quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83

hopefully what's going on is the end of that madness called euro. What happened is when the euro was created the various european countries would give away their power of minting their own currency and leaving to private banks the duty to guarantee the value of the money in return of an interest. This basically created a disproportion in the cost of money in the various country where in germany, BeNeLux and france is cheap wher in southern europe having a different economy is more expensive and basically it drained capital from the mediterranean countries to the central ones. This system created not many problems until the usa didn't start the world crisis in 2008. The rules supporting the euro basically rushed with the necessities of the countries to recover from the crisis so policies of austerity were imposed by the european bank to keep the currency strong, while some countries are starting to recover now greece's economy was cushed, the bailout strategy and a road map to recovery that the eu governament imposed to greece didn't improved the economy but killed it, the only effect was the debt was repaid in part by the other countries so private banks would be safe and eventually the people would pay the costs. Now the eu governament imposed other conditions on the same line of austerity for greece, but this time after changing their own governament they tried to negotiate a better deal, the eu governament called an ultimatum and greece prime minister decided to ask with a referendum to the people if the wanted to accept it or not, they voted to reject it. So they may decide now various option the governament is not pushing officially for a national currency but for a better deal, the eu governament said in the last days if they voted no they would be forced to do so. This opens various scenarios for grece and for the rest of europe because let's be clear € is a corrupted system and now people are starting to question it.

Not us Eulero, because we haven't adopted it and are clinging doggedly to the Queen's Sterling. It was always going to be a mess because the Germans and French as far back as the 1950s always wanted a fully integrated union, no matter that economies need the power to decide their own interest rates to manage inflation among other things.

The whole European Union is a shambles.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri



I've also heard of another "bail in" where they rape Greek savings accounts for cash. If they go back to the drachma, who is going to want to own any of it? What country is going to accept a drachma as payment? Will they experience hyperinflation, a la Weimar, or Zmbabwe, as they attempt to inflate their debts away? Isn't the US just a great example of how that doesn't necessarily help?!?

quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83

I know that's why I never named the UK, I agree with what you wrote, unfortunatly when Italy started to question the system Berlusconi's depravity was leaked and we end up with Monti... I've never been for cospiration theory but...

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV
Unless Greece finds investors willing to deal, they'll have no choice but to keep spending in line with income.

Austerity is nearly impossible without an amazing economy in the country, which isn't happening for whatever reasons. Balancing the budget is the first step. Fiscal responsibility can't be ignored by government, and excessive spending cannot be maintained without raising income.

The Greeks need to look at why jobs aren't being created, and change laws that are in the way.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirMatty1
With 170% debt on the BIP, there is no chance in hell they can balance the budget.
That thing is down the toilet and it is the EZB fault, plus the EU Commission and Merkel.
They should have put the breaks on years ago.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

It's not like US States aren't carrying debts of their own.
http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/how-much-debt-does-your-state-have/article/2560310

Even with a central federal government, individual states have different fiscal policies, including tax codes, public spending, etc.

There is a difference, though.

You're all Americans. Culturally you're all pretty similar. The odd difference here and there but generally you perceive yourselves to be one nation.

quote:


This is the exact opposite. We, the English, feel we have very little in common with these people. The fact we are geographically in a place called Europe is immaterial. So, what are we doing in a union with these people? It's not that we don't like them, we just don't agree with them on most things.

So, how on earth can we forge a partnership with a group of people with whom we disagree on most things?

Madness.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirMatty1

The Empress of Europe in all her wisdom let that happen. The German finance Minister has no clue about economics, he is a lawyer.

Europe is through and through a disaster zone. They get shit nailed to the wall.

We got PR on our hands and will get that done one way or another.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

It's not like US States aren't carrying debts of their own.
http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/how-much-debt-does-your-state-have/article/2560310

Even with a central federal government, individual states have different fiscal policies, including tax codes, public spending, etc.

There is a difference, though.

You're all Americans. Culturally you're all pretty similar. The odd difference here and there but generally you perceive yourselves to be one nation.

This is the exact opposite. We, the English, feel we have very little in common with these people. The fact we are geographically in a place called Europe is immaterial. So, what are we doing in a union with these people? It's not that we don't like them, we just don't agree with them on most things.

So, how on earth can we forge a partnership with a group of people with whom we disagree on most things?

Madness.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV

We have similar issues here at home, with Puerto Rico. But because Puerto Ricans are US Citizens, they can relocate to the States to find work fairly easily.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirMatty1
With 170% debt on the BIP, there is no chance in hell they can balance the budget.
That thing is down the toilet and it is the EZB fault, plus the EU Commission and Merkel.
They should have put the breaks on years ago.

No fault on the Greek government?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
You are right about the concept of the EU being undemocratic though. We are due to have a vote on staying in or getting out here in the UK by 2017. I suspect we will be fed some bullshit to get us to stay in, I for one will be voting to get the fuck out.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent


Not us Eulero, because we haven't adopted it and are clinging doggedly to the Queen's Sterling. It was always going to be a mess because the Germans and French as far back as the 1950s always wanted a fully integrated union, no matter that economies need the power to decide their own interest rates to manage inflation among other things.

The whole European Union is a shambles.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
You are right about the concept of the EU being undemocratic though. We are due to have a vote on staying in or getting out here in the UK by 2017. I suspect we will be fed some bullshit to get us to stay in, I for one will be voting to get the fuck out.

when is the vote in the UK? and of those fellow Brits you have talked to about in or out, what do most have to say about how they will vote?

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirMatty1

In the US we don't bail out other States.

In Germany that is a concept going back almost to its founding.

We need to keep one thing in mind. There is a very different legal system in Europe.
Comparing the US and Europe makes almost no sense because of that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

Too bad you can't treat a country like they do a failed corporation.

Assign a court appointed executor to dispose of assets and pay off debts as best able.

Hmmm, I wonder what the Parthenon would go for?