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Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 2:17:23 AM   
YouName


Posts: 271
Joined: 10/22/2014
Status: offline 		Hi there!


I've been browsing this forum for some time and I've seen basically just one general line of ideas which I disagree with the majority of posters here.
I guess that this is primarily because my interest in this World does not stem from the sexual.

Although a switch who likes to explore both personal and socio-economical Power Dynamics and enjoys a fair amount of kink the intrigue into the World
of BDSM comes from a completely different perspective.
Generally I that there is a bit of a disparity in this world that is artificial. The sense of progressing through Life through the teachings of older or more experienced people
seems a bit lost. I've Always been the type of person to ask for help and to give help to others, expecting or giving some for of respect or a sense of Gratitude in return.

It seems to me that if this were to extend to a personal level. Beyond even the relation between a disciple and master then there must be a difference in stature between the two.
One surrenders free will while the other surrenders knowledge and (the gift of) responsibility. Perhaps sometimes it can even be as simple as calm and safety.

Now I understand that most of you might be into this for the same reason why I am a switch. You might be sadistic and not masochistic or the other way around or what ever it may be.
But I'm a bit dismayed at this general line of thought that a relationship like this is and from what I can see should be between two equals.
That doesn't make much sense to me at all.

Why would you submit to your equal* on a mental level? On a short term basis for the kink aspect of it, to experience it, sure...and I am looking for something a bit more serious in this way.
But on a long-term basis? It doesn't make sense to me.

I guess one more part of this is that most people who are into BDSM are indeed normal folks, despite what media writes about about this all the time.
People with 9-5 jobs, maybe even kids, a small business perhaps. So there isn't much room to move even if they wanted to.

* That's not to say that either one is better than the other one. Just that each knows their place.


Anyway, just some thoughts.
Hope I didn't offend someone!

Two examples to put my thoughts into context:
The page of a Knight. There was also an aristocratic version of this more akin to apprentice. Jean d'Arc was furious with him when he didn't wake her up at the eve of some important battle and slapped him. They had quite a history.
An other example is the story of Julie d'Aubigny and her relationship with her master Sérannes to whom she was fully devoted to and hid from the police. Later, when she had learned all she could and things had calmed down a bit she abandoned him.

But in both these cases as in so many others the end goal is equality, or even (if there is a substantial age difference) the surpassing of the master or mistress.
I'm trying to differentiate here between the mental aspects and the kink aspects.


< Message edited by YouName -- 10/27/2014 2:56:15 AM >
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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 3:47:18 AM   
starkem


Posts: 159
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		I am not clear I understand your inquiry. Can you clarify your expectations? Are you saying no matter the role the partners should be equal, or are you saying the opposite. What exactly is your interaction desired, and how does it differ from most traditional dynamics. Do you fear you will be abandoned by some partner?

(in reply to YouName)
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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 4:27:30 AM   
MariaB


Posts: 2969
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: starkem

I am not clear I understand your inquiry. Can you clarify your expectations? Are you saying no matter the role the partners should be equal, or are you saying the opposite. What exactly is your interaction desired, and how does it differ from most traditional dynamics. Do you fear you will be abandoned by some partner?


I'm glad it wasn't only me. I read the ops post twice and I'm still not sure what is being asked.

_____________________________

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 4:58:52 AM   
starkem


Posts: 159
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		Well I hope he didn't fall asleep because now I am curious.

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 5:07:21 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline 		I'm not quite sure either - but I'll give it a bash from my perspective...

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Hi there!

I've been browsing this forum for some time

And you've been a member for how long? All of 4 days, including today!
I wouldn't consider that "some time"

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
and I've seen basically just one general line of ideas which I disagree with the majority of posters here.
I guess that this is primarily because my interest in this World does not stem from the sexual.

As with a lot of members of this site.
Not everyone or everything is sexually based or oriented.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Although a switch who likes to explore both personal and socio-economical Power Dynamics and enjoys a fair amount of kink the intrigue into the World of BDSM comes from a completely different perspective.
Generally I that there is a bit of a disparity in this world that is artificial.

There is always some form of 'artificial' in this world.
BDSM is no different.
I don't see why you think that is surprising.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
The sense of progressing through Life through the teachings of older or more experienced people
seems a bit lost.

Isn't that the way of the world and has been for many a century??
It's not lost at all. Maybe you are, most of us aren't.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I've Always been the type of person to ask for help and to give help to others, expecting or giving some for of respect or a sense of Gratitude in return.

Your expectations are somewhat adrift of reality I'm afraid.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
It seems to me that if this were to extend to a personal level. Beyond even the relation between a disciple and master then there must be a difference in stature between the two.

There always is and probably always will be - in reality.
Are you so obtuse as to not see this for yourself?

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
One surrenders free will while the other surrenders knowledge and (the gift of) responsibility. Perhaps sometimes it can even be as simple as calm and safety.

In a nut-shell, that's how it is for most people in any dynamic.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Now I understand that most of you might be into this for the same reason why I am a switch. You might be sadistic and not masochistic or the other way around or what ever it may be.
But I'm a bit dismayed at this general line of thought that a relationship like this is and from what I can see should be between two equals.

Where on earth do you get that they are between two 'equals'??
You appear to be somewhat naive in that line of thinking.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
That doesn't make much sense to me at all.

Because you are running down the wrong track.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Why would you submit to your equal* on a mental level?

Most people don't.
That is where your thinking has gone awry.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
On a short term basis for the kink aspect of it, to experience it, sure...and I am looking for something a bit more serious in this way.
But on a long-term basis? It doesn't make sense to me.

See above.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I guess one more part of this is that most people who are into BDSM are indeed normal folks, despite what media writes about about this all the time.

You must be reading different media to the rest of us!

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
People with 9-5 jobs, maybe even kids, a small business perhaps. So there isn't much room to move even if they wanted to.

That would depend on the way you implement your own dynamics.
In my house, we do our BDSM (what there is of it) dynamics without fear of others, so it is 24/7.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Hope I didn't offend someone!

No offense taken.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I'm trying to differentiate here between the mental aspects and the kink aspects.

They are inextricably intertwined in most dynamics.


_____________________________

“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
George Orwell, 1903-1950


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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 5:49:36 AM   
YouName


Posts: 271
Joined: 10/22/2014
Status: offline 		Just a bunch of thoughts put to paper.


I know that if I discuss this in any depth it's going to offend people, as discussing say christianity from an atheists Point of view might offend someone who truly Believes in Christ.
So I am a bit cautious to do that.

But if I would sum up my post in one sentence it would be the following!

Where is the logic of ever having any permanent relationship stuck in a locked Master&Sub system?
Clarification: Should it not naturally develop into one of two equals, possibly with different perspectives on kink?


I do figure that both can grow in their role simultaneously but the Sub should grow (mature?) more rapidly if there's any sense to the dynamic in the first place.
As someone said, maybe the kink and the mental~spiritual aspect of it is just much more linked with some people than it is for me.

quote:

You must be reading different media to the rest of us!

What I mean is that at least the media around here tends to tilt it towards being abusive in general. Especially M/D to W/S but since the demystification of the lifestyle through various shows and books and films it's gone down considerably.

quote:

Isn't that the way of the world and has been for many a century??
It's not lost at all. Maybe you are, most of us aren't.


Huh?! Today, mostly it's about personal success and forging your own path. Fuck the rest. More often than not young mold the world today.
In fact I think that's a generally good thing, conservative values have a hard time keeping up with technological development and young brains simply think and adapt faster than old.
I'd say that there's a general disjointing in society between the generations and between people in general. Cultures are being mashed up and bits and pieces of this mash torn off as it suites the individual.
Apprentice jobs are more and more rare, be that of a smithy or a journalist, instead all, regardless of age are educated on equal basis. In fact, in the past in most countries you could credit work experience to your grades to easier enter college.
This is withering away. I could go on a bit but I'll stop here.


I wrote earlier that this is maybe a bit more of a sociological issue than what I had in mind to discuss here but why not. It's interesting to discuss!

< Message edited by YouName -- 10/27/2014 6:22:04 AM >

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:36:26 AM   
shiftyw


Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline 		I think you're overthinking it...
I'm just sexual. In the bedroom I choose to bottom. Its ok I do that, just as feel its ok to do whatever you're talking about.

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:37:02 AM   
FieryOpal


Posts: 2821
Joined: 12/8/2013
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
<kink>
As someone said, maybe the kink and the mental~spiritual aspect of it is just much more linked with some people than it is for me.

You need not be concerned with offending anybody here on the fora, because a good many of us are offensive as it is, no matter who posts what.

Now, to get down to the brass tacks. Although the title of your thread contains the term "BDSM," what you are fundamentally questioning is D/s-Dominance/submission. At the risk of offending a few BDSMers on my part, I have yet to run across a male S/switch who *gets* it. (Quite a number of newbies, and not-so-newbies, too)

Not being a S/switch, you'll have to pardon my phraseology. Many who are primarily into BDSM for kink & fetish fulfillment and gratification - which I'm not saying is a bad thing, or a negative in and of itself - don't understand D/s dynamics.
Many assume that Topping-giving is a Dominant activity, and that bottoming-receiving is a submissive activity. This may be the case the majority of the time, but these are not synonymous activities.
Further, with sado-masochism (which may or may not be involved), it is assumed that Sadists are Dominants and that masochists are submissive. This is not true.
Most often, the Sadist does the Topping (giving) and the masochist bottoms (receives). However, there are masochistic Dominants who receive. Rarer still, there are Sadistic submissives who give during sensation play, but this type of submissive exists and may actually be more of a Sado-masochistic submissive.
Then there are the fetishists, for honorable mention, which I'll not go into or else we'll be here forever.
You see, given these schematics, there is great fluidity. Now, let's throw S/switching into the pot with each individual S/switch's predilection for Topping/bottoming and Sado-masochism. This is BDSM.

The reason why we know that D/s-M/s is not a subset of BDSM, but the other way around, is due to the overreaching quality of D/s which extends into the vanilla world. There are D/s-M/s couples who are not kinky and don't engage in BDSM activities.
Getting back to Dominance and submission. You either get it, or you don't, is what I apprehend for the most part. And D/s can be sexual or totally non-sexual, with no physical contact, no contact by proxy whatsoever.
What goes on in kinky BDSM scenes where play partners are not in a committed D/s-M/s relationship dynamic (the s-type is not collared and does not belong to a Master or Mistress) is a whole lot of play-acting and role-playing.
I'll call it what it is. The Emperor has no clothes. For the sake of this discussion, I place no value judgment on this. In my own personal life, it's different, according to my own preferences.
I won't view strictly BDSM play as inferior or superior in this context, just not authentic Dominance and submission. And within the context of BDSM play, both play partners ARE equal partners.

How can you submit to an equal? In BDSM, these acts of submission are temporary. Within a D/s-M/s relationship dynamic they are not. Both partners here are equal in worth and in value to one another, but not equal in power and authority by virtue of their power exchange.

< Message edited by FieryOpal -- 10/27/2014 6:40:14 AM >

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Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage. - Lao Tzu
There is no remedy for love but to love more. - Thoreau

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:41:26 AM   
starkem


Posts: 159
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		Well I am anti-relationship. I find monogamous romantic relationships to be a crutch for not wanting to end up alone. That may be exaggerated and totally in error, but i am somewhat bias and hopefully in line with one point you've made: ideally, relationship building should develop naturally without prerequisites or regimens. However, how will you know if this is the right person otherwise? I think that is one point you are expressing.

I find people are very guarded and circumspect of these relationships (and rightfully so), yet, so eager to jump into a relationship and wonder why it didn't work. That relationship was not properly nurtured or moved too fast to form the necessary impenetrable bond required to sustain. I'm sure there are a myriad of other reasons for its failure, but this should be at the core of compatibility. Instead, I hear frustrations that this person is not serious about the relationship. Loving self means that you are equally and mutually vested in the relationship.

If you love yourself enough to filter undesirables out the equation, there is better chance of having the ideal relationship that you have required. I think that would help any relationship dynamic -even the one you are seeking or at least trying to express your frustration or discord. All the things we demand of the other partner is not as special as being the qualities you seek in a mate. It's like the karma of the persons you will attract as a disgruntled person.

I may be wrong; this is only a discussion. It seems that although you are asking a more general question about BDSM dynamic at fault, you are specifically going through something that has you frustrated with someone or some types of people in particular.

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:51:43 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline 		I'll pick up on a few things...

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
But if I would sum up my post in one sentence it would be the following!

Where is the logic of ever having any permanent relationship stuck in a locked Master&Sub system?

Because it fits what each in the dynamic wants??
I really don't understand why you are perplexed by such a simple concept.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Clarification: Should it not naturally develop into one of two equals, possibly with different perspectives on kink?

I would posit that most relationships are not equal per se.
That doesn't mean that each is not of importance within the dynamic.
But just like in vanilla, very few partnerships are actually 'equal'.
BDSM is no different and I don't understand why people want to put a completely different aspect to it just because it is "BDSM".

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I do figure that both can grow in their role simultaneously but the Sub should grow (mature?) more rapidly if there's any sense to the dynamic in the first place.

Why more rapidly? That doesn't make sense unless you view them as unequal and should be; ergo, the lesser grows quicker to catch up??
Your fixation on equality doesn't match up to real-world dynamics.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
As someone said, maybe the kink and the mental~spiritual aspect of it is just much more linked with some people than it is for me.

You'll find that most dynamics very much have spiritual link with the physical reality.
That is how people get their kink going and enjoy it.
The head-space is often just as important as the physical aspect of it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
quote:

You must be reading different media to the rest of us!

What I mean is that at least the media around here tends to tilt it towards being abusive in general. Especially M/D to W/S but since the demystification of the lifestyle through various shows and books and films it's gone down considerably.

The media will always make a circus of anything outside of the strict perceived "normality".
Even more so when celebs or public figures are involved.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
quote:

Isn't that the way of the world and has been for many a century??
It's not lost at all. Maybe you are, most of us aren't.


Huh?! Today, mostly it's about personal success and forging your own path. Fuck the rest. More often than not young mold the world today.

And where do people learn their skills and trades??
Usually by being taught by others. Not everything comes from books.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
In fact I think that's a generally good thing, conservative values have a hard time keeping up with technological development and young brains simply think and adapt faster than old.

Are you living in some back-water somewhere??
I don't see that here and it certainly doesn't work that way with me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I'd say that there's a general disjointing in society between the generations and between people in general.

Again, I don't see that happening here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Cultures are being mashed up and bits and pieces of this mash torn off as it suites the individual.

I would say that cultures tend to stay isolated and they cherry-pick bits they want.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
Apprentice jobs are more and more rare, be that of a smithy or a journalist, instead all, regardless of age are educated on equal basis.

Apprenticeships are way of the Dodo because so few old skills are needed these days.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
In fact, in the past in most countries you could credit work experience to your grades to easier enter college.
This is withering away. I could go on a bit but I'll stop here.

This is what is happening here. Work experience often counts for more than exam results.
It is most certainly not withering away.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
I wrote earlier that this is maybe a bit more of a sociological issue than what I had in mind to discuss here but why not. It's interesting to discuss!

I find your naivety and petulance depressing, not interesting.

I think FieryOpal summed it up nicely:-
How can you submit to an equal? In BDSM, these acts of submission are temporary. Within a D/s-M/s relationship dynamic they are not. Both partners here are equal in worth and in value to one another, but not equal in power and authority by virtue of their power exchange.



< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 10/27/2014 6:56:21 AM >

_____________________________

“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
George Orwell, 1903-1950


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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:56:36 AM   
ExiledTyrant


Posts: 4547
Joined: 12/9/2013
From: Exiled
Status: offline

_____________________________

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To lead, first follow: Aurelius, Epictetus, Descartes, Sun Tzu, to name a few.

Semper fidelis (which sometimes feels like a burden)

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 6:59:42 AM   
ExiledTyrant


Posts: 4547
Joined: 12/9/2013
From: Exiled
Status: offline

_____________________________

Gnothi Seauton
To lead, first follow: Aurelius, Epictetus, Descartes, Sun Tzu, to name a few.

Semper fidelis (which sometimes feels like a burden)

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 7:14:05 AM   
shiftyw


Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant



And I thought I was gonna get stuff done today...but now I'm just gonna watch that...

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 7:20:50 AM   
YouName


Posts: 271
Joined: 10/22/2014
Status: offline 		What about duality of man not of people or a pair?


quote:


I find your naivety and petulance depressing, not interesting.


Depressing in what way?
How can it possibly depress you if you do not agree with it?
Boring may be the word you're looking for if you don't find it the least bit interesting.

You'd have to be partly in denial to find it depressing.


quote:


Why more rapidly? That doesn't make sense unless you view them as unequal and should be; ergo, the lesser grows quicker to catch up??
Your fixation on equality doesn't match up to real-world dynamics.

It matches my understanding of economics and in physics the situation is even more lopsided, the strong force is weakened.
At one turn of the page you present the world as still being run by the very system you then deny as alien to the dynamics of the real world.


For Fiery Opal
Hello there!

I'm wondering then what you, no matter your position find appealing in a permanent state of either domination or submission with one (or a select number) of people??
For example, you've had a long life. Haven't there been times when you've met or seen someone you would have liked to submit to sexually or mentally or just simply professionally in one way or an other or if you are a submissive found someone you think you should dominate or lead in a relationship of any sort?

I'll compare this to things in general.
When you take advice from someone you take advice in what you are lacking and give advice where they are lacking.
Even if my idea of "catching up" isn't true, shouldn't there always be someone above and below you on the sexual, personal and professional plane, no matter where you are or who you are?
I guess an other concept worth exploring is the difference between a Sub&Dominant relationship and a Slave&Master one. In the later, perhaps the goal of each person is not to lead or follow but to continuously put in place and in a way degrade and without switching it may simply glue itself firm. This doesn't appeal to me and I find it a bit inhuman but I'm not dissing people who're "into it".


For example...And this may sound weird (I may be the only one?) but if I had a loving, insecure sub into chastity (which I've never had nor am very interested in) I would probably use a reward system in the opposite way that most seem to do.
Instead of working to "lock" him or her up more and more I would reward them with more and more freedom in that sense the more obedient or made better and better life decisions or pleased me in a better way. But most people here (fuck it, ALL people I've talked to or seen on the web) seem to be into the opposite thing.


Basically the path into equality instead of the path away from it as a guiding principle of D&S relations. I guess that's what this topic is about and as I mentioned, in the end such a relationship would be "doomed" to either turn into a well oiled vanilla one with various degrees of kink or play or it would simply end as is natural for things when they reach their climax.
Instead of breaking someone to liberate someone. But perhaps you have to be a switch...or someone not "naturally" either dominant or submissive to be into this type of thing?

< Message edited by YouName -- 10/27/2014 8:08:00 AM >

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 7:54:50 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName

What about duality of man not of people or a pair?


quote:


I find your naivety and petulance depressing, not interesting.


Depressing in what way?
How can it possibly depress you if you do not agree with it?
Boring may be the word you're looking for if you don't find it the least bit interesting.

You'd have to be partly in denial to find it depressing.

The depressing bit comes from trying to instill some knowledge to someone who is soo stuck in their Utopian rut that they can't see the wood for the trees.
No, I am not in any sort of denial.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
quote:


Why more rapidly? That doesn't make sense unless you view them as unequal and should be; ergo, the lesser grows quicker to catch up??
Your fixation on equality doesn't match up to real-world dynamics.

It matches my understanding of economics and in physics the situation is even more lopsided, the strong force is weakened.
At one turn of the page you present the world as still being run by the very system you then deny as alien to the dynamics of the real world.

You must live on a different planet to me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
For Fiery Opal
Hello there!

I'm wondering then what you, no matter your position find appealing in a permanent state of either domination or submission with one (or a select number) of people??
For example, you've had a long life. Haven't there been times when you've met or seen someone you would have liked to submit to sexually or mentally or just simply professionally in one way or an other or if you are a submissive found someone you think you should dominate or lead in a relationship of any sort?

You, as a switch, might find that preposition intriguing.
For most of us that are either Dom/me or sub, that question or thought wouldn't even enter our heads.

Just sayin'

_____________________________

“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
George Orwell, 1903-1950


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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 7:58:10 AM   
YouName


Posts: 271
Joined: 10/22/2014
Status: offline 		I know, I do find it intriguing. Thus the topic =)

I may never become either but maybe I can better understand it! Or maybe we're all just different. Btw check out the addition I just made if you want.

< Message edited by YouName -- 10/27/2014 7:59:03 AM >

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RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 8:15:21 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline 		To pick up on something you added to an earlier post...
quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName
For example...And this may sound weird (I may be the only one?) but if I had a loving, insecure sub into chastity (which I've never had nor am very interested in) I would probably use a reward system in the opposite way that most seem to do.
Instead of working to "lock" him or her up more and more I would reward them with more and more freedom in that sense the more obedient or made better and better life decisions or pleased me in a better way. But most people here (fuck it, ALL people I've talked to or seen on the web) seem to be into the opposite thing.

If the sub you had in chastity actually wanted and enjoyed being in chastity (as most subs into this seem to want), wouldn't your choice of reward actually be counter-intuitive to what the sub wants/needs??
What you deem as a reward would be a punishment to that sub and they would resent it.
In essence, your so-called "reward" would be doing them a great disservice.

This is the point I have made with several of your earlier suppositions and statements.
You seem to have gotten hold of the wrong end of the shitty stick and are (apparently) adamant that your perspective is the correct one and that I am in some sort of denial.
I am more than twice your age and probably lived this lifestyle longer than you have been on this earth.
I am saying that you are inherently wrong in your PoV, even as a switch.
To each their own, yes. But you are waay out on a limb with a lot of your premises and even your questions.
You appear to be porn-contaminated in Utopia, nothing like the real world.


< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 10/27/2014 8:21:09 AM >

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(in reply to YouName)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 8:23:03 AM   
YouName


Posts: 271
Joined: 10/22/2014
Status: offline 		Okay!

You tell me one porn or non-porn movie that deals with the subjects I mention so that I can watch it?

Anyway to begin with there's nothing to convince and if you do not want to converse about the subject then don't do it.

I wrote a bit of a witty remark here just a moment ago asking you not to be disappointed or angry at the fact that I wouldn't agree with you but frankly, there's nothing to agree about and as such you missed the point.


Concerning the sub and their wish to be chastised...Doesn't make evolutionary sense and going by the fact that you by some logic should submit to your better half then perhaps that sub should do as told?
Again I think it's a bit inhuman(e) to drive towards perpetual and ever deepening degradation. But if someone enjoys this that's fine, as long as they are happy. I'm more curious if it wouldn't be possible to find someone for anyone in either position or if not then what drives people into perpetual submission/slavery or even dominance.


< Message edited by YouName -- 10/27/2014 8:31:31 AM >

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 8:40:58 AM   
ExiledTyrant


Posts: 4547
Joined: 12/9/2013
From: Exiled
Status: offline 		I've answered your question, you're too damaged to understand it.

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To lead, first follow: Aurelius, Epictetus, Descartes, Sun Tzu, to name a few.

Semper fidelis (which sometimes feels like a burden)

(in reply to YouName)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Some thoughts on long term relationships within BDSM - 10/27/2014 8:48:36 AM   
littleladybug


Posts: 1082
Joined: 5/30/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName


For example...And this may sound weird (I may be the only one?) but if I had a loving, insecure sub into chastity (which I've never had nor am very interested in) I would probably use a reward system in the opposite way that most seem to do.
Instead of working to "lock" him or her up more and more I would reward them with more and more freedom in that sense the more obedient or made better and better life decisions or pleased me in a better way. But most people here (fuck it, ALL people I've talked to or seen on the web) seem to be into the opposite thing.


Why are they "into the opposite thing"? Could it be that's what the submissive wants as well?

I certainly don't think you're the only one who has ever thought about it this way. There are as many types of D/s relationships as there are people in them. And, that is what has struck me most about your postings here. The "I don't understand how people could be this way" mentality.

I (as anyone else) can only speak about this from my own perspective, and here it is:

For me, power-exchange relationships, on whatever level, are not about "breaking someone down". If and when I submit to someone, it will be because they bring something into my life that I value and do not have on my own. Just as important though, is that they feel the exact same way . (See the lovely pic that ExiledTyrant posted previously...).

I never understood the concept of "equality" when it comes to relationships. I suppose some people keep tally sheets for this sort of thing...but that's never been my bag. I always keep people in my life that I can learn from, and in exchange, I can at times teach. It's not fulfilling to me to be in a relationship (*any* relationship) where all is "equal".

If others don't understand it, that's fine. I have more than enough people around me who do.


quote:

ORIGINAL: YouName


Basically the path into equality instead of the path away from it as a guiding principle of D&S relations. I guess that's what this topic is about.
Instead of breaking someone to liberate someone. But perhaps you have to be a switch...or someone not "naturally" either dominant or submissive to be into this type of thing?


Nope, not at all. I am a submissive and would never be in a relationship where the ultimate goal was anything but building me up to be the best person that I can be. Of course, there are some people out there who would argue that I'm not "submissive" because there are certain things that I insist upon in my relationships, and have no problem calling my partner out on things that I don't like...but that goes back to my initial comment, that there are as many ways of having a D/s relationship as there are people in them.

Back to the issue of "equality"...

If it's "equality" in that the tally sheets are all balanced, that's absolutely not for me. *yawn*

However, if it's "equality" in each partner bringing their own strengths and weaknesses into a relationship and having a mutual respect, *that* I can wholeheartedly agree with.

(in reply to YouName)
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