RE: Porn considered Immoral?

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LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 8:57:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: blnymph I d not know the legal situation in the USA but: such a "morality clause" would be illegal under European laws and the candidate fully permitted to lie if asked because the employer has no right to investigate about the private lives and activities of employees (unless of criminal relevance) The problem is that it wasn't something she did privately, she did it for money. In a lot of jobs, especially in the public sector, you do need the permission of your employer to have another job. I've worked in quite a few European countries and it is pretty standard that a work contract states that you have to get permission from your employer if you run another business, that's simply due to the fact that your free time should be used to recharge your batteries, if you work several jobs, you might have a conflict of interest or you might not get sufficient rest to work effectively in your main job. In several countries working during your vacation in another job is reason for dismissal. As far as I know, anybody in the police force in the UK is not allowed to be a member of a political party, to avoid a conflict of interest.

LadyPact -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 8:58:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: blnymph I d not know the legal situation in the USA but: such a "morality clause" would be illegal under European laws and the candidate fully permitted to lie if asked because the employer has no right to investigate about the private lives and activities of employees (unless of criminal relevance) Oh, it certainly does work like that here. In fact, lying even on the application for employment can be used as grounds for dismissal. If an applicant has fudged prior employment record in the form of position, pay, title, or any of that stuff, an employer is within their rights to terminate. You'll find that even printed on most applications. Morality clauses are perfectly legal here. Even in various occupations where it's not considered civil service. (Police, fire, etc.)

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 8:59:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I just think it's ironic that a miami cop was fired because of 'morality'/ I lived there for 18 years and a huge number on that force are the scum of the earth. If they would fire all the liars, thieves, murderers and druggies off that force, there'd be damn few left. Personally a crooked cop bothers me a lot more than a cop doing porn....

freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:01:38 AM)
We have something similar in our employment conditions here and it's not illegal under EU laws. The reason being is because there could be a conflict of interest in certain situations during the normal course of doing their duty. I know that because my cousin is a police officer and had to sign her employment contract that stated that she was not involved in certain activities (including not belonging to any religious cult or dubious religious group/coven). Much like when I worked as a consultant/programmer for the MOD. For certain projects, they made sure I was not involved in any religious group and had never traveled or lived in any subversive country (even though it's not illegal to do so). Rules is rules whether we like them or not. So if we agree to those rules when we start employment, if found out later you'd be dismissed for lying on your declaration. It's as simple as that.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:04:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: blnymph I d not know the legal situation in the USA but: such a "morality clause" would be illegal under European laws and the candidate fully permitted to lie if asked because the employer has no right to investigate about the private lives and activities of employees (unless of criminal relevance) Oh, it certainly does work like that here. In fact, lying even on the application for employment can be used as grounds for dismissal. If an applicant has fudged prior employment record in the form of position, pay, title, or any of that stuff, an employer is within their rights to terminate. You'll find that even printed on most applications. Morality clauses are perfectly legal here. Even in various occupations where it's not considered civil service. (Police, fire, etc.) Same in Europe, questions they are not allowed to ask are sexual orientation, political views, etc., basically anything that isn't relevant for the job and is prying into your personal life. But if you fib on your application it can lead to instant dismissal, I think (not sure, it depends from country to country) they aren't allowed to ask you about how much you earned, but unless you change your job with the new tax year, they see it on your tax card

Hillwilliam -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:05:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze quote: ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam I just think it's ironic that a miami cop was fired because of 'morality'/ I lived there for 18 years and a huge number on that force are the scum of the earth. If they would fire all the liars, thieves, murderers and druggies off that force, there'd be damn few left. Personally a crooked cop bothers me a lot more than a cop doing porn.... Google "Miami river cops" some time. There were eventually about 100 cops convicted in a ring that would: 1. Identify a boat smuggling a multi hundred kilo load of cocaine up the Miami river (good job guys) 2. Stop the boat as it docked and arrest the crew and people unloading (ditto) 3. Zip tie everyone's hands behind their backs (good arrest technique) Then, instead of calling the paddy wagon, they would put a 9mm in the back of their heads and kick them into the river. The cocaine (sometimes loads of a ton or more) was then sold and the proceeds pocketed.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:13:50 AM)
To be flip, with that amount they possibly didn't have to worry about pension funds...

Bunnicula -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:26:51 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: blnymph I d not know the legal situation in the USA but: such a "morality clause" would be illegal under European laws and the candidate fully permitted to lie if asked because the employer has no right to investigate about the private lives and activities of employees (unless of criminal relevance) Not true. I have a morality clause in my contract (I'm a teacher) and if I breach that then not only do I risk losing my job I also risk losing my teaching licence. It's standard for many public service professions, including police. It means there is nothing in our background that would put us at risk of being blackmailed, besmirch the reputation of our employer, undermine the trust placed in us by the public and potentially 'corrupt' our charges, among many other reasons. Could you imagine a police officer being called to give evidence against a sex trafficker or a prostitute and it coming to light that they act in porn movies? Credibility shot to hell, case falls apart. The general public judges those in public service quite harshly, and those in a position of trust are held to a higher standard of perceived morality. It's something we accept when we take on those jobs.

MrRodgers -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:37:48 AM)
Depends on what the porn is. Some would call the clip of a SVN officer shooting a traitor in the both on film and a still. (Time mag.) as porn. Means nothing whatsoever. The hang up on the sexual type porn and one wonders why ?

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:46:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bunnicula Not true. I have a morality clause in my contract (I'm a teacher) and if I breach that then not only do I risk losing my job I also risk losing my teaching licence. It's standard for many public service professions, including police. It means there is nothing in our background that would put us at risk of being blackmailed, besmirch the reputation of our employer, undermine the trust placed in us by the public and potentially 'corrupt' our charges, among many other reasons. Could you imagine a police officer being called to give evidence against a sex trafficker or a prostitute and it coming to light that they act in porn movies? Credibility shot to hell, case falls apart. The general public judges those in public service quite harshly, and those in a position of trust are held to a higher standard of perceived morality. It's something we accept when we take on those jobs. I do understand the blackmail risk, however I find it odd that you can have a job and pay tax for that job, yet it's perceived as "immoral" - if the government isn't too proud to accept your tax for a legit job, i.e. you aren't doing anything criminal, then you shouldn't be discriminated for it. I understand why you can't be a teacher, cop, etc. and at the same time a porn actor, however, if you've done porn at one time in your life and then you end up being a cop or a teacher, it doesn't make you morally inferior, at least not any more than the people who purchase said porn and recognise you.

Bunnicula -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 9:54:40 AM)
On one level I agree with you totally. If it's not illegal why shouldn't we be able to do it. However, in reality it's completely different. Could you look your child's teacher in the eye if you'd seen them shoving a 12 inch dildo up their backside while simultaneously sucking someone's dick the night before? Similarly, can you imagine trying to teach trig to a class of teenagers who have seen you gangbanged and creampied on a porn channel? Trust me, that wouldn't work lol Actually we had a staff briefing the other week in which our new head teacher warned us about our behaviour in the local town, stating clearly that any teacher getting falling down drunk and behaving badly and being seen by a student or parent, then they would face a disciplinary panel.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 10:15:33 AM)
quote: However, in reality it's completely different. Could you look your child's teacher in the eye if you'd seen them shoving a 12 inch dildo up their backside while simultaneously sucking someone's dick the night before? How would I know? For all I know they could have done it in private... quote: Similarly, can you imagine trying to teach trig to a class of teenagers who have seen you gangbanged and creampied on a porn channel? Trust me, that wouldn't work lol I can see that as a bit of a problem, but that would be the problem of the teacher and somebody who'd go "Yep, so what, that was years ago! Now do show me your homework..." could possibly pull it off. It's something that the individual should consider, penalizing somebody for what they've done 10 or 20 years ago and what wasn't illegal just seems to be so hypocritical. I've never done porn or orgies, but hell, I'm glad that mobiles didn't have cams 20 years ago, I've done some weird stuff, like skinny dipping due to a dare at midnight in the fountain in town square, etc. I'm pretty sure that doesn't make forever tainted... quote: Actually we had a staff briefing the other week in which our new head teacher warned us about our behaviour in the local town, stating clearly that any teacher getting falling down drunk and behaving badly and being seen by a student or parent, then they would face a disciplinary panel Does that mean that you're coming to do your drinking here [;)]

Bunnicula -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 11:20:51 AM)
I'm not saying it's 'fair', but it's what we agreed to. I too am glad there's no pics of me from a decade or so ago! lol And yes, I'm sitting here with my wine at hand, ready to drink away from the eyes of strangers. Although to be fair, you lot are pretty damn strange [8D]

Kreychec -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 11:47:03 AM)
Balblair 91 here & who else to judge strange but the girl rocking a macabre bunny chewing on the remains of his loving owner. ;)

bounty44 -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 12:27:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kreychec ...calling porn "immoral" is comical. I can't begin to imagine where this line of thought even stems from, religion? Yeah fucking goats in the desert is dope but god forbid two people having sex in a studio... can I suggest to you, before you scoff at any one person/place/thing that considers something "immoral," that you yourself have a solid foundational grounding on just where our general morality comes from & how it is created. then you will have the criteria by which to make the judgment you are looking for. otherwise, you are just touching on surfaces.

Kreychec -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/1/2015 2:29:19 PM)
Morals are based more-so on individual views, the views pertaining to deigning pornography are not align with that of my own. I can only imagine these views stem from a religious and or over-socialized ideology. If you consider that to be vapid then please elaborate on why it is so.

zombiegurlsos -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/2/2015 4:37:34 AM)
Hi Freedomdwarf1 that has been the rule of thumb for 200 or 300 years when they started reforming police forces. But it is not working as evidenced by the constant turn over of cops who on paper look great to the hiring board, but in the end don't work out... In the 1920's prison system the warden would often take a murder and put them in the tower with a rifle, the ideal being one time a murder doesn't make you a bad prison guard. I think that since the record shows that really good people make bad cops and reallllllly bad people make bad cops, the likely best cop is something in between. When I worked in the LASO there was a rapist that got caught after his third rape, it was the nephew of one of the bureau LT.... case in point.... thank you quote: ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1 You are obviously naive enough not to have heard that hiring people of dubious background could (and often would) bring a reputable/respected business/service into disrepute and thus severely affect how things are viewed by the public. So.... being a porn star, or axe murderer, or regular burglar/thief would not be the right person to employ as a police officer. Much the same as an ex-pedophile or someone with a known dink/drug/violence problem would not be the ideal candidate for the position of kinder-garden teacher. Quite often, your previous misdemeanours would have a direct impact on your employability for certain jobs.

zombiegurlsos -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/2/2015 4:41:56 AM)
Also who set the standard for immorality... likely church folks.... who wish to live a morality standard that has been proven time and time again to be out of the reach of most of us in the reality zone. quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze quote: ORIGINAL: Bunnicula Not true. I have a morality clause in my contract (I'm a teacher) and if I breach that then not only do I risk losing my job I also risk losing my teaching licence. It's standard for many public service professions, including police. It means there is nothing in our background that would put us at risk of being blackmailed, besmirch the reputation of our employer, undermine the trust placed in us by the public and potentially 'corrupt' our charges, among many other reasons. Could you imagine a police officer being called to give evidence against a sex trafficker or a prostitute and it coming to light that they act in porn movies? Credibility shot to hell, case falls apart. The general public judges those in public service quite harshly, and those in a position of trust are held to a higher standard of perceived morality. It's something we accept when we take on those jobs. I do understand the blackmail risk, however I find it odd that you can have a job and pay tax for that job, yet it's perceived as "immoral" - if the government isn't too proud to accept your tax for a legit job, i.e. you aren't doing anything criminal, then you shouldn't be discriminated for it. I understand why you can't be a teacher, cop, etc. and at the same time a porn actor, however, if you've done porn at one time in your life and then you end up being a cop or a teacher, it doesn't make you morally inferior, at least not any more than the people who purchase said porn and recognise you.

freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/2/2015 5:11:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kreychec Morals are based more-so on individual views, the views pertaining to deigning pornography are not align with that of my own. I can only imagine these views stem from a religious and or over-socialized ideology. If you consider that to be vapid then please elaborate on why it is so. Have you considered that perhaps your views are out of line with those of society in general?? It doesn't matter where the line is drawn and on what basis; it is what it is at present. If you want to live outside of societal norms, that would be your problem. That would put YOU out of line, not the society in which you live. So any explanation of the differences would need to come from you - not everyone else explaining why society doesn't match your views.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Porn considered Immoral? (11/2/2015 5:41:38 AM)
I think sometimes we do need to challenge "general views" - if that wouldn't have happened time and time again, we still would have no social system but child labour and a feudal system, etc. My whole issue is that if the country isn't too proud to take the tax of somebody doing a job that isn't illegal, it IS hypocritical to treat the person any different than another person and as morally inferior - wouldn't that mean that the country taking that "immoral tax" is guilty by simply taxing or making something legal that they feel so strongly about?

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