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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 12:54:54 AM   
DaddySatyr


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

having grown up a M*A*S*H fan, i always thought of corporal klinger when i went through and often wondered if there was anything in the city to commemorate him.



While I can't claim to not be a fan of minor league baseball, I went to a Toledo Mud Hens' game for just that reason.



Michael

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 4:51:57 AM   
bounty44


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The US Highway system is in disrepair because Republican Congress Members don't want to levy taxes to fund the upkeep.


what a partisan joke you are---for the most part recently, and over the last few decades, congress has been in democratic control. you are so patently unfair and biased when it comes to things im not sure how you can look at yourself in the mirror with a clear conscience.

its not evident what you mean by "US highway system"---if by that you mean the interstates, then its worth pointing out there are roads (still "highways") all over the country in great need of repair that fall under state, not federal, authority.


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/16/opinion/16wed1.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=c-column-top-span-region



a number of things comrade head in the clouds:

setting aside for a moment that you completely ignored the point of the majority of roads falling under state and local authority...

the system has been in "disrepair" long before the present congressional servants took their offices. get that? so from a chronological cause/effect perspective, youre up a creek without a paddle.

from your link:

quote:

The gas tax has been stuck at 18.4 cents a gallon since 1993, and during those 21 years it has lost 39 percent of its value to inflation.


how many of those years, as I pointed out in my initial reply to you, have had democratic controlled congresses?

and ummmmm:

quote:

President Obama was right to think big last year when he proposed spending $302 billion over four years on transportation projects, but even he lacked the political courage to back a higher gas tax to pay for it


so if I am understanding that rightly, your golden boy is in the same boat in this regard as those nasty mean republicans? but its only the republicans' fault.

and this...

quote:

On Tuesday the House made the situation worse with a sad excuse for a highway funding bill: A 10-month measure that keeps spending at an inadequate level


...is an opinion, not a fact. whats more, there are other ways, apparently, to fund highway repair other than to "levy taxes" and it seems republicans in the present congress are aware of the need and are taking some steps to address it. so everything cannot be laid at the feet of republicans because of their reluctance in raising taxes.

and have you ever thought---unlikely because big government is built into your dna---that the highway infrastructure would best be taken care of at the state and local level? that one of the reasons for the disrepair is because of federal waste and inefficiency? did you ever think the highway trust fun is running dry because of elevated spending or other causes? and not because of inadequate funding?

http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/cut-federal-highway-spending

a few meaningful points from it:

quote:

If Tennessee needs more money for roads, it can raise its own gas tax any time it wants. Wouldn’t Tennesseans prefer that their gas taxes stay within the state for local roads, rather than flowing to wasteful Washington to fund subways and bicycle paths elsewhere?...

Transportation expert Cliff Winston of Brookings recently noted that federal “transportation policy is so inefficient that infrastructure spending fails to generate the large promised benefits.”...

Investment is misallocated...Aid spending is mismanaged...Federal mandates raise costs...Aid distorts decision-making...

The original idea behind the HTF was that gas taxes would be user charges for funding highways. But since the 1970s gas taxes have been siphoned off for other purposes, and today about one-quarter of HTF spending is for non-highway purposes.


have a great time reading that and the rest of it...

and think of this while you do: is your final hope for better roads? or a bigger federal government? i suspect we all know the answer to that.

and while im here---hey comrade bird brain, there are some messages for you on the john Boehner and obummercare (like that?) thread.



< Message edited by bounty44 -- 9/16/2015 4:58:27 AM >

(in reply to cloudboy)
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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 4:54:19 AM   
bounty44


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

having grown up a M*A*S*H fan, i always thought of corporal klinger when i went through and often wondered if there was anything in the city to commemorate him.



While I can't claim to not be a fan of minor league baseball, I went to a Toledo Mud Hens' game for just that reason.



Michael


or a hot dog from tony packo's!

was there anything "klinger" at the stadium?


< Message edited by bounty44 -- 9/16/2015 4:59:27 AM >

(in reply to DaddySatyr)
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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 5:14:25 AM   
servantforuse


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Status: offline 		Wasn't the Obama stimulus billions to be used for infrastructure repair, replacing bridges and repairing roads ? Certainly you remember all of those shovel ready jobs.

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 7:48:17 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44
i was there for four years and was back and forth to NY many times, passing through Toledo. this wasn't road repair so much as construction, but the entire time i was in Michigan, Toledo was working on the roads east and north of the city. four to five years' worth---I wondered how much "milking it" was going on.
having grown up a M*A*S*H fan, i always thought of corporal klinger when i went through and often wondered if there was anything in the city to commemorate him.


There is a Jamie Farr park in Toledo. Tony Packo's is for real, and they are widely known for celebrities signing a bun (it's not a real bun) and that bun being put on the wall. I don't know if any location other than the original location showcases these buns (I haven't been to them all), but it's really interesting to walk through and see all the people who have been to Packo's.


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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 7:54:10 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44
having grown up a M*A*S*H fan, i always thought of corporal klinger when i went through and often wondered if there was anything in the city to commemorate him.

While I can't claim to not be a fan of minor league baseball, I went to a Toledo Mud Hens' game for just that reason.
Michael


When did you go, and was it a home game for the Mudhens?

They have a new (a few years old) home in downtown Toledo that is a really nice stadium. Their former stadium (Ned Skeldon Field) is actually in Maumee (a southern suburb), and is still there. Interesting to note: my son is playing a baseball game at the former Mudhens stadium tonight, and Saturday. The Wounded Warriors Project held an exhibition there this past Spring. They played 3 games. One was against local Police and Fire members, one was against former Detroit Tiger players (the Mudhens are the AAA farm team of the Tigers and Detroit is the closest major league team, so it fit nicely), and I think they played a team of local celebrities (news reporters, etc.).


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to DaddySatyr)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 7:59:02 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
Wasn't the Obama stimulus billions to be used for infrastructure repair, replacing bridges and repairing roads ? Certainly you remember all of those shovel ready jobs.


There were (still are) projects that used stimulus funding.

Ohio even had signs about it.


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 9:10:16 AM   
cloudboy


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Well, then, we both agree that Congress needs to increase taxes in general or the Gasoline Tax in particular to fund the US highway system. Why hasn't this already happened?

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 9:35:52 AM   
enslaver


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Status: offline 		we don`t need any tax increase, we need to tell Congress in no uncertain terms. you will spend OUR money in OUR country for awhile, to hell with the rest of the world.

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 9:48:24 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		isnt that bushes plan??? tax cuts to the top earners??? sorry they arent the people who need more money in their pockets.


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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 9:51:46 AM   
KenDckey


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Status: offline 		On the reverse side of that coin Lucy isn't it possible that the country (or at least a large segment) wants to punish those that have money because they achieved the American Dream - having enough money to do whatever they want as long as it is legal?

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 10:00:25 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

On the reverse side of that coin Lucy isn't it possible that the country (or at least a large segment) wants to punish those that have money because they achieved the American Dream - having enough money to do whatever they want as long as it is legal?


Is the american dream to steal 4 billion dollars from your stockholders via bankruptsy?

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 10:04:54 AM   
Lucylastic


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Status: offline 		dear god Ken you are a blind fool.

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 3:15:52 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: enslaver

we don`t need any tax increase, we need to tell Congress in no uncertain terms. you will spend OUR money in OUR country for awhile, to hell with the rest of the world.



What did they say when you told them that?

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 3:36:19 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline 		An interesting article on roadways and projects here

I don't know about elsewhere but in B-more the roads are embarrassingly third world bad. As in there's a pothole every street. Most have teeth jarring bad pavement.
It's effing awful, like driving on a washed out farm road, but paved.
It fucking kills me.
And what it does to my car is just brutal.
I get monthly front end alignments.

Gak-We bailed out the bankers when we should have spent that cash on infrastructure. Would have had the same impact on short term financial solvency, but fuck, at least the nation could have gotten something (Jobs, fast internet, cutting edge telecom, smooth roads, new bridges, massive materials used, tons of heavy construction equipment, the multiplier effect of putting money into the economy, the list of positives goes on and on and on).
That was the missed opportunity of our lifetime. The nation will rue that decision for at least a century.

But I digress.
IIRC, we need 50 billion to fix the infrastructure to safety standards. Really we should toss in at least that much more for side projects and 50b extra to cover the over-runs.
(But hey, points at all the positives that come with major infrastructure work. Most of that money will come back through the govts hands more than a few times. besides, hey, congress being who they are, lots of kickbacks, payoffs and insider deals can be cut that they wet their beaks. Why wouldn't congress want that?)
That's jump change by government standards.
Like a squad of planes.
They need to make this happen ASAP.

I'd vote for the guy that made this happen

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 4:37:38 PM   
thompsonx


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quote:

I'd vote for the guy that made this happen


"If nominated I will not run.
If elected I will not serve".

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 6:30:35 PM   
MercTech


Posts: 3706
Joined: 7/4/2006
Status: offline 		Just a bit on roadways..... The federal government doesn't directly fund roadways.

The NHTSA provides matching funds for state expenditures on the upkeep of "federal highways". If the designation is like US66, the old Lincoln HIghway from Chicago to L.A.; the funds the state lays out to keep the roadways in repair are matched by federal highway moneys. The matching is done for all the Interstate highways. If the state government doesn't pony up for maintaining roadways; it just doesn't get done. If the state government hires bubba-cousin's fly by night paving company; you get crappy roadways. (Why do I always think of I-90 through Illinois when I think crappy roadways)

In many states; the "state highways" use matching funds from the state budget when county or municipalities work on the state highways. Strictly local roads are often built and maintained only with local funds. In many states, when you read the line items on a car tag bill; so much to state, so much to county, so much to local.

Thus the cost of roadways is supposed to be shared.

Occasionally, you get people like Joan Claybrook that want to blackmail state and local governments with their own agenda in order to cut loose the matching funds from the federal coffers.
(Carter administration. Early 1970s gas crisis. Claybrook was off the deep end as head of the NHTSA. She even proposed requiring seat belts and air bags on motorcycles. She witheld NHTSA matching funds until the states raised the legal drinking age to 21 and lowered all speed limits to a max of 55mph. Including the Interstate highways which had a design criteria of being able to safely support non-urban sustained speeds of 95mph.)

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 6:34:27 PM   
bounty44


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


Well, then, we both agree that Congress needs to increase taxes in general or the Gasoline Tax in particular to fund the US highway system. Why hasn't this already happened?


I am in no such agreement. two of the strongest points I made are about the waste of the federal government in general and that the highways should be a matter for the states.

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 6:45:18 PM   
bounty44


Posts: 6374
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44
i was there for four years and was back and forth to NY many times, passing through Toledo. this wasn't road repair so much as construction, but the entire time i was in Michigan, Toledo was working on the roads east and north of the city. four to five years' worth---I wondered how much "milking it" was going on.
having grown up a M*A*S*H fan, i always thought of corporal klinger when i went through and often wondered if there was anything in the city to commemorate him.


There is a Jamie Farr park in Toledo. Tony Packo's is for real, and they are widely known for celebrities signing a bun (it's not a real bun) and that bun being put on the wall. I don't know if any location other than the original location showcases these buns (I haven't been to them all), but it's really interesting to walk through and see all the people who have been to Packo's.



there's an episode too where he tears up when a fresh recruit from Toledo gives him a matchbook cover from the trianon.

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RE: Our Roadways - 9/16/2015 6:49:07 PM   
thompsonx


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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

...is an opinion, not a fact. whats more, there are other ways, apparently, to fund highway repair other than to "levy taxes" and it seems republicans in the present congress are aware of the need and are taking some steps to address it. so everything cannot be laid at the feet of republicans because of their reluctance in raising taxes.
]

What would those ways be?

quote:

and have you ever thought---unlikely because big government is built into your dna---that the highway infrastructure would best be taken care of at the state and local level?


The state and county do take care of the infrastructure why did you think they did not?.
The interstate system is not small...do you feel that should be under state control or should it remain under federal control?


(in reply to bounty44)
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