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Robert Heinlein - 9/11/2014 7:14:17 PM   
smileforme50


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Ok....I admit it.....unlike almost everybody I know (especially all my ex-bfs) I have NEVER read anything by Robert Heinlein. Mostly because I'm not a big fan of science fiction. Most of the time when I encounter "sci-fi", to me the stories have a very depressing theme of how humanity is doomed to be wrought with nothing but war, disease, and cruelty. To me, reading about those things is not enjoyable. I know that's not how ALL sci fi is, but in my experience they just seem to be very common themes in the genre, so for the most part I have avoided it.

But I have been hearing about Heinlein for so many years that I have to admit I'm a little more than curious. So I would like to read some of his work. But I don't want to spend money on a book that's terribly disturbing.

So....I'm looking for some suggestions of where to start. Which of Heinlein's works would you recommend to someone who has never read Heinlein and generally doesn't like sci-fi?

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/11/2014 7:37:42 PM   
FelineRanger


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Sex, war, famine, pestilence, and death have been part of the human experience and part of its creative output since before there were people. Try Stranger in a Strange Land. Ultimately, it still says that people are stupid, egotistical apes, but there is a small glimmer of hope.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/11/2014 7:52:28 PM   
FirmhandKY


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It kinda depends.

My favorites are:

1. The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress
2. Starship Trooper
3. Stranger in a Strange Land.
4. Glory Road
5. Farnham's Freehold
6. I Will Fear No Evil.

Heinlein's work can be categorized by when it was written, and for what reason. Very little is negative in the dystopian sense that you mention (I hate most dystopian stuff as well).

His most "readable for fun" novels are his "juvenile novels", written for the young adult market. But they are all excellent reads for any ages. Generally, these are (Wikipedia source):

Rocket Ship Galileo, 1947
Space Cadet, 1948
Red Planet, 1949
Farmer in the Sky, 1950
Between Planets, 1951
The Rolling Stones aka Space Family Stone, 1952
Starman Jones, 1953
The Star Beast, 1954
Tunnel in the Sky, 1955
Time for the Stars, 1956
Citizen of the Galaxy, 1957
Have Space Suit—Will Travel, 1958

Of those, I like Citizen of the Galaxy, Tunnel in the Sky and Have Space Suit - Will Travel the best.

His "Future History" series spans most of his career, and plays heavily in his later works. They often are about (or in the same universe) as Lazarus Long, a (probably) immortal man.

There are a couple of "Lazarus Long" stories that you should read before you read the seminal "Time Enough For Love" that kinda caps the best of Heinlein, in my opinion. These two stories (novellas, really) are Revolt in 2100 and Methuselah's Children.

Most of his later novels refer to or are about some aspect of the Lazarus Long universe, and these three works (Revolt, Methuselah's Children and Love give you enough information to "get" most of the later in-jokes.

If you want to read all of his "Future History" short stories and novellas, refer to Wikipedia

Most of his later works are interesting, and some of them are even readable .... but .... he often gets lost in "World as Myth". A passage from Wikipedia says it pretty well:
quote:


After a seven-year hiatus brought on by poor health, Heinlein produced five new novels in the period from 1980 (The Number of the Beast) to 1987 (To Sail Beyond the Sunset). These books have a thread of common characters and time and place. They most explicitly communicated Heinlein's philosophies and beliefs, and many long, didactic passages of dialog and exposition deal with government, sex, and religion. These novels are controversial among his readers and one critic, Dave Langford, has written about them very negatively.[49] Heinlein's four Hugo awards were all for books written before this period.

Some of these books, such as The Number of the Beast and The Cat Who Walks Through Walls, start out as tightly constructed adventure stories, but transform into philosophical fantasias at the end. It is a matter of opinion whether this demonstrates a lack of attention to craftsmanship or a conscious effort to expand the boundaries of science fiction, either into a kind of magical realism, continuing the process of literary exploration that he had begun with Stranger in a Strange Land, or into a kind of literary metaphor of quantum science (The Number of the Beast dealing with the Observer problem, and The Cat Who Walks Through Walls being a direct reference to the Schrödinger's cat thought experiment).

Most of the novels from this period are recognized by critics as forming an offshoot from the Future History series, and referred to by the term World as Myth.


Good Luck.

Firm

< Message edited by FirmhandKY -- 9/11/2014 7:56:41 PM >


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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/11/2014 9:50:01 PM   
sloguy02246


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FR -

I found "Time Enough For Love" to be one of the two best sci-fi novels I have ever read .

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 4:30:04 AM   
Louve00


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I've read Stranger in a Strange Land and Glory Road. Now, I don't know whether it was because I read most of the Gor series books not long before, or maybe it wasn't, but to me, Glory Road had a lot of similarities and I enjoyed the interactions. (I believe Glory Road is where he makes an ogre or giant swallow himself when they faced off in a duel? lol. But I had fun reading it. To me (and I haven't read all of his books, I think Glory Road is a good place to start. It was the first book I read by him and I enjoyed it very much. It had adventure, some amusement, and a lot of imagination, with a slight "He-man, submissive, yet alpha woman companion that he traveled with. I liked it so much I went after Stranger in a Strange Land and it wasn't my cup of tea either. But we all have different tastes. Firm seems to know more about his writings and his history of writing, and clearly more than I do.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 4:41:40 AM   
Marc2b


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Hey, Firm. It's been a while. I hope all is well in your world.

To address the topic . . . I've never read much Heinlein mostly because I could never figure out if he was a fascist, a new age hippie, a libertarian or what. Of course I was a teenager then, now I realize he was probably just an explorer.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 8:18:03 AM   
dcnovice


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quote:

Hey, Firm. It's been a while. I hope all is well in your world.

I second that.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 10:48:42 AM   
lazarus1983


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Stranger In A Strange Land
Starship Troopers
The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress
The Cat Who Walks Through Walls
Friday

Edited to add Double Star, and Job: A Comedy of Justice. Job never gets mentioned, even by avid Heinlein fans, however I consider it one of his stronger works, and worth it for his hilarious take on what Heaven is like.

< Message edited by lazarus1983 -- 9/12/2014 10:58:44 AM >


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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 10:59:16 AM   
subrosaDom


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lazarus1983

Stranger In A Strange Land
Starship Troopers
The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress
The Cat Who Walks Through Walls
Friday



I found The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress to be one of the more engaging of his books. I thought Stranger In A Strange Land was stunning for the first 1/2 - 2/3 -- and not so much toward the end, dissipating its initial promise.

Plot-wise, I find some similarities between Heinlein and Hesse (I don't mean philosophically, although there's no question that alienation is a theme appearing of both of their works). My personal issue with both of them is their ability to grab my interest initlally, plotwise, but then to have an ending that is strangely (no pun intended) divergent, in the sense that rather than there being a payoff, the sense is that the novel could have ended at almost any time. Demian, which I think is Hesse's best work (I've read Hesse would cite The Glass Bead Game). So at the end of both of their works, I find myself a bit disappointed, not because there isn't a neat wrap-up, but because everything seems to randomly flounder. Having said that, I think Heinlein (and Hesse) are both worth reader and my own criticisms may not be ones that resonate with you.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 1:40:05 PM   
Exidor


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There are two distinct groups of Heinlein's work: his early stuff, including the YA/juveniles, and his later "mature" work, which was Stranger and everything after that. I much prefer his early stuff, including the YA books. His later work got self-important, bloated, and crochety.

I recommend "Podkayne of Mars" or "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel." Yeah, they were written for teens... but I'm still a teen at heart.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 1:45:50 PM   
GreedyTop


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FIRMY!!! LAZ!!!!! *tacklehugs and smooches ya both madly* (Firmy, I'm moving back to ATL next week - you and Herself need to come visit!! *grin*)

And yeah, what they said...

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 6:33:06 PM   
YourBigDaddy1967


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I'll make a suggestion, Stay away from Heinlein. Heinlein was self absorbed, and basically used his books as thinly veiled commentary on everything he liked or didn't like.

I suggest if you want to read a better self absorbed narcissist go with Frank Herbert

I suggest that if you want to read the master works of a tortured soul then Robert E Howard is the man for you!

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/12/2014 9:31:03 PM   
MasterCaneman


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The quickest and easiest way is to get The Past Through Tomorrow. It covers nearly thirty years of his writing. Good read, trust me.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 5:57:05 AM   
lazarus1983


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Hey Greedy. Saw you made your triumphant return a short time ago, I've just mostly been ghosting on here lately.

Funny story about the ever influential Stranger in a Strange Land. According to Grumbles From the Grave, a collection of Heinlein's correspondences throughout the years, him and his wife were contacted by a woman who was very interested in the water family concept Heinlein created. They got a weird vibe from the lady and stopped talking to her. Come to find out later she was a member of the Manson family.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 6:08:19 AM   
ThatDaveGuy69


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"Starship Troopers" is an enjoyable/quick read.
If you liked the movie then you probably won't like the book.
If you like the book then you will probably hate the movie.



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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 7:01:44 AM   
GreedyTop


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I'm odd, I liked both the book AND the movie. As long as I pretended they had nothing to do with one another.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 8:04:16 AM   
smileforme50


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

I'm odd, I liked both the book AND the movie. As long as I pretended they had nothing to do with one another.



Yeah....that's kind of what I've always been told.....that they are so different that you wither like one and not the other or you have to think they don't have anything to do with one another.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 8:15:27 AM   
MasterCaneman


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quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50


quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

I'm odd, I liked both the book AND the movie. As long as I pretended they had nothing to do with one another.



Yeah....that's kind of what I've always been told.....that they are so different that you wither like one and not the other or you have to think they don't have anything to do with one another.

The movie contained just enough references to the book to be able to claim the title, that's about it. I won't say I totally hated it, but it lacked the 'Heinleininess' I was expecting. It was if the writers and directors based it solely on the Cliff's Notes version.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 8:18:24 AM   
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I was asked to leave the cinema when Starship Troopers was showing my peals of laughter was spoiling everyone else's enjoyment.

I honestly thought it was a comedy.

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RE: Robert Heinlein - 9/13/2014 11:10:22 AM   
GreedyTop


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well, if you'd stop laughing like a goose being strangled!!


*ducks and runs*

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