quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cinnamongirl67

Listen moron you don't fuck with farmers.
I know a lot about them.
Crops soar, crops completely fail. They depend on rain, soil, sun, frost, drought. Fields are planted over and over again, rotated, but need fertilizer to keep producing over time, which field soil needs rest.
Farmers face all elements of nature. Our government is smart and rebuilds depleted places. Farmers receive help to feed the world. Very few, I mean very few farmers are rich.
No food, you die or sure you can grow hemp. It makes great rope.

I don't care. Other industries as I wrote, have risks. If they can make money in farming, fine, if not, get out of farming. There will be food as there is universal demand for it and somebody will grow/make it. Plus, many of the problems you mentioned are exacerbated by subsidies often in attempts to gain more.

[They] also pick winners and losers which is something always subject to politics that often hurts other agriculture efforts. Why are we paying subsidies for tobacco and cotton and ethanol a complete scam ? There is no other reason but to get that vote.

Oh and hemp would make a whole lot more than rope if given the green light.

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Just sucking up the dollars

We need smaller government. Let the market decide. Why should we support these leeches?

Your thoughts?

quote:

ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance
Ok, I planted them too soon then. Even in doors, it was still chilly by the window. I'll replant and place in a warmer, sunnier spot. Thanks :)
There is no sun in michigan until after mother's day. Even those bright street lights won't allow for the germination of seeds.[:(]

Ohh so sad and oh so true. This will be my first year trying to grow a small vegetable garden that isn't comprised of a few potted tomatoes. The tomato, & cucumber seeds sprouted just fine inside but the bell peppers have twice tried to sprout but never fully grew.
As for subsidized farming, if the government broadened the choices of crops that could be grown besides depending so much on corn it might help balance things better.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Just sucking up the dollars

We need smaller government. Let the market decide. Why should we support these leeches?

Your thoughts?

well,.. according to various articles, US ag subsidies & US dumping cheap corn, grains, meat, etc in Latin America is responsible for much of that illegal immigration y'all bitch so damn f'n much about.. y'all put Mexican farmers outta business so they came north just to survive.. Personally, I think the Mexican farmers & the Mexican govt should sue the US for damage done by their ag subsidies.. I mean, y'all were selling it at prices lower than they could produce it in Mexico, how sleazy is that? its totally disgusting..

"“An estimated 2.3 million people have left agriculture in a country desperate for livelihoods,” said Wise. The study estimated that the cost to Mexican producers was around $12.8 billion in the nine-year period, more than 10 percent of the U.S.-Mexico agricultural trade value annually.

The other cost, the one that we, north of the border pay, is the constant migration of these displaced rural workers into the United States."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/11/mexican-farmers-agricultural-subsidies_n_2457845.html

As far as the importation of food from other countries go, the biggest concern imo is that sleazy (mostly US) corps are selling their poison pesticides/chemicals which have been banned here in the US but not in other countries.. (Its bad enough that Monsanto et all are poisoning us with GMOS & cancer-linked herbicides but we dont need to import poisoned food from elsewhere too)... just sayin'

https://www.culturalsurvival.org/publications/cultural-survival-quarterly/cameroon/some-pesticides-use-around-world

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

In each year from 2006 to 2012, at least two-thirds of all active corporations had no federal income tax liability. Larger corporations were more likely to owe tax. Among large corporations (generally those with at least $10 million in assets) less than half—42.3 percent—paid no federal income tax in 2012. Of those large corporations whose financial statements reported a profit, 19.5 percent paid no federal income tax that year. Reasons why even profitable corporations may have paid no federal tax in a given year include the use of tax deductions for losses carried forward from prior years and tax incentives, such as depreciation allowances that are more generous in the federal tax code than those allowed for financial accounting purposes. Corporations that did have a federal corporate income tax liability for tax year 2012 owed $267.5 billion.

much much more at http://www.gao.gov/products/gao-16-363

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

But there is nothing in genetic modification of corn that poisons people.

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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Just sucking up the dollars

We need smaller government. Let the market decide. Why should we support these leeches?

Your thoughts?

well,.. according to various articles, US ag subsidies & US dumping cheap corn, grains, meat, etc in Latin America is responsible for much of that illegal immigration y'all bitch so damn f'n much about.. y'all put Mexican farmers outta business so they came north just to survive.. Personally, I think the Mexican farmers & the Mexican govt should sue the US for damage done by their ag subsidies.. I mean, y'all were selling it at prices lower than they could produce it in Mexico, how sleazy is that? its totally disgusting..

"“An estimated 2.3 million people have left agriculture in a country desperate for livelihoods,” said Wise. The study estimated that the cost to Mexican producers was around $12.8 billion in the nine-year period, more than 10 percent of the U.S.-Mexico agricultural trade value annually.

The other cost, the one that we, north of the border pay, is the constant migration of these displaced rural workers into the United States."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/11/mexican-farmers-agricultural-subsidies_n_2457845.html

As far as the importation of food from other countries go, the biggest concern imo is that sleazy (mostly US) corps are selling their poison pesticides/chemicals which have been banned here in the US but not in other countries.. (Its bad enough that Monsanto et all are poisoning us with GMOS & cancer-linked herbicides but we dont need to import poisoned food from elsewhere too)... just sayin'

https://www.culturalsurvival.org/publications/cultural-survival-quarterly/cameroon/some-pesticides-use-around-world

So, if you phrase this a little more equably - I actually agree with you.

Mexico had a long history of protecting small 10-20 acre farms. These farms represented poor ag practices, and poor use of human time and money.
When Nafta forced down the protectionist walls - one of the unintended consequences was the massive bankrupting of small inefficient farms.

In other words, market forces won out - as they always will.

As for GMO corn: I am utterly opposed to it. But there is nothing in genetic modification of corn that poisons people.
Far more troublesome is the use of glyphosphate to ensure even ripening - and which IS a poison.

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ORIGINAL: kdsub

Damn... we provide cheap food for people and you bitch about it... you realize how many people are alive today because of our free and low cost food... damn find some good in us now and then would ya.

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

In each year from 2006 to 2012, at least two-thirds of all active corporations had no federal income tax liability. Larger corporations were more likely to owe tax. Among large corporations (generally those with at least $10 million in assets) less than half—42.3 percent—paid no federal income tax in 2012. Of those large corporations whose financial statements reported a profit, 19.5 percent paid no federal income tax that year. Reasons why even profitable corporations may have paid no federal tax in a given year include the use of tax deductions for losses carried forward from prior years and tax incentives, such as depreciation allowances that are more generous in the federal tax code than those allowed for financial accounting purposes. Corporations that did have a federal corporate income tax liability for tax year 2012 owed $267.5 billion.

much much more at http://www.gao.gov/products/gao-16-363

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
As for GMO corn: I am utterly opposed to it. But there is nothing in genetic modification of corn that poisons people.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
Damn... we provide cheap food for people and you bitch about it... you realize how many people are alive today because of our free and low cost food... damn find some good in us now and then would ya.
Butch

Do you want to pay to feed the world forever??? Your govt does more harm than good.. your US govt aid programs are designed to do exactly that, to destroy local production/competition to create a new market for your largest greediest corps... if your govt and Big Ag and Monsanto didnt put small farms out of business in other countries you wouldnt have to give aid that to the extent you do now.. but that "free" US food comes with nasty strings.. your govt doesnt give anything for free without getting a lot in return.. and it builds new markets for US Big Ag & Monsanto..
"Donor countries often fail to pledge enough food aid and they deliver aid late and unevenly. Food aid can also undermine local agricultural production in recipient countries and threaten long-term food security. In fact, some donor countries have designed food aid programs that primarily promote their own domestic interests, rather than helping the hungry. For example, legislators set up the US food aid program to expand markets for US exports and dispose of agricultural surpluses generated by domestic farm subsidies."
https://www.globalpolicy.org/world-hunger/46251-food-aid-for-the-hungry.html

"Donor countries often fail to pledge enough food aid."

"Food aid can undermine local ag production in recipient countries..."

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
What, then, is the solution? Do we stop giving aid and stop harming local ag production? Or, do we do the opposite and give more food aid and harm local ag production?

Isn't that sorta like biting the hand that feeds you?