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ORIGINAL: Awareness

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ORIGINAL: dreamlady
There is nothing sexier than having a man with a powerfully masculine presence turn out to be sexually submissive to the ONE woman he desires to be utterly devoted to. It's sexy and intoxicating.

Wrong. What's sexier than that is a man who owns himself utterly and is immune to every attempt at manipulation you employ.

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Experience has taught me that even women who are ostensibly feminist ball-busters are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant masculinity. Christ, I got supposed Dommes emailing me and asking permission to speak. There appear to be a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" whose dominance is more about exploiting the desperation of submissive men, than it is about doing what really yanks their crank.

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I put FinDommes into that category. We don't have "RopeDommes" or "FloggerDommes" or "MedicalDommes", yet every woman who falls into this category announces herself as a FinDomme.

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The answer, is advertising. FinDommes are fundamentally engaged in exploitative commerce. They're every bit as commercial as a ProDomme, they just deliver little to no value in return for sucking someone dry of filthy lucre.

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If a woman was genuine, if this was simply an aspect of her fetish, she wouldn't feel the need to announce it up front. It'd simply be an aspect of her engagement with men. (And it's always men - women don't need to give away their money... ever wonder why that is?)

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To call oneself a FinDomme is to cast a lure into the world of pathetic, weak-minded men. There's nothing even remotely genuine about it.

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And don't get me started on why regulating such things is important. Because a free market always produces losers. It's why we have to beat corporations into submission with regulation - because otherwise they do what's good for them, even if it means killing their customers. Regulation is necessary to change the game so that optimal strategies for corporations result in the best outcomes for consumers.

Similarly, failure to regulate gets you the kind of shitty community you have in Fetlife - a site dominated by "fetish models" (read wannabe porn actresses) and women attempting various strategies to exploit the losers who show up (the number of Amazon wish lists is fucking phenomenal).

The result is a community polluted by commerce, where opportunities for real, genuine, engagement are lost amidst a sea of prostitution.

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The community self-regulates in response to women exploited by men, why doesn't it self-regulate in response to men who are exploited by women?

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When I was banned from CollarMe, I didn't worry overmuch because it was clear to me, this place was a FinDommes paradise. Dominant men weren't welcome unless they were warm and fluffy and tolerated the dreck which passed for argument in this place. I just presumed CollarMe was talking a cut from all the Findomme activity exploiting the male subs and people like me who upset the FinDomme applecart just got in the way of that action.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

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ORIGINAL: dreamlady
Wrong, for you. You're a straight male.

Yeah and this is the thing. As a straight male, I've come to understand heterosexual women pretty damn well.

Lesson #1: Ignore what women say.

Pretty much all women have a huge variation between their actual selves and the self-image they possess inside their head. When they're discussing any given issue, they'll answer in accordance with the self-image they've built and which they wish to project to the rest of the world.

The degree of variance between a woman's actual self and her self-image is highly dependent upon her degree of self-awareness and her willingness to be honest with herself. Consequently, it's unwise to give much credence to what a woman says unless her behaviour matches the image she's projecting.

The majority of women lack that self-awareness. They won't admit to being manipulative, they won't admit that they test men, they won't admit that their behaviour is out of line when they're pre-menstrual. Most of all, they have a real hard time admitting when they're wrong. But I digress...

I don't give a flying fuck what a woman tells me about what she's attracted to. It's utterly irrelevant. I watch her actions. And those actions tell me what her words don't.

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See above. Women are not only often not honest about such things, but they're often unaware of their own buttons and how they can be pushed.

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Women have a monopoly on using their sexual power to manipulate men who have few options when it comes to getting laid.

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Women experiment with that power as they discover it and use it on men incessantly. FinDommes rely on that power, because without it, they would not exist. Without the sexual tease, a heterosexual FinSub could go get his "itch" scratched by anyone of any sex.

Trying to disconnect the sexual tease from the manipulative exploits of FinDommes is just plain dishonest. That's an intrinsic component of the whole experience.

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Feminine wiles are not strictly utilized for the purposes of (self-serving) manipulation.

No, but they're mostly used for that. I know women. I know they manipulate men and I know they talk to each other about it. I also know the men they can't manipulate tend to be wildly attractive to them.

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That's exactly how I feel about dominant masculinity. It's incredibly effective - which is why I view male subs as idiots who are cutting off their nose to spite their face. Why on earth would you turn yourself into a supplicant with an incredibly low chance of success when you have the raw material to have so many more options?

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What I find dull are women who expect men to present themselves and hope to be chosen. I honestly don't understand how any woman could take satisfaction in being a "Domme". There's no challenge whatsoever. These pitiful specimens of manhood show up, supplicate and hope for the best. No Domme has to work for anything at all. It's meaningless.

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ORIGINAL: MariaB

Its a condition called 'Dominatrix Toxaemia'. I guess the male version of that is Dominant Toxaemia!

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ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant

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ORIGINAL: MariaB

Its a condition called 'Dominatrix Toxaemia'. I guess the male version of that is Dominant Toxaemia!

Both of which can only survive in a methane enriched environment... which poses the questions... do they stick a monitor up their asses so they can see the internet or have they developed special rooms filled with methane gas?

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ORIGINAL: crazyml

[NM - phone stress. might reply later]

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ORIGINAL: MariaB
I too have supposed dominant men emailing me or whispering their submissive needs to me at some party.

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I have at least one email a week from a needy submissive male who only has a dominant profile on here. Once these men feel ultimately comfortable with a dominant woman and have assured themselves that she would never switch, they reveal themselves within that save haven.

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At one point and this was some years ago, I strongly suspected that no man was really dominant and all this dominant bollox they tried to portray to the bigger world was merely a disguise to hide their own submission. Of course it would be ridiculous for me to assume that no man is really dominant, just as its ridiculous for you to assume the same about women. Whilst I understand your suspicion, that suspicion works both ways.

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I know a lot of dominant women who specialize in specific areas, including myself.

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I think you're taking this far too seriously!. There are many successful Domme/sub relationships, you only have to get out and about to see them.

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I think very few dominant women gain satisfaction from submissive males who offer themselves up on a plate;

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ORIGINAL: NookieNotes
You are using your narrow views to color what you believe other people experience.

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Experience has taught me that even men who are ostensibly dominant and in-charge are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant femininity.

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I put FinDommes into that category. We don't have "RopeDommes" or "FloggerDommes" or "MedicalDommes", yet every woman who falls into this category announces herself as a FinDomme.

Again, YOUR experience does not match what others experience.

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And I know many others who deal with the financial aspects of sub's lives who do not call themselves FinDommes.

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Bullshit.

People do what has value to them. Once it stops having value (even if that value is the clarion call of victimhood), they stop.

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I'm beginning to wonder if you have led an incredibly sheltered life.

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You couldn't be more wrong. Women give away money SOOOOO much. LOL! It's mind boggling you don't know this. They just do it under different guises. Same thing, though, buying something they are afraid (or know) they can't get without the payment.

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To call oneself a FinDomme is to cast a lure into the world of pathetic, weak-minded men. There's nothing even remotely genuine about it.

You have gone off logic.

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My experience of FetLife is completely different. I use it as a kinky Facebook, keeping in touch with people I have met, both online and off, around the country and around the world. I use it to know what's coming up in local events. I use it to read and post writings. To perve photos.

Then, I don't have the experience of trying to find a particular type of someone there. Perhaps if I were trying to use a social site as a dating site, I would have the kinds of experiences you are describing.

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Well, here you have a point. I think it's silly to regulate in any case. Yer effing adults, act like it.

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Usually I appreciate your arguments. This one is far from art.

This shows bitterness. Sad.

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The word here that makes your entire argument bullshit is "majority."

You may have come to know the "general" heterosexual woman fairly well. You have not come to know me well, if you believe you can tell me my personal experiences and preferences better than I can.

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Men are not only often not honest about such things, but they're often unaware of their own buttons and how they can be pushed.

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Women have a monopoly on using their sexual power to manipulate men who have few options when it comes to getting laid.

Bullshit. What rock do you live under?

I think we have found a serious black hole in your normally well-reasoned (even when wrong) posts. Remember saying something about bitterness showing through? Dude. Yeah.

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Fuck, I'm not a FinDomme, and I use the sexual tease all the freaking time! It's FUN! Hell, my boy loves it. It's part of what makes us so super hot. Every moment is a tease.

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Saying that someone is using a sexual tease like it's a bad thing, to me, makes you sound prudish and sad.

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And yet... you speak as if manipulation is always bad. It's not.

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It's not about "turn." They are who they are. Not all men will be dominant, no matter how hard they work at it. Not all women will be, either.

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FOR YOU. You don't need to understand something for it to exist and function without you.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness
Well that's funny because every 'Domme' on this board is constantly whining about being besieged by male subs. To hear them talk they're vastly outnumbered by the male subs begging for their attention which means there's a shit-ton of unsatisfied male subs out there. I doubt CollarMe is a unique space which misrepresents the numbers, so I'd say it's faily safe to extrapolate from that.

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And frankly, the typical FemDomme "it's all about me" attitude is only going to develop in the absence of scarcity.

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That's weird because the way they talk says the exact opposite. I have not seen a single FemDomme anywhere ever talk about having to work to gain a male sub's time or attention. Ever. Now why do you think that is?

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ORIGINAL: NookieNotes
You are using your narrow views to color what you believe other people experience.

When someone defines something as 'nothing sexier' then proceeds to reel off a qualifier which only appears to a very small number of women in the world, then it's pretty easy for me to trump that with something which appeals to a very large number of women in the world, including many members of that small minority.

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Experience has taught me that even men who are ostensibly dominant and in-charge are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant femininity.

Yes, men respond to it by finding it amusing, if not grotesque. Dominance is an implicitly masculine characteristic. Consequently it seems logical to deduce that woman playing at dominance is only going to appeal to feminine men.

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Again, YOUR experience does not match what others experience.

No, I'm making a point and you're missing it. See my reply to MariaB.

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And I know many others who deal with the financial aspects of sub's lives who do not call themselves FinDommes.

That's because there's a world of difference between taking responsibility for someone's welfare on one hand, and bleeding a mark dry on the other.

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Bullshit.

People do what has value to them. Once it stops having value (even if that value is the clarion call of victimhood), they stop.

So you're saying people never invest time or money in something which is never going to give them a return.

I presume then, you think it's perfectly okay for corrupt investment advisors to prey on old people and suck them dry of funds. After all, people just do what has value to them, right?

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I'm beginning to wonder if you have led an incredibly sheltered life.

That's nice dear. What else do you wonder about me? Do I occupy your thoughts often? Are you beginning to obsess?

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You couldn't be more wrong. Women give away money SOOOOO much. LOL! It's mind boggling you don't know this. They just do it under different guises. Same thing, though, buying something they are afraid (or know) they can't get without the payment.

Yeah, women do so badly in the courts not to mention the courtship itself and then combined with all of those other social occasions where there's social expectations of women showering men with stuff.....

Oh, wait. There's none of that. That shit doesn't happen at all. So what on earth are you talking about?

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My experience of FetLife is completely different. I use it as a kinky Facebook, keeping in touch with people I have met, both online and off, around the country and around the world. I use it to know what's coming up in local events. I use it to read and post writings. To perve photos.

Then, I don't have the experience of trying to find a particular type of someone there. Perhaps if I were trying to use a social site as a dating site, I would have the kinds of experiences you are describing.

I'm making a pretty basic observation about the place which should be obvious to anyone who's paying attention. Ostensibly Fetlife is a community site for people to connect as part of a community, but it's become a target for every grifter out there.

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Well, here you have a point. I think it's silly to regulate in any case. Yer effing adults, act like it.

I'm talking about community ostracision of predators and the unsafe. Clearly the community has a need to self-police and bleating "just act like adults" isn't going to help that kind of situation. Ye Gods woman, think!

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Usually I appreciate your arguments. This one is far from art.

This shows bitterness. Sad.

No, I'm not bitter at all. Whatever perception you believe you possess has just failed you.

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The word here that makes your entire argument bullshit is "majority."

You may have come to know the "general" heterosexual woman fairly well. You have not come to know me well, if you believe you can tell me my personal experiences and preferences better than I can.

Meh. Almost every woman thinks she's special and almost every woman thinks she's the exception to the rule (regardless of her kink or sexual orientation). Given that you've just expressed that exact sentiment how much stock do you think I'm going to put in the idea that you're an exception?

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Men are not only often not honest about such things, but they're often unaware of their own buttons and how they can be pushed.

Of course. However I'm talking about women, not men. Or are you unable to have a discussion about women without immediately feeling the need to talk about the flaws and foibles of men? That seems rather insecure on your part.

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Women have a monopoly on using their sexual power to manipulate men who have few options when it comes to getting laid.

Bullshit. What rock do you live under?

I think we have found a serious black hole in your normally well-reasoned (even when wrong) posts. Remember saying something about bitterness showing through? Dude. Yeah.

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Fuck, I'm not a FinDomme, and I use the sexual tease all the freaking time! It's FUN! Hell, my boy loves it. It's part of what makes us so super hot. Every moment is a tease.

So? The entire point is that FinDommes are exploiting the weak and stupid. It's why there's a dirty great banner saying, "Do not send money to anyone."

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Saying that someone is using a sexual tease like it's a bad thing, to me, makes you sound prudish and sad.

Oh for fuck's sake, are you really this dim? I said nothing of the sort. I said you cannot disconnect the tease from the FinDomme - it is implicitly a sexual interaction which is just another form of prostitution.

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The reason we wall off prostitution to areas which are explicitly designed for it is to allow people who wish to engage in good faith to do so without the possibility of the interaction turning commercial. Prostitutes who solicit just pollute a community with spam. I don't give a fuck if FinDommes ply their trade on a site explicitly for that purpose. I do think they shouldn't be allowed to do so amidst a community under the false pretenses of being here to engage in good faith.

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And yet... you speak as if manipulation is always bad. It's not.

I agree. However the ethical view of manipulation or influence is whether it's used to the detriment of the individual being manipulated. In the case of the FinDomme, that's definitely true.

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It's not about "turn." They are who they are. Not all men will be dominant, no matter how hard they work at it. Not all women will be, either.

Meh, I think they give up. Being a man is all too hard and so they try and take the easy way out. And frankly, that's a product of faulty belief structures.

And belief structures are implicitly malleable.

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FOR YOU. You don't need to understand something for it to exist and function without you.

No, but I can sure as shit comment and make a judgment call on it.

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ORIGINAL: MariaB

You can only have this sort of conversation with other reasonable people. I just realized that I got sucked into trying to explain my view to a person who will never empathize with my perspective. Having a conversation with you Awareness, its like trying to converse with a man who just rode into town on a mule.

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ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant

Maria, you needed this https://www.dalmatianfire.com/Scott_Packs.html I cannot beleive you thought you could survive in a methane enriched environment without one.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

A submissive man pretending to be a dominant man is still just a submissive man.

A submissive woman approaching you pretending to be a dominant woman is still just a submissive woman.

And a manipulative one at that, because chances are she might want you to fall for that bait by appealing to your. . . substantial ego.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

I disagree, there's really no rationale to support your notion whereas I have millennia of male domination of the planet as a clear example of male dominance.

You see only the surface of outward appearances. If you read between the lines, going by oral traditions of historical accounts or even by the first Biblically recorded, officially acknowledged patriarch Abraham, it was his wife Sarah who called the shots and ran the show.

You must not be an anthropologist or an archaeologist. There is more archaeological evidence of matriarchal and matrilineal practices being the norm among agrarian societies of the earliest city-builder civilizations.

Further, none of us were back there in the prehistoric Stone Ages, yourself included. You don't know the unknowable.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

And frankly, the typical FemDomme "it's all about me" attitude is only going to develop in the absence of scarcity.

So why should you care? It doesn't affect you personally. Not unless you happen to be one of these "pretend" Doms who's really a submissive.

And like there aren't stereotypical asshat Doms with an 'it's all about me' attitude prowling around this very same site? Not kidding or on familiar terms with female subs when they address women as sluts and cunts, ordering them to "Kneel, bitch." Give me a break.

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

I think very few dominant women gain satisfaction from submissive males who offer themselves up on a plate;

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ORIGINAL: Awareness

I have not seen a single FemDomme anywhere ever talk about having to work to gain a male sub's time or attention. Ever. Now why do you think that is?

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ORIGINAL: dreamlady


So why should you care? It doesn't affect you personally. Not unless you happen to one of these "pretend" Doms who's really a submissive.

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ORIGINAL: sexyred1

10 pages.

Why you people (you know who you are) keep trying to change the mind of another poster is beyond me.

I find women hating threads a bore.