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MasterJaguar01 -> RE: SCOTUS rules gay marriage legal in all states! (6/28/2015 9:03:34 AM)
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ORIGINAL: BamaD
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ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
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ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
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CreativeDominant
We are all equal under the law now. But what does that entail? Can I go into a Muslim or Jewish restaurant and demand pork...their beliefs be damned? Can I demand that a vegan caterer serve filet mignon at my wedding and have the weight of the law on my side?
What is it about "We are all equal under the law now" that causes you so much difficulty? Are you against everyone being equal under the law?
It's a really simple concept - just treat everyone the same. What could possibly be wrong with that? Why are you manufacturing difficulties?
Great...then I want to see gay couples going into a Muslim bakery and asking for a gay wedding cake...I want to see carnivorous couples going to a vegan caterer and asking them to serve filet mignon at a group meeting.
That's equality, right? Everyone treated equally, no matter their beliefs? I seriously doubt that the vegan caterer's beliefs are any deeper than the Christian couple forced to pay $ 135,000.00 for acting upon their beliefs. Or that the Muslim's beliefs are any deeper than the Christians.
First of all, gay couples should absolutely be able to go into a Muslim bakery and ask for a cake for theiir wedding.
Secondly, a caterer (vegan or not) who doesn't cater any meat dishes is under NO obligation to cater meat dishes for anyone (carniverous or not), as long as he/she does nott pick and choose for whom he/she will cater meat dishes.
Just treat everyone equally and fairly. If you are not open on Sunday, due to your religious beliefs, fine. Just don't open for some people and not others. It really isn't that hard.
If you are offended by doing business with some parts of your community, then you have NO buusiness doing business in that community. That is true, whether you are gay, straight, Christtian, Musllim, or anything else.
And when, as in Oregon they drive a quarter of the way across the state to find a baker who, while they have no problem serving gays have a problem doing a gay wedding. Or are you saying that they should only be allowed to run a business if they deny there beliefs? Not putting words in your mouth, asking, because that is what it looks like.
Back to the denying beliefs thing again.
In general, (and this is codified in law in a plethora of communities, (a point which I had to teach Hunter), if you are open for business to the public, you can't discriminate, even for your own religious beliefs. Should there be some exceptions? Yes. (e.g. HOSTING events, private clubs, and truly religious organizations (which are in effect, private clubs).
If you are devout in your religion, and certain customers, offend you, (NOT because they are disruptive, or abuusive, or intoxicated), but solely because of their characteristics (age, gender, race, sexual orientation), then you need to get out of serving the public, or not get in.
Will gay people drive across the state to try and bait people? Maybe. (I throw them on the pile of a-holes of society). The law, in many places, (and IMO American values dictate) says that you need to treat people equally and fairly.
It's NOT just a question of free market. (We had that argument in '65 over the civil rights act) "You can go across the street to someone else."
Even if you could "go across the street (or nearby) to another business. The Civil Rights Argument (which won) said that you shouldn't have to. That there was a MINIMUM standard of interaction with all customers.
Public Accomodations Laws simply add "Sexual Orientation" to thhe list of criteria in the Civil Riights Act.
What if you lived in a small town, and I had the best gourmet sandwiches in the county, and everyone liked to go to my store. (Basically the whole town). You come into my store for lunch with your co-workers, and I say "I am sorry, I can't serve you. My deeply held religious beliefs prevent me from serving anyone who has been affiliated with a German Shepherd. You will have to leave. But you can go to the McDonald's in the next town (5 mins away). They will serve German Shepherd lovers like you."?
If you complain, I can say "It's a free market. There are other places to eat."
The Bottom line is this: The Federal Government (supported largely by Republicans (against Dixiecrats) has said (they left out sexual orientation in the CRA), and huundreds of local goovernments have said, (and I agree), that a business owner serving the public has a fiduciary duty to the public to treat everyone fairly. If your religious beliefs are so hateful and discriminatory, that you can't even make someone a sandwich, just because you don't appprove of his/her characteristcs, then you should remain a private citizen and not serve the publc (OR, as you put it, deny your beliefs)
Again, there are, and should be some exceptions. (Maybe there should be more exceptions. As long as they are reasonable, and the rules are clear)
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