RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (Full Version)

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[Poll]

The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson


Officer Wilson WILL be charged with a crime
  2% (1)
Officer Wilson will NOT be charged with a crime
  38% (14)
I could not care less
  11% (4)
Who is officer Wilson
  16% (6)
Regardless of the decision Wilson is guilty
  19% (7)
Regardless of the decision Wilson is innocent
  11% (4)


Total Votes : 36
(last vote on : 12/8/2014 3:18:50 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )


Message


Musicmystery -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:21:41 PM)

We need a thread where Bama and Bene can go at it talking to their respective mirrors.




BitYakin -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:31:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
You have admitted that you routinely carry a weapon which is illegal in your country. I wasn't talking about Brits I was talking about you.

Get it right moron!!! [8|]
I carried it ONCE - not routinely.
And I explained why I did that.

Reading isn't always your strong point and lately you've been almost as bad a Sanity.

You have your opinion, I'll have mine.
I think the US have got it wrong on guns.
All the other OECD countries are proving that fact to be true.

Go figure.



I could be wrong, but I thought remembered a post where you said in your neighborhood you wouldn't walk down the street without it and you kept it right next to the door

sooo were you lying THEN or NOW?




Musicmystery -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:34:28 PM)

....and another thread where Ken and Yak can go at it calling each other liars.




BitYakin -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:38:11 PM)

wasn't speaking to ken but OOOOOK

matter of a fact he has me on hide so there have been no conversations between he an I for a LONG time




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:40:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
You have admitted that you routinely carry a weapon which is illegal in your country. I wasn't talking about Brits I was talking about you.

Get it right moron!!! [8|]
I carried it ONCE - not routinely.
And I explained why I did that.

Reading isn't always your strong point and lately you've been almost as bad a Sanity.

You have your opinion, I'll have mine.
I think the US have got it wrong on guns.
All the other OECD countries are proving that fact to be true.

Go figure.



I could be wrong, but I thought remembered a post where you said in your neighborhood you wouldn't walk down the street without it and you kept it right next to the door

sooo were you lying THEN or NOW?

Yes, I keep it by the door.
The bad neighbourhood is about 300 yards down the road from me near our local co-op store where a lot of leery Kosovans hang out.
And I took it out with me just the once.
I didn't after that and I said so at the time.
So... not lying at all.




BamaD -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:42:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: BitYakin

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
You have admitted that you routinely carry a weapon which is illegal in your country. I wasn't talking about Brits I was talking about you.

Get it right moron!!! [8|]
I carried it ONCE - not routinely.
And I explained why I did that.

Reading isn't always your strong point and lately you've been almost as bad a Sanity.

You have your opinion, I'll have mine.
I think the US have got it wrong on guns.
All the other OECD countries are proving that fact to be true.

Go figure.



I could be wrong, but I thought remembered a post where you said in your neighborhood you wouldn't walk down the street without it and you kept it right next to the door

sooo were you lying THEN or NOW?

Yes, I keep it by the door.
The bad neighbourhood is about 300 yards down the road from me near our local co-op store where a lot of leery Kosovans hang out.
And I took it out with me just the once.
I didn't after that and I said so at the time.
So... not lying at all.


You still have it so you are still violating the law.
Get back to us when you are not above the law.




ExiledTyrant -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/2/2014 5:59:21 PM)

There is weird shit out on the net, man. Jus sayin

quote:


Shotgun certificates may be granted by the chief officer of police if he is satisfied that the applicant’s possession of a shotgun will not pose a danger to public safety or the peace. Certificates will not be granted if the chief officer of police

(a) has reason to believe that the applicant is prohibited by this Act from possessing a shot gun; or

(b) is satisfied that the applicant does not have a good reason for possessing, purchasing or acquiring one.[56]

The term “good reason” for possession of shotguns includes reasons connected with the certificate holder’s profession, sport or recreation, or shooting vermin.[57] The requirement for “good reason” to possess a shotgun was introduced after the Hungerford massacre and concerns that weapons were being purchased for self-defense.[58]




cloudboy -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/3/2014 8:08:41 PM)


Criticisms of the Grand Jury proceeding in Ferguson:

Justice Scalia on Grand Juries

A trial lawyers take




Kirata -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 12:21:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Justice Scalia on Grand Juries

Doesn't sound like the prosecutor had assembled anything of substance anyway...

An Associated Press review of thousands of pages of grand jury documents reveals numerous examples of statements made during the shooting investigation that were inconsistent, fabricated or provably wrong...

Bob McCulloch, the St. Louis County prosecutor, said the grand jury had to weigh testimony that conflicted with physical evidence and conflicting statements by witnesses as it decided whether Wilson should face charges.

"Many witnesses to the shooting of Michael Brown made statements inconsistent with other statements they made and also conflicting with the physical evidence. Some were completely refuted by the physical evidence," McCulloch said.
~Full Article

K.





cloudboy -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 7:35:35 AM)


Yes, but apparently that's not how it's supposed to done.




kdsub -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 9:42:58 AM)

quote:

Yes, but apparently that's not how it's supposed to done


I can tell you how it went...Or at least how I think it went... First the prosecutor in a normal situation would not bring this incident to a grand jury because obviously there would and should NOT be an indictment or charges brought. Let me say one more time… I do not believe this boy should have been shot… but under the circumstances and law the prosecutor knew there would not be any charges… I’m all for changing the law that allows deadly force in this type of situation.

Soooo what can he do to defuse a volatile situation and try to appease those who believe he will not be fair. He decides to just present all the testimony of all parties along with all the physical evidence along with all the possible charges and let the Grand Jury decide if there should be an indictment. Unusual yes... was it fair and unbiased... yes... did it appease the protesters or anyone that made up their minds before the no bill... no.

Was it good strategy...no.. He is an honorable man that made the wrong decision. He said he was elected by the people and he was going to do his job as mandated. If the governor wanted him to remove himself he would do it but if not he would do what he was elected to do...By the way he was just re-elected last month...if the majority of the people did not believe he was doing his job correctly he should have been voted out.

If I was in his position I would have stepped aside for a special prosecutor but I do understand why he did not. His pride and stubbornness just made the situation worse. Despite what his distractors think and how unusual the proceedings justice was done.

Butch




BitYakin -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 10:14:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Yes, but apparently that's not how it's supposed to done.


not how its supposed to be done? you mean because it was supposed to be a STACKED DECK against Wilson?

that how it SUPPOSED to be done?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/nov/25/legal-scholars-praise-ferguson-grand-jury-fairness/#sthash.5VrXgMtY.dpuf

Legal scholars praise Ferguson grand jury for fairness beyond the norm


Legal experts across the country agree that while the process that led to a grand jury’s decision not to indict Officer Darren Wilson for killing Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, was unusual, it was not unfair. Rather if it was anything unusual, it was in its fairness and openness.

Lawyers and academics told The Washington Times that, despite their personal opinions on the case, which has sparked riots over police brutality, St. Louis county prosecutor Robert McCulloch sought unbiased justice in presenting the jury with every piece of evidence and then making that evidence public.

“It was the most thorough grand jury investigation that I’ve ever heard of,” said Stephen Saltzburg, a professor of law at George Washington University Law School.

But Richard Kelsey, assistant dean for management and planning at George Mason University law school, said that what makes this case more unusual is that Mr. McCulloch sought justice rather than an indictment.

“Usually you don’t hear what evidence they considered,” Mr. Saltzburg said. “I give the prosecutor top marks in terms of transparency and accountability.”

“Even if you could have gotten an indictment, what good does it do to get an indictment and then have your case thrown out,” said Gabriel Chin, a professor at the University of California Davis School of Law.

Lawyers say in general, grand jury cases are subject to pro-prosecution bias because a district attorney will try to summarize their case to obtain an indictment, possibly hiding some of the evidence. Meanwhile, the accused has no right to an attorney, to present evidence on his behalf, or even to know that his indictment is being considered.

“What you hope is that it’s a neutral process, but it’s not when you don’t have anybody in there for the other side,” said Lee Cox, a Texas-based criminal defense attorney and a former prosecutor.

“The grand jury system is a one-sided Kangaroo Court, which virutally always indicts since jurors hear the prosecutor’s version of events and rule without having ever heard from the defense,” Mr. Fronstin said.



I thought it was about JUSTICE, and THAT was how it was SUPPPOSED to be done?!?!




cloudboy -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 10:15:03 AM)


The rules favor the police. This seems especially true for in-the-line-of-duty judgment calls.

Evidence before a grand jury is supposed to be biased in favor of an indictment. No prosecutor is trying to introduce exculpatory evidence at this time. The saying is that a prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich if he wants to.




BamaD -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 10:18:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


The rules favor the police. This seems especially true for in-the-line-of-duty judgment calls.

Evidence before a grand jury is supposed to be biased in favor of an indictment. No prosecutor is trying to introduce exculpatory evidence at this time. The saying is that a prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich if he wants to.

So the prosecutor should have ignored the fact that there was no case and stacked it so that Wilson was indicted?




kdsub -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 10:23:44 AM)

But cloudboy he knew there was no law that he could bring charges on... so he did the next best thing... he figured a way to make ALL the evidence available to the public... very unusual but an attempt to be as transparent as possible.

Butch




BitYakin -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 10:31:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


The rules favor the police. This seems especially true for in-the-line-of-duty judgment calls.

Evidence before a grand jury is supposed to be biased in favor of an indictment. No prosecutor is trying to introduce exculpatory evidence at this time. The saying is that a prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich if he wants to.



translation, screw justice, screw being fair, we wanted to hang Wilson and now we're PISSED cause it was actually FAIR




DomKen -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 3:28:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

But cloudboy he knew there was no law that he could bring charges on... so he did the next best thing... he figured a way to make ALL the evidence available to the public... very unusual but an attempt to be as transparent as possible.

Butch

Laws he could have brought charges on:
2nd degree murder (and a bunch of lesser included charges)
use of excessive force by a LEO
failure to file a police report

But he chose not to instruct the grand jury about any of those potential charges or any charges at all so how where they supposed to vote out an indictment even if they wanted to?




BamaD -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 3:38:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

But cloudboy he knew there was no law that he could bring charges on... so he did the next best thing... he figured a way to make ALL the evidence available to the public... very unusual but an attempt to be as transparent as possible.

Butch

Laws he could have brought charges on:
2nd degree murder (and a bunch of lesser included charges)
use of excessive force by a LEO
failure to file a police report

But he chose not to instruct the grand jury about any of those potential charges or any charges at all so how where they supposed to vote out an indictment even if they wanted to?

except for the trivial matter that the evidence didn't support any of these




DomKen -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 4:55:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

But cloudboy he knew there was no law that he could bring charges on... so he did the next best thing... he figured a way to make ALL the evidence available to the public... very unusual but an attempt to be as transparent as possible.

Butch

Laws he could have brought charges on:
2nd degree murder (and a bunch of lesser included charges)
use of excessive force by a LEO
failure to file a police report

But he chose not to instruct the grand jury about any of those potential charges or any charges at all so how where they supposed to vote out an indictment even if they wanted to?

except for the trivial matter that the evidence didn't support any of these

There was more than probable cause for all of them. If you don't understand what probable cause means perhaps you should shut the fuck up.




BitYakin -> RE: The Grand Jury has decided in Ferguson (12/4/2014 4:59:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

But cloudboy he knew there was no law that he could bring charges on... so he did the next best thing... he figured a way to make ALL the evidence available to the public... very unusual but an attempt to be as transparent as possible.

Butch

Laws he could have brought charges on:
2nd degree murder (and a bunch of lesser included charges)
use of excessive force by a LEO
failure to file a police report

But he chose not to instruct the grand jury about any of those potential charges or any charges at all so how where they supposed to vote out an indictment even if they wanted to?

except for the trivial matter that the evidence didn't support any of these

There was more than probable cause for all of them. If you don't understand what probable cause means perhaps you should shut the fuck up.


WOW what a surprise DK didn't agree with someone so they should SHUT THE FUCK UP!

HAHAHAH

just so we all know...


Probable Cause
Apparent facts discovered through logical inquiry that would lead a reasonably intelligent and prudent person to believe that an accused person has committed a crime, thereby warranting his or her prosecution


so according to DK the jurors were NOT reasonably intelligent!




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