avoid any fruit bats if you see any.


So, the ticks and mosquitoes now know to stop exchanging bodily fluids with us?


your tag line or sig line or whatever it's called says...

we master our world

you seem to be running scared of ticks and mosquitoes, not very masterful

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 6:46:34 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

Ebola patients are heading to or are currently in the U.S. in a plastic room to keep the deadly virus from killing at least sixty precent of the U.S. should it get out of containment. So, given jihad terrorists willingly blow themselves up to achieve their goal, isn't this their opportunity to attack the hospital and effect the spread of this virus to the general U.S. and eventually the North and South American continents? How easy we have made it for them, we actually brought the 'bomb' here ourselves and protected it with plastic.

I can not imagine a post/thread based on such a bullshit scaremongering scenario.
I feel sad for you Arturas....

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 7:19:55 PM   
evesgrden


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

Ebola patients are heading to or are currently in the U.S. in a plastic room to keep the deadly virus from killing at least sixty precent of the U.S. should it get out of containment. So, given jihad terrorists willingly blow themselves up to achieve their goal, isn't this their opportunity to attack the hospital and effect the spread of this virus to the general U.S. and eventually the North and South American continents? How easy we have made it for them, we actually brought the 'bomb' here ourselves and protected it with plastic.




Oh fer gawd sakes... get a grip.

A coward dies a thousand deaths; a brave man dies but one.

just sayin'

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 8:10:27 PM   
ThirdWheelWanted


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ETA: Trying to embed a picture


< Message edited by ThirdWheelWanted -- 8/5/2014 8:13:13 PM >

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 8:12:43 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Ebola isn't easy to catch. It's only spread by bodily fluid exchange. you guys can relax.

and avoid any fruit bats if you see any.


So, the ticks and mosquitoes now know to stop exchanging bodily fluids with us?

So far the only known animal that it is known to survive in besides primates is fruit bats. If it could survive in mosquitoes or ticks it would spread much more easily in Africa.

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 8:15:10 PM   
ThirdWheelWanted


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Saw this and thought it was worth adding.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by ThirdWheelWanted -- 8/5/2014 8:16:19 PM >

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RE: Are we dead? - 8/5/2014 8:37:08 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
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lets face it we have more chance of catching ebola than the OP making an honest thread.

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