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Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 9:20:44 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline 		I have been going to a game site, and to play any particular game you have to watch a advertisement first. The powers that be must think all these gamers are women, and so the ads have been for:

(1) Whiteners -- how to whiten your teeth

(2) Hair color -- how to color your hair

(3) Oil of Olay -- how to make your skin young again

(4) Cover Girl -- mascara for the eyes

(5) Diapers -- one's that won't leak

(6) Swiffers -- best duster out there

Part of me finds this funny, but another part of me (about to have a daughter) doesn't like the obsession with looks only tempered by other thoughts of keeping house and diapering a baby.

Have to say that I hope my daughter has other concerns. Yes, too, I hope men have other interests beyond beer, fucking, and sports.

Anyway, do any of you feel that American consumer culture warps the female mind -- or is it the female mind driving our consumer culture? Is the problem simply that we live in a consumer culture?

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 2/6/2015 10:15:52 AM >
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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 9:24:44 AM   
cloudboy


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Small aside. We were watching TOGETHERNESS, a new show on HBO, and the lead female role is, how should I say, non traditional. Anyway, in one scene where she is changing and getting dressed (somewhat naked) my wife said, "finally a woman with a normal body type."

This little aside is connected to the OP.

BDSM ASIDE: Episode 2 had a rather interesting BDSM angle for anyone interested.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 9:26:02 AM   
GoddessManko


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From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline 		Really? I usually see a big tittied Kate Upton lookalike snarling at me while riding a horse and sword unsheathed. Or an innocent faced Barbarella in iron holding a bow...or a thong wearing warrior Princess. None of them have had an actual guy as the preface to the game, LOL. Unless we're talking Heroes of Newerth or League of Legends. But those are for us more sophisticated gamers, hehe.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 9:29:19 AM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
...Is the problem simply that we live in a consumer culture?

Been like that since the age of TV and adverts.
Was around before then but became what it is today when TV's evolved into a normal household item rather than a luxury.


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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 9:51:35 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


I have been going to a game site, and to play any particular game you have to watch a advertisement first. The powers that be must think all these gamers are women, and so the adds have been for:

(1) Whiteners -- how to whiten your teeth

(2) Hair color -- how to color your hair

(3) Oil of Olay -- how to make your skin young again

(4) Cover Girl -- mascara for the eyes

(5) Diapers -- one's that won't leak

(6) Swiffers -- best duster out there

Part of me finds this funny, but another part of me (about to have a daughter) doesn't like the obsession with looks only tempered by other thoughts of keeping house and diapering a baby.

Have to say that I hope my daughter has other concerns. Yes, too, I hope men have other interests beyond beer, fucking, and sports.

Anyway, do any of you feel that American consumer culture warps the female mind -- or is it the female mind driving our consumer culture? Is the problem simply that we live in a consumer culture?

Maybe she'll grow up to have more meaningful interests than Internet games.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 10:04:04 AM   
GoddessManko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Maybe she'll grow up to have more meaningful interests than Internet games.


Blasphemy! Invest in oil. I don't diversify.

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Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 10:10:45 AM   
cloudboy


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Status: offline 		Research suggests that giving young school age children laptops retards their reading development. The game in question for me is backgammon -- but it has been a bit jarring seeing all the female driven ads. I don't think there is any set of equivalent male ads focusing on our look, body type, and ways to look pretty. Arguably men drive objectification of women, culture drives it, as do other women, and maybe certain things embedded in women themselves contribute to it. The end result is a lot of out grouping.

I am now working with couple on the verge of divorce, and the woman hates her body and has low self esteem. As a person, she looks perfectly fine to me.

The upside of S&M is that the mind, creativity, and alternative -- built between two people attractions can drive a relationship. Actions, ideas, fetishes, and personal sharing replace objectification (although even objectification has it place, but not necessarily in line with prevailing cultural norms.)

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 2/6/2015 10:16:40 AM >

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 10:32:22 AM   
littleladybug


Posts: 1082
Joined: 5/30/2013
Status: offline 		I have many interests. Somewhere in the pack is keeping myself well-groomed and keeping my house clean.

Has the "consumer culture" warped my mind? Nah. When I started turning grey in my late-20's, I didn't need a commercial to tell me that I didn't want to look older than I actually was. I have two dogs, a cat, and an occasional SO in my house. I can't tell you how many times I've suggested the Magic Eraser to people, as well as the Swiffer dusters. Am I warped by the "consumer culture"? Nope. I tell them because that shit works.

I find your mention of Swiffers very interesting, as an "ad geared toward women". In my prior relationship, it was my male partner who bought most of the cleaning products. He was the one who would actually move the couch in order to vacuum under and behind it. And, it was my partner that first suggested Swiffers to me. In my current relationship, I am the one who cooks and (generally cleans), and I'm also the one who watches sports.

As much crap as I give my parents (and mostly rightfully deserved), one of the most important things that they instilled in me is not to let others define what makes me happy. I chuckle when I see some of the "teeth whitening" commercials. Of course you can't enter into a successful relationship unless your teeth are perfectly white. I mean, everyone knows that! Seriously though, what is wrong with someone wanting to do something like this to make themselves happy? I recently went into the salon for a haircut and a multiple process coloring. Why did I sit there for close to 3 hours? Because *I* wanted it. Because I enjoy that feeling when I walk out of the salon. Because, although it doesn't define my life, it enhances it.

At the end of the day, I believe it's about being a well-rounded individual, and doing what makes you happy and most fulfilled. Surely, I have "other concerns" in life, but this reminds me to call up and make a pedicure appointment.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 10:39:41 AM   
littleladybug


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The upside of S&M is that the mind, creativity, and alternative -- built between two people attractions can drive a relationship. Actions, ideas, fetishes, and personal sharing replace objectification (although even objectification has it place, but not necessarily in line with prevailing cultural norms.)


I don't see this as being a solely "S&M thing" at all.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 3:22:12 PM   
LiveSpark


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I have been going to a game site, and to play any particular game you have to watch a advertisement first. The powers that be must think all these gamers are women, and so the ads have been for:

(1) Whiteners -- how to whiten your teeth

(2) Hair color -- how to color your hair

(3) Oil of Olay -- how to make your skin young again

(4) Cover Girl -- mascara for the eyes

(5) Diapers -- one's that won't leak

(6) Swiffers -- best duster out there

Part of me finds this funny, but another part of me (about to have a daughter) doesn't like the obsession with looks only tempered by other thoughts of keeping house and diapering a baby.

Have to say that I hope my daughter has other concerns. Yes, too, I hope men have other interests beyond beer, fucking, and sports.

Anyway, do any of you feel that American consumer culture warps the female mind -- or is it the female mind driving our consumer culture? Is the problem simply that we live in a consumer culture?


So I guess men don't 1) change diapers 2) clean 3) whiten their teeth?

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 3:40:33 PM   
usememistress775


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LiveSpark

So I guess men don't 1) change diapers 2) clean 3) whiten their teeth?


The thing is that the advertisements are aimed at women by using only female models/actresses in their ads. That is the OP's post: advertisers targeting women by using women in the ads. Its actually a part of the argument I used against Nicks last sock in a thread that no longer exists.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 3:50:18 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I have been going to a game site, and to play any particular game you have to watch a advertisement first. The powers that be must think all these gamers are women, and so the ads have been for:

(1) Whiteners -- how to whiten your teeth

(2) Hair color -- how to color your hair

(3) Oil of Olay -- how to make your skin young again

(4) Cover Girl -- mascara for the eyes

(5) Diapers -- one's that won't leak

(6) Swiffers -- best duster out there

Part of me finds this funny, but another part of me (about to have a daughter) doesn't like the obsession with looks only tempered by other thoughts of keeping house and diapering a baby.

Have to say that I hope my daughter has other concerns. Yes, too, I hope men have other interests beyond beer, fucking, and sports.

Anyway, do any of you feel that American consumer culture warps the female mind -- or is it the female mind driving our consumer culture? Is the problem simply that we live in a consumer culture?


Women buy most of the shit.

(Any questions?)

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 3:52:31 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessManko

Really? I usually see a big tittied Kate Upton lookalike snarling at me while riding a horse and sword unsheathed. Or an innocent faced Barbarella in iron holding a bow...or a thong wearing warrior Princess. None of them have had an actual guy as the preface to the game, LOL. Unless we're talking Heroes of Newerth or League of Legends. But those are for us more sophisticated gamers, hehe.


Yeah but....that actually makes sense.

(And even if it doesn't....I think big titty women are a viable force for current marketing....we want wimmens to be proud of their big titties....I know I do).

I say....."SHOW THE WORLD YOUR BIG TITTIES!!!!!"

(That's my thinking anyways).

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 2/6/2015 3:53:53 PM >

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 5:15:15 PM   
cloudboy


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Joined: 12/14/2005
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Part of what's at work here is that I am uninitiated into the messages sent to women. Part of that comes from being a guy, and part of it comes from not feeling a vested interest in the impact and effect of those messages.

Now that I'm about to have a girl -- I am finding myself quite concerned.

Naturally, the thing I'm not realizing, is that girls and women adjust and develop their way of processing the shit aimed at them. But, to me, women have much more to adjust to than men. Men don't have the same pressures to conform to certain body types and we don't envy or feel "less" by looking at male model types. We might even dismiss those types in negative terms.

Anyway, I am beginning to see the world differently.

(in reply to littleladybug)
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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 5:39:54 PM   
littleladybug


Posts: 1082
Joined: 5/30/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Men don't have the same pressures to conform to certain body types and we don't envy or feel "less" by looking at male model types. We might even dismiss those types in negative terms.



Honestly, while I understand where you are coming from, I think you're putting way too much thought into this as a "man vs woman" thing. I have known quite a few men who "felt envy" at certain times at male models or actors.

The pressure is out there, without a doubt, but I honestly think that with an even-keeled education, any young person can turn out just fine. Yes, female stereotypes can be harmful to young girls. Just as male ones can be to boys. IMO, the important thing to know is that these models, whether they are male or female, represent what is simply an unattainable standard for most people. But, by the same token, is there fundamentally anything *wrong* with buying make-up or coloring your hair? Or buying cologne or aftershave? Or whatever is sold through these sorts of ads? I would say "no", so long as it isn't done to try to attain a certain standard, or to fit a stereotype.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 5:58:20 PM   
cloudboy


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quote:

Honestly, while I understand where you are coming from, I think you're putting way too much thought into this as a "man vs woman" thing.


Anorexia nervosa is diagnosed approximately nine times more often in females than in males. I get a sense that some respondents are desensitized to what is going on, but I see a huge difference and risk factor (M v. F) here with Anorexia being the most extreme end of the spectrum.

I'm somewhat surprised no one sees problems / issues here -- in my case one sister in law was anorexiic and one a daughter of a friend was the same. The causes of this are of course hotly debated -- but the 9-1 ratio is a FACT.

In addition to the people named above, I have one female client on the verge of divorce for complicated self-image issues. I don't know a single male anywhere in my life or timeline with such issues.

To pile on a bit further, many of my male clients have trouble maintaining a joint bank account with their wives b/c they cannot control their spending. That might be tangential and not germane to a generalization about women -- but it might reflect a need to spend that is strong impulse to control -- a need for consumer products and other stuff.

Clearly I know there are exceptions, women without such problems, etc. But **I** see an issue. Soon, I'll be getting more first hand experience with it over the coming years.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 2/6/2015 6:08:30 PM >

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 6:06:50 PM   
littleladybug


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Anorexia nervosa is diagnosed approximately nine times more often in females than in males. I get a sense that some respondents are desensitized to what is going on, but I see a huge difference and risk factor here with Anorexia being the most extreme end of the spectrum.



And, you can rail against it, or actually *do* something about it.

How do you do that? By actually teaching your daughter that yes, physically beautiful people sell stuff. Always have, always will. And trust that she will understand that it's not expected that she look like these people.

Which is not to discount anorexia, or any other illnesses that people suffer from. But I truly don't believe that the sky is falling because there are advertisements that are geared to one gender or the other, with beautiful people selling them.

Your original question asked whether the consumer culture "warps the female mind". From my experience, it doesn't have to.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 7:41:07 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		To me cloudboy people have it backwards...It is not skinny women with big boobs we see on TV and movies that has changed the minds of men and women on what is sexy and what is not..It is however media recognizing what men and women think is sexy that drives the perception of beauty that is then presented on TV and movies. And along with this perception comes all the devices, creams, and makeup to try and achieve that look. This goes for men and their 6 packs and women appreciated butts as well.

We cannot and should not blame this ridiculous expectation of perfection in the human body on the media... They are only reflecting our preferences...So it is our on damn fault.

Butch

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 8:13:31 PM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Part of what's at work here is that I am uninitiated into the messages sent to women. Part of that comes from being a guy, and part of it comes from not feeling a vested interest in the impact and effect of those messages.

Now that I'm about to have a girl -- I am finding myself quite concerned.

Naturally, the thing I'm not realizing, is that girls and women adjust and develop their way of processing the shit aimed at them. But, to me, women have much more to adjust to than men. Men don't have the same pressures to conform to certain body types and we don't envy or feel "less" by looking at male model types. We might even dismiss those types in negative terms.

Anyway, I am beginning to see the world differently.



That's a good thing. Once your daughter is born she will have ads aimed at convincing her that unless she buys into all that shit she won't be beautiful. She will see all kinds of beauty pageants and models that will drive home that point. It will be up to you and her mom to teach her to see herself in a better light and not fall into it. The fact that you started this thread tells me you are already thinking about these things and that's half the battle.

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RE: Advertising Women - 2/6/2015 10:35:05 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

I hope men have other interests beyond beer, fucking, and sports.

Yes cloudboy, they do. So don't be down on yourself. Some day you will too.

K.






< Message edited by Kirata -- 2/6/2015 10:41:52 PM >

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