RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (Full Version)

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crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 1:48:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19

“It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17)

“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)


So I am wondering how many of those people who claim to be Christians do eat pork, shellfish, wear mixed fiber and all that, because they should all be stoned to death for it, because Jesus claimed he wants to uphold the old laws...

He is talking about the Ten Commandments, not the laws of Leviticus.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. ~Matthew 22:36-38

K.



I don't think that you can draw that conclusion from the text. While it's plain that JC was creating a new covenant, there are tons of references to the "law" and "the prophets". Very few would argue that Matt 5:7 was a reference to just the big ten.



mnottertail -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 1:51:54 PM)

Here is the gravamen of why it doesn't work at all.

Upon the cross, he turned to the thief and said, "Today you will be with me in paradise".
Whereupon he laid three days in the grave.

I understand time is not constant, but ..........



crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:04:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Sure you are, when you stop people from living in a manner that Jesus recommends.


So... is it just the life that Jesus recommends that you seek special protection for?

Do other religious beliefs not count?

I am assuming that you're keen to allow people to ignore any anti discrimination laws if they go against Jesus's commands?

What other laws would you allow people to break because its "whut Jesus would do?"




crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:10:30 PM)

bingo



mnottertail -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:19:10 PM)

Well, of the 48000 texts pored over by the council of Nicea, the only way that gods word became infallable, was they left his wife out of it.

among other things, reincarnation (a christian belief) among others.



Kirata -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:40:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

quote:

“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” — Matthew 5:18-19

“It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place.” (Matthew 5:17)

“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)


So I am wondering how many of those people who claim to be Christians do eat pork, shellfish, wear mixed fiber and all that, because they should all be stoned to death for it, because Jesus claimed he wants to uphold the old laws...

He is talking about the Ten Commandments, not the laws of Leviticus.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. ~Matthew 22:36-38

I don't think that you can draw that conclusion from the text. While it's plain that JC was creating a new covenant, there are tons of references to the "law" and "the prophets". Very few would argue that Matt 5:7 was a reference to just the big ten.

Well that one excerpt wasn't the only supporting text that I posted (see here and here). Additionally, there are the two verses of Matthew that follow it:

And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. ~Matthew 22:39-40

Personally, I don't see how anyone can reconcile the above, or the teachings of Christ more broadly, with the barbaric nonsense we find in Leviticus.

K.



MrRodgers -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:57:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

Time is a constant.


No, it isn't, RO.

For you and Tkman, you are both right The difference is that clocks tick slower when they're deeper in the potential well. That is, a clock at the Earth's surface ticks 1.0000000003 times faster than one at the center.

Please you guys, let me know when that little really makes a difference.



MrRodgers -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 2:59:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, of the 48000 texts pored over by the council of Nicea, the only way that gods word became infallable, was they left his wife out of it.

among other things, reincarnation (a christian belief) among others.

Yea, I've been thinking about reincarnation and just how the fuck would anyone know. Now as for some...'god' I hope not.



MrRodgers -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 3:00:47 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Sure you are, when you stop people from living in a manner that Jesus recommends.


So... is it just the life that Jesus recommends that you seek special protection for?

Do other religious beliefs not count?

I am assuming that you're keen to allow people to ignore any anti discrimination laws if they go against Jesus's commands?

What other laws would you allow people to break because its "whut Jesus would do?"



Yea, I believe in the Buddhist gods, of which there are...none.



crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 3:30:38 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata
Personally, I don't see how anyone can reconcile the above, or the teachings of Christ more broadly, with the barbaric nonsense we find in Leviticus.

K.



Well, I agree that it's problematic. And, while I accept that the way in which most mainstream protestant religions interpret the NT, does a reasonable job of arguing Leviticus out of the equation - A nut job fundie could make a pretty sterling job of arguing it back in.

Setting my atheism aside, a non-literal interpretation of the NT can produce a pretty decent way to live a life. But I do struggle at times with the tendency of some modern Christians to pick and choose the OT bits they like, and simply discard the bits they don't.



crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 3:33:34 PM)

It makes quite the difference if you're planning on visiting other Solar systems.

And the pivotal difference it makes is that a person can't say time is a constant when it is out by a factor of as much as 1.0000000003 over such a pitifully small distance as that between the surface and the centre of the earth.




Kirata -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 3:38:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Personally, I don't see how anyone can reconcile the above, or the teachings of Christ more broadly, with the barbaric nonsense we find in Leviticus.

Well, I agree that it's problematic. And, while I accept that the way in which most mainstream protestant religions interpret the NT, does a reasonable job of arguing Leviticus out of the equation - A nut job fundie could make a pretty sterling job of arguing it back in.

Setting my atheism aside, a non-literal interpretation of the NT can produce a pretty decent way to live a life. But I do struggle at times with the tendency of some modern Christians to pick and choose the OT bits they like, and simply discard the bits they don't.

All religion is symbolic, and symbolism is excluded from religion only when religion itself perishes. ~Radhakrishnan

K.



vincentML -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 3:56:49 PM)

quote:

All religion is symbolic, and symbolism is excluded from religion only when religion itself perishes. ~Radhakrishnan


But not all symbolism is religious. So, would we miss very much if religion disappeared? I would not feel lonely for its absence.



Real0ne -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:08:14 PM)

To the geniuses:

So while cesium may be very stable and provide better accuracy suffering less interference from external forces than other methods of 'cycle counting' it is not infallible nor is it perfect.

Hell with the genuis logic seen on this board, I can make time stop completely simply by putting a magnet by the a damn 1950's watch.

tards dont know the difference between mechanical errors of the device and slowing of time.

The only thing they proved is that we dont know how to make a fucking properly functioning clock.

[image]http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y410/mypbemotes/misc/asshand/platter_zpsmqwkq68y.jpg[/image]


Like the magnet example the time only changes because of external interference with the devices operation, [as I said initially] not because the unit we know as 'time' magically gets a some different interval assigned to it, tards be a tardin.






Dvr22999874 -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:10:31 PM)

I'm not religious, but nor am I atheist or agnostic. I really just don't give a fuck as long as I am left alone within the contexts of religions or non-religions. Maybe I can start my own 'Non-Religious Religion'.........................the Church of DGAFF



thompsonx -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:16:40 PM)


ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Here is the gravamen of why it doesn't work at all.

Upon the cross, he turned to the thief and said, "Today you will be with me in paradise".
Whereupon he laid three days in the grave.

I understand time is not constant, but ..........

Tom robbins argues that he is still there in "another roadside attraction"



Real0ne -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:17:28 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

Sure you are, when you stop people from living in a manner that Jesus recommends.


So... is it just the life that Jesus recommends that you seek special protection for?

Do other religious beliefs not count?

I am assuming that you're keen to allow people to ignore any anti discrimination laws if they go against Jesus's commands?

What other laws would you allow people to break because its "whut Jesus would do?"





Hah,

I am all for jewish sign houses not to discriminate against nazis who want them to make signs saying jews suck hiel hitler LMAO

That discrimination knife cuts both ways.



crazyml -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:49:47 PM)

You should publish a paper explaining how you refute the theory of relativity. You'll either get a prize of some sort... or enable a wider audience to experience your drooling nonsense.

I wonder which outcome is more likely... perhaps we should do a poll?



Lucylastic -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 4:54:27 PM)

Ffs dont encourage it.



Real0ne -> RE: Fatal Flaws in Religion versus Genetic/historic/scientific fact. (12/30/2015 5:00:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: crazyml

You should publish a paper explaining how you refute the theory of relativity. You'll either get a prize of some sort... or enable a wider audience to experience your drooling nonsense.

I wonder which outcome is more likely... perhaps we should do a poll?


How do you think clock error resulting from external influences somehow disputes relativity? That sounds pretty nutty to me but I am wiling to at least hear you out.

After all I have stated many ways to stop time entirely, even a big fucking hammer works. Thats an external influence too. LMFAO

A poll of science illiterates? To prove how fucked up modern education is? A 'political' vote maybe? you real man?

What do you want me to belive next time travel? lol



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