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how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:09:21 PM   
whtsubf4DOM


Posts: 23
Joined: 1/25/2005
Status: offline 		What do you consider the most important element in a successful D/s relationship? Would it be structure?
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:14:03 PM   
Caretakr


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Joined: 6/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

What do you consider the most important element in a successful D/s relationship? Would it be structure?


No, I consider basic social skills the most important.

Rules will not save a bonehead from screwing up.

On either side of the equation.


(in reply to whtsubf4DOM)
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:29:40 PM   
Sparr0w


Posts: 15
Joined: 7/11/2006
From: Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

What do you consider the most important element in a successful D/s relationship? Would it be structure?

I would have to agree with Caretakr that basic social skills would be the most important. If you can not communicate effectively, you can not maintain a relationship of any kind. Just my thoughts though.

(in reply to whtsubf4DOM)
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:30:40 PM   
whtsubf4DOM


Posts: 23
Joined: 1/25/2005
Status: offline 		is structure necessary for every D/s relationship though?

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:31:58 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline 		Communication. Followed closely by trust.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:32:00 PM   
Sparr0w


Posts: 15
Joined: 7/11/2006
From: Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

is structure necessary for every D/s relationship though?

To answer that, you would first have to define what YOU mean by structure.

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:34:15 PM   
jezabelKH


Posts: 663
Joined: 5/21/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

What do you consider the most important element in a successful D/s relationship? Would it be structure?


i find the following important in any relationship:

1. communication
2. respect
3. honor, integrity and honesty
4. structure or boundry's

but mind you 4 is useless, unless you have 1-3 in place first.

jezabel{KH}
just simply a slave
Property Of Master Ken

(in reply to whtsubf4DOM)
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:34:52 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

is structure necessary for every D/s relationship though?


There are rules and boundaries for every relationship, whether it be vanilla, kinky, poly, hetero, homo or even with your dog. So, it's not something specific to D/s.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:43:53 PM   
MasterRobert1


Posts: 225
Joined: 7/18/2005
Status: offline 		Structure is an element, but certainly not the most important element. I feel integrity and honesty are fundamental to any long term, healthy D/s relationship.

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:48:24 PM   
whtsubf4DOM


Posts: 23
Joined: 1/25/2005
Status: offline 		Ok...I know my screen name doesn't indicate it, but really I am a switch. I Domme one guy and one guy only. There is an extreme amount of trust between us and no secrets.

He has been single and living by himself for 10 years now. He is very bi submissive and likes "visiting" black men and experiencing new things (like TG's, CD's. beastiality, whatever). He's lost his last three girlfriends to black men and now feels that the only people he can please are men (although he tells me that I turn him on immensely).  The man has no limits when it comes to trying new things. In my judgment, he is out of control in some way.  In a conversation we had earlier today, he told me that he has never held himself accountable for anything (and he goes WAY over the top sometimes and does a lot of things without thinking). He told me that he has avoided structure for the past 10 years.

All that said, we have spoken about a 24/7 contract between us. He wants intense training on how to be a man and decent lover (which would take a LOT of hard work)  along with all the other training and stuff that goes with a D/s relationship.He wants the contract, but is afraid to take that step because he's afraid of structure.

Here is something else he told me today (keep in mind, he is the one who approached me about the contract):
"i would be going from something i do not have and seem to avoid, to a situation where everythin in my life revolves and grows around that structure. i may go outta my mind!"
 
Without structure, i don't think he is very trainable....

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:51:30 PM   
Mercnbeth


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quote:

whtsubf4DOM
the most important element in a successful D/s relationship?


"Most Important"?

Common goal(s).

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:52:41 PM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

What do you consider the most important element in a successful D/s relationship? Would it be structure?


Recognition of and desire for the Ds dynamic -- if you don't share that goal and won't put in the mutual effort to maintain it, it will fall apart.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:53:57 PM   
jezabelKH


Posts: 663
Joined: 5/21/2006
Status: offline 		in my honest opinion based on the information you gave because i do not know you or him this is my opinion

he seems wishy washy, flighty, and un-trainable. he is not afraid of structure he is afraid of commitment.....so why waste your time?

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:58:42 PM   
Caretakr


Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: whtsubf4DOM

Ok...I know my screen name doesn't indicate it, but really I am a switch. I Domme one guy and one guy only. There is an extreme amount of trust between us and no secrets.

He has been single and living by himself for 10 years now. He is very bi submissive and likes "visiting" black men and experiencing new things (like TG's, CD's. beastiality, whatever). He's lost his last three girlfriends to black men and now feels that the only people he can please are men (although he tells me that I turn him on immensely).  The man has no limits when it comes to trying new things. In my judgment, he is out of control in some way.  In a conversation we had earlier today, he told me that he has never held himself accountable for anything (and he goes WAY over the top sometimes and does a lot of things without thinking). He told me that he has avoided structure for the past 10 years.

All that said, we have spoken about a 24/7 contract between us. He wants intense training on how to be a man and decent lover (which would take a LOT of hard work)  along with all the other training and stuff that goes with a D/s relationship.He wants the contract, but is afraid to take that step because he's afraid of structure.

Here is something else he told me today (keep in mind, he is the one who approached me about the contract):
"i would be going from something i do not have and seem to avoid, to a situation where everythin in my life revolves and grows around that structure. i may go outta my mind!"
 
Without structure, i don't think he is very trainable....

Get his ass into counseling,then try it when he has half a grip.

(in reply to whtsubf4DOM)
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 12:59:10 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		I do not think there is just one important element of a Ds relationship. If pressed about the most important element I would say it is love. I know for others this may not be true... but for me there is no separation.. For the dynamic to grow, deepen, and have success... there must be the growth of love eventually. But this is just my view

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to whtsubf4DOM)
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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 1:00:09 PM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
I wouldn't say he is untrainable - just concerned and communicating to you that concern.  If you can, just reassure him that your there to make sure he doesn't go outta his mind and if he trusts you with that, then thats all that matters.
 
Structure and discipline (not the physical and sexual kind only) will be important within this relationship - especially in the beginning and it must be maintained.  If you think you can do that, then go for it.  Communication is the key to any relationship - D/s as well - and that is the most important.  The whys, the what will happens, the worries.  Structure is a part - but communication is going to be the most important here IMO.
 
Peace and Rapture


_____________________________
.dark.



...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

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RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 1:27:57 PM   
Caretakr


Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline 		I'll add one last word of advice.

I've tried to control sexual addicts with structure in the past. It didn't work,and it cannot.

It's a disorder,and it needs to be addressed by a professional.

Not someone playing at whips and chains.

(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 1:44:55 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		It is a highly contentious thing, calling someone that engages in poor decisions sexually a sex addict. I did some research on sex addiction to help a friend determine whether she was involved with one, and I was shocked to find out that this is not really considered an addiction by many of those who study addiction. It is like someone that is compulsive about any behavior, they are not necessarily addicted to it.. like compulsive thieves and liars. You may get a rush off of stealing something, but it doesn't mean you are addicted to it according to the reading I have done on the subject.

That being said, there are people that have poor impulse control, and the last thing these individuals need is a dominant to try to change that fact... they need to get a grip on their behavior on their own...

On edit,... sex addiction may well exist as far as I know...lol... I just wanted to put a new idea that I had recently discovered out there... I am not a psych specialist of any variety.


< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 7/11/2006 1:49:24 PM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Caretakr)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 1:57:02 PM   
Caretakr


Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

It is a highly contentious thing, calling someone that engages in poor decisions sexually a sex addict. I did some research on sex addiction to help a friend determine whether she was involved with one, and I was shocked to find out that this is not really considered an addiction by many of those who study addiction. It is like someone that is compulsive about any behavior, they are not necessarily addicted to it.. like compulsive thieves and liars. You may get a rush off of stealing something, but it doesn't mean you are addicted to it according to the reading I have done on the subject.

That being said, there are people that have poor impulse control, and the last thing these individuals need is a dominant to try to change that fact... they need to get a grip on their behavior on their own...

On edit,... sex addiction may well exist as far as I know...lol... I just wanted to put a new idea that I had recently discovered out there... I am not a psych specialist of any variety.



I've talked to shrinks about this.

Look it up on the net, it explains a lot of really odd behavior.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: how important is structure? - 7/11/2006 2:11:35 PM   
whtsubf4DOM


Posts: 23
Joined: 1/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

It is a highly contentious thing, calling someone that engages in poor decisions sexually a sex addict. I did some research on sex addiction to help a friend determine whether she was involved with one, and I was shocked to find out that this is not really considered an addiction by many of those who study addiction. It is like someone that is compulsive about any behavior, they are not necessarily addicted to it.. like compulsive thieves and liars. You may get a rush off of stealing something, but it doesn't mean you are addicted to it according to the reading I have done on the subject.

That being said, there are people that have poor impulse control, and the last thing these individuals need is a dominant to try to change that fact... they need to get a grip on their behavior on their own...

On edit,... sex addiction may well exist as far as I know...lol... I just wanted to put a new idea that I had recently discovered out there... I am not a psych specialist of any variety.




Well, the question is....is the sub seeking impulse control? He really wants the necessary and stringent training to be a better lover , among other things (he may not necessarily want to shut the impulse stuff out of his life). Would it even work if he didn't get a grip on that first? Would it be necessary for him to deal with his impulse stuff if he is getting the training he wants and needs? These are all questions that should be and will be asked before signing any contract.

We are planning to meet at some point in the future and have an intense, frank discussion about what all this will mean. Each will bring our own questions to the table and expect nothing upon arrival. I am, by no means, approaching this blind and uneducated. I care too much about him to take him down a path (by his choice too) that will lead nowhere or could be harmful. We both have a very strong desire to experience the D/s lifestyle together, even if only for a short time.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
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