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RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 10:28:40 AM

shiftyw

Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant

Okay, shifty, here's the best example I can give you.

My mother loves to cause discontent. Now, she was pretty sick for a long time so she lived with me... ruff stuff to say the least. Every time she was in the kitchen I'd have to come in and take the stuff she was cutting off the DAMN plate and put it on a cutting board. This all started with "hey, I have a number of cutting boards, by all means, use all of them you want to." Nope, she knew that misusing my cutlery irked me so she did it Every. Single. Time.

The first time she was cutting on a plate she "wasn't doing it right". I gave her a cutting board, showed her where they all live and that was that. About the 7th time I had to put a cutting board under the knife she went past "not right" straight to "WRONG". It was deliberate, it was intentional, and she got some kind of sick joy of me sharping my knives Every Damn Day rather than once a week.

Now, it wasn't exclusively my cutlery, it was every thing that irritated me became a daily ritual. After recovery from her final surgery, I packed the truck, poked her in her car, and took her home.

I would NEVER date someone like that. Like thats family- so thats so different to me- and she'd had surgery- so like...to me...I'd get irritated- but you can't pick your relatives can you?

You can pick your partner though. Why would you date someone who WANTS to cause problems? Who does that shit intentionally?

I don't think anyone should break up over cutlery.
I do think people should break up when they start trying to get under one another skin and emotionally manipulate someone.

I mean- fuck- if Channing Tatum came in here and left all the cabinet doors open just to get under my skin- I'd kick him to the curb.

If he did it out of mistake a couple times- I'll just say "Hey don't do that" and he will stop doing that. If I say "I really prefer you do that without your shirt on" and he doesn't want to do that- and its a need for me- maybe we shouldn't be together? You know?

(in reply to ExiledTyrant)

Post #: 61

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 10:32:08 AM

Awareness

Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw
I don't think anyone should break up over cutlery.

What about crockery? Or even broader, what about pottery in general?

_____________________________

Ever notice how fucking annoying most signatures are? - Yes, I do appreciate the irony.

(in reply to shiftyw)

Post #: 62

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 10:35:51 AM

shiftyw

Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline

Yah...so...nevermind guys.

Continue on- Awareness wins. Hooray- I'll leave the thread!

(in reply to Awareness)

Post #: 63

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 10:40:16 AM

Awareness

Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
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Wait... don't go... how do you feel about cast-iron cookware? Come back!

_____________________________

Ever notice how fucking annoying most signatures are? - Yes, I do appreciate the irony.

(in reply to shiftyw)

Post #: 64

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 10:58:29 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw
I expect that ALL people in my house (except maybe kids- although I can count on one hand the times a kid has been in my living space) keep my furniture in the same condition...

like...to me that isn't D/s- thats just what you do when people paid good money for something and you didn't?
I don't like touch the man's xbox without asking- because he paid for it- not because I'm a sub?

We are about to get a puppy- and I know its going to chew some shit up- but I'm going to correct it- cause it doesn't have reasoning skills- this conversation to me, seems like...we're treating subs like they're puppies who need correction- rather than just a "This is how I prefer this is done."

If everyone is an adult- and fully understands what you're talking about- wouldn't everyone- in every (ETA: in every healthy *compatible*) relationship- come to some kind of compromise on these things?

ETA: *sidenote* you better believe because my name is on the mortgage of the house we are moving to- he can be a Dominant all he wants- but I'm getting final say on all the major things- and I might even be a bitch about it. He wants it to look like a frat house. I want it to look like its for adults. He's going to respect how I want it- cause I paid for it. Of course I'm going to listen to him and he has his own wants that I will meet. But in the end, its my money- and he respects that...

Is this not how these things work?

It's how it works in my house.

Anything financial, where MP and I are the names on the documents, that's pretty much how it goes.

BTW, I'm with you on the shower curtain liner.

MP and I are not D/s. When it comes to stuff like decorating the house, if it was important enough to compromise on (like the couch) we do that. Minor stuff like throw pillows, what color I want in the bathroom for towels, sheets, and all that, he doesn't care, so most of the time, I decide. "Does it make you happy?" "Yes, I like that." Where do the pictures go? How does the kitchen get set up? He doesn't care. Those are not his areas.

Now, ask me about his garage.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to shiftyw)

Post #: 65

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 11:19:28 AM

SinFix

Posts: 866
Joined: 4/1/2011
Status: offline

That makes much more sense to me now than how everything appeared to be worded in the OP..

Shifty, yeah I started these questions cause it sounded a lot like treating S like puppies...

(in reply to ExiledTyrant)

Post #: 66

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 11:28:44 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littleladybug
LOL, apparently "back to front" is a thing.

Yeah, that part is 'new' for me. I think it has to do with me having way more cabinet space in this house compared to the last.

quote:

Seriously though, doing something like I did with my prior partner is not something that I would do if I didn't absolutely know that they would take it in the manner in which it was intended. (That is, not to be an irritant, but to elicit a laugh or two.)

I try to do the same thing now with HM, but he's really not a quirky sort of guy. Shit, as long as the dishes get done and put away, all is good. He's actually the first person I've ever met who has absolutely no preference as to "up or down" with the toilet paper roll. He's given me absolutely no material!

Believe it or not, the toilet paper person in this house.... Is MP.

Me? I don't care. Toilet paper is available. It's within reach. On the hanger. Not on the hanger. The cat hasn't decided that it's a toy and it's been unrolled all over the house. I'm not drip drying. I'm good.

On the other hand, MP has to have the serious toilet paper stash. It has to be the "right" kind of toilet paper. I think he's physically incapable of buying a four pack. If he could, he'd probably buy the entire pallet and bring it home. Must be on the hanger and go over the top.

Needless to say, I find this to be exceptionally amusing. I laugh at him all of the time about what he thinks of as "toilet paper emergencies." Dear God! It's rolling under instead of over. Life as we know it has changed!

I never understood why it was "wrong" rather than "not right" until a bunch of us were joking around at work one day. My boss, of all people, enlightened me. You roll it over, instead of under, so you don't brush your hand on the wall behind the hanger.

I've been hanging toilet paper that way ever since.

quote:

With that said though, I do respect that people do have preferences in how they wish their homes to be managed. I have to be really close to someone before I push anything when it comes to that because, again, my goal is not to irritate, but instead to have someone laugh.

Trust me. I'm very easily entertained.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to littleladybug)

Post #: 67

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 11:32:10 AM

DeviantlyD

Posts: 4375
Joined: 5/26/2007
From: Hawai`i
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

Yah...so...nevermind guys.

Continue on- Awareness wins. Hooray- I'll leave the thread!

Here is my take on the OP's distinction between "not right" and "wrong".

"Not right" is sort of like "degrees of wrong" in a way.
"Not right" is equal to "this isn't the way I do/like/want/expect /pick-a-verb it but you don't know that so let me show you the right way." Continuing on the "not right" path is going to lead to "wrong". It may be there is only one "not right" before you get to "wrong", it depends on the situation and those involved. "Wrong" means you are already aware of the right way but you're choosing "wrong". And choosing "wrong" is likely going to lead to you no longer having any opportunity to get it "right".

I think the distinction between "not right" and "wrong" relies on the level of knowledge the person in question has. If they are completely unaware/unknowledgeable of the situation, then it's likely to be "not right". But if you're already aware and knowledgeable about the right way and you don't do it that way? Then you're "wrong".

There are, of course, exceptions to every rule. ;)

That's my interpretation anyhow. I hope it helps. It sounded better in my head. ;)

(Note: I hope there aren't any typos 'cause I'm typing this on my phone and....well I just hope there are no typos.)

_____________________________

ExiledTyrant's groupie. Catering to his ego since May 26, 2007. :D

(in reply to shiftyw)

Post #: 68

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 11:34:51 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SinFix
That makes much more sense to me now than how everything appeared to be worded in the OP..

Shifty, yeah I started these questions cause it sounded a lot like treating S like puppies...

Sorry. Still laughing at quirks. I have a weird sense of humor.

The first s that pees on my carpet is going to get a whole lot worse than a rolled up newspaper.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SinFix)

Post #: 69

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 2:25:40 PM

LilJuly76

Posts: 1245
Joined: 1/9/2016
Status: offline

cheesy stripper music

lada da de da da da.........

Oh wait I don't strip on cam

oh wait again I don't even have a cam

epic fail on me! what is my punishment?

I want chocolate!

(in reply to ExiledTyrant)

Post #: 70

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 2:32:09 PM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline

I guess with me if I understand the OP and the ponderously analytical, PHD thesis being typed out here, whether someone is not dominant or submissive enough is nipped in the bud right away. Things like actually being dominant and submissive enough are thus established right away without much fanfare. AND having resisted any exertion to romanticize the whole stage in a run at Shakespearian drama, at least sufficient enough to then with all of the basics determined...meet face to face. This has transpired sometimes over weeks or months of proving one's bone fides. But otherwise do feel that...Dominance and power are often wielded much more effectively when...not displayed.

Once there at my place, it's a tray tables must be up into the seat backs before take off kind of thing. Cutlery is dry in my hand and only then placed where they were designed to go. Dishwashers are loaded as per the manufacturer's instructions resulting in for example, highly stained coffee and tea cups coming out pristine.

Then she has become acutely aware that 'no that's not a gun in my pocket' I am in fact...glad to see her and we go from there.

Now dare I, still do hold the caveat, bathroom tissue my dear hanging off the bottom..is damn near a capital offense that will get you 50 (ok 20) lashes from my well worn dishrag that proudly devoted most of its threads, from a generation ago. My bathroom, my rules...so there !!

_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 71

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 3:04:17 PM

ExiledTyrant

Posts: 4547
Joined: 12/9/2013
From: Exiled
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LilJuly76

cheesy stripper music

lada da de da da da.........

Oh wait I don't strip on cam

oh wait again I don't even have a cam

epic fail on me! what is my punishment?

I want chocolate!

Oddly enough the punishment is chocolate. All your favorites, only the best of course, right at 40" away from every side of your cage.

_____________________________

Gnothi Seauton
To lead, first follow: Aurelius, Epictetus, Descartes, Sun Tzu, to name a few.

Semper fidelis (which sometimes feels like a burden)

(in reply to LilJuly76)

Post #: 72

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 3:07:10 PM

LilJuly76

Posts: 1245
Joined: 1/9/2016
Status: offline

oh crap I'm trying to lose more weight not gain it by eating chocolate. cage? Oh man that bites the big one cages suck, my boobs get caught in between the bars.

(in reply to ExiledTyrant)

Post #: 73

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 3:24:35 PM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LilJuly76

oh crap I'm trying to lose more weight not gain it by eating chocolate. cage? Oh man that bites the big one cages suck, my boobs get caught in between the bars.

.....and here I always thought that was part of the p l e a s u r e !!

_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to LilJuly76)

Post #: 74

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 6:16:06 PM

satanscharmer

Posts: 376
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

The first s that pees on my carpet is going to get a whole lot worse than a rolled up newspaper.

I'm not sure where you exactly stand on the issue.

For some people in the audience, this may sound tempting.

Careful what you promise.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 75

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/2/2016 6:44:51 PM

WinsomeDefiance

Posts: 6719
Joined: 8/7/2007
Status: offline

Continued defiance is disrespect. When I first moved in with a friend, I bought $900.00 in groceries for the household.
It was a large household with other roomies. We were throwing a play party and I was going to make biscuits and gravy in the morning for those staying over. I wrote on a gallon of milk "Do not drink...I need this for a party."

They drank the freaking milk. I bought another gallon and against wrote on the carton..."Do not Drink."

The selfish MF'ers drank that gallon too. I boxed up every single last bit of groceries and even vaccummed the cupboards of every last single grain of rice and told the little shits I'd give the food to a food pantry before I let them disrespect me like that or eat another damn thing I'd paid for.

Kay knows I love my cast iron. I have a specific way it gets washed and dried. She HATES the cast iron, but she respects my wishes and washes them the way I want. I know she hates washing them, and even though dishes are her responsibility, I'll often wash them after cooking in them so she doesn't have to. It's mutual respect and mutual consideration.

(in reply to satanscharmer)

Post #: 76

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/3/2016 4:49:56 AM

longwayhome

Posts: 1035
Joined: 1/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance

Continued defiance is disrespect.

I agree.

Although we have used lots of words in this thread, we all know the difference between a) openly defying someone to wind them up, b) doing things which piss them off because you don't care and c) just doing things differently to them because we are all different.

We can all be laid back and cool, until someone yanks our chain by repeatedly doing something that matters to us and costs them very little to do in the way we request. The milk example above is an excellent one.

Sometimes it is just about one partner being a bit up tight and needing to relax because something really doesn't matter that much. Sometimes however it is lack of care for another human being or deliberately giving someone the finger deliberately, albeit in a passive aggressive way, by doing something to upset them, (e.g. making the knives blunt by not using a chopping board, eating food you need for later, always peeing on the toilet seat and not cleaning it etc.).

I very rarely do anything knowingly disrespectful to anyone, and even more rarely do I deliberately piss them off, but we all know it happens. And it doesn't matter how laid back you are, someone giving you the message that you don't matter to them, will eventually get your back up.

I'm with the mutual respect and consideration all the way.

This is intimated intertwined with BDSM because it relates directly to power, compliance, consideration and respect. How you fit these issues into your own dynamic is the very stuff of working out how to relate to each other.

It also is an issue in everyday life.

There is always the danger that, if you are laid back, considerate and open-minded, people just take the piss. I am wired to be respectful, considerate and make others happy. Unfortunately kindness and consideration don't get you very far in lots of situations, so I spend more time and effort than I would like asserting my authority and ensuring I am respected (e.g. at work).

I can do this perfectly well but it will always makes me feel a bit uncomfortable as it is not my preference, and deep down I expect different behaviour from my fellow human beings.

(in reply to WinsomeDefiance)

Post #: 77

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/3/2016 4:52:19 AM

LilJuly76

Posts: 1245
Joined: 1/9/2016
Status: offline

to the Dominant yup

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 78

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/3/2016 5:00:15 AM

Greta75

Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline

I have actually never experienced living with a man in my life where we had household issues over like crockeries, cutlery, toilet seats, I don't know, basically, somehow, the guys I connect with, when we move together and live together, usually no conflict on these sorts of things, the living together part is always easy.

Perhaps, all the men I've been with have been easy going and just leave household decisions to me, and don't interfere or feedback anything. And they didn't have any weird habits that annoyed me. My biggest conflict when I start getting unhappy is just lack of sex. But of course, my requirement for sex is excessive for most men.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 3/3/2016 5:03:24 AM >

(in reply to LilJuly76)

Post #: 79

RE: Wrong Vs. Not right - 3/3/2016 5:37:14 AM

longwayhome

Posts: 1035
Joined: 1/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: littleladybug

My prior dominant partner and I had a running battle over the "proper way" of loading the dishwasher. I loaded the glasses from the front to the back, and he insisted that they be loaded from the back to the front. I indulged many of his quirks, but not this one. Over the course of several years, it became a joke between us. I'd open the dishwasher to find that the glasses had been moved to the back and, on occasion, would hear him swearing in the kitchen when he opened the dishwasher.

Part of my responsibility as his submissive was to not let him take things too seriously. Some might view the dishwasher issue as "disrespectful" or "not something that a submissive would do", but it worked for us. We had some really good laughs over it over the years.

I would never be with someone who couldn't look at their own quirks and have a laugh about them.

(Edited)

I could not agree more with you point you made in your quote about laughing at quirks and peculiarities. From this point of view I am no fan of being hide-bound by BDSM conventions about how a D or s are supposed to act.

In our own relationships however we all know the difference between good natured humour and taking the piss. I like to arrange my clothes a certain way which has always been a source of great humour. Unfortunately, in common with many other people, I have also come across people who have gone out of their way to do things to disrespect and wind me up.

This can certainly start off as a "laugh", but we all know there's a difference between a laugh and a "laugh". Sometimes if we are particularly sensitive the line might be a bit blurry, but most of us understand what is a joke and what is designed to disrespect or belittle us.

Getting the balance right in any relationship certainly involves both mutual respect and humour. However, despite the best sense of humour (or how many things we compromise on or give way to) there are sometimes differences we cannot negotiate away. And whether or not those differences are particularly serious, there may also be behaviours that make sure those differences are used in unproductive, or even downright unpleasant ways.

Just like consent, respect is one of those carefully negotiated aspects of a BDSM relationship; the BDSM bit just adds a little extra flavour (compared to a vanilla relationship). With the right person and the right match, it can be almost effortless and full of fun. With the wrong person (or if you yourself have very specific needs) it can be painful and full of detailed discussions about limits, unproductive behaviours and bottom lines.

The trick is to understand how serious and negotiable any difference is, and at what point the other person is on the tosser spectrum, in terms of sorting that shit out.

From that point of view, I am completely with you when you say that you "would never be with someone who couldn't look at their own quirks and have a laugh about them".

(in reply to littleladybug)

Post #: 80

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