RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs

RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (Full Version)

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PeonForHer -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/17/2016 2:18:00 PM)
quote: Yep. We've had our share of looney Right blathering know-all soi-disant experts on all things who very quickly reveal themselves to know not very much at all. Hunter CA springs to mind though there have been a few others. Their only saving grace is that they tend to disappear once they realise that people have worked them out and ceased listening to them. To be honest, I'm tired of the 'wit-and-cleverness' of it all. I don't give a flying fuck about monumentally egotistical windbags who insist that they're massively more brainy than everyone else, and nor do I give a toss about the sort of plonker who has a deep down belief that he just must be right a) because he's male and b) because he identifies as dominant and can't handle a world in which a submale or, worse (?), a female, have made him look like a tit. I mark thousands of essays per year of candidates in exams who've said the sort of stuff that's been said here. It fails, because it's fail-quality, and that is that. There really, really is no alternative to going away and learning.

Nnanji -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/17/2016 2:30:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: Yep. We've had our share of looney Right blathering know-all soi-disant experts on all things who very quickly reveal themselves to know not very much at all. Hunter CA springs to mind though there have been a few others. Their only saving grace is that they tend to disappear once they realise that people have worked them out and ceased listening to them. To be honest, I'm tired of the 'wit-and-cleverness' of it all. I don't give a flying fuck about monumentally egotistical windbags who insist that they're massively more brainy than everyone else, and nor do I give a toss about the sort of plonker who has a deep, down belief that he just must be right a) because he's male and b) because he identifies as dominant and can't handle a world in which a submale or, worse (?), a female, have made him look like a tit. I mark thousands of essays per year of candidates in exams who've said the sort of stuff that's been said here. It fails, because it's fail-quality, and that is that. *There really, really is no alternative to going away and learning.* I had that argument with various people in my profession from time to time. In the old days, when I started my professions, it was possible to work into it. Now, you pretty much have to have at least a bachelor degree. When I started some of the old guys without degrees argued nothing beat experience. It really wasn't until I had a lot of experience that I could argue the notion. I've seen some very inflexible people with a lot of experience, the same experience over and over. I've seen some real eggheads with Phd's that couldn't produce a product in their field to save their life. I think, in the end, it's the person. But, regardless, some education is always required, even if it's an apprenticeship in a profession. Also, in the end, everything must be practiced to develop a proficiency.

sloguy02246 -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/17/2016 4:15:59 PM)
FR - For what it's worth (and these are not my words): Experience is still the best teacher because unlike classroom learning, with experience the test always comes first and then the lesson comes afterward.

tweakabelle -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 3:03:37 AM)
Experience may well be the best teacher when it comes to say carpentry or something like that. But what we are talking about here are things like the meanings of well known political terms such as feminism and fascism. We have some morons insisting that their personal (and ignorant) opinions on what these terms mean are correct and that all other views, including standardised dictionary meanings accepted by virtually everyone else, are incorrect. It then turns out that these people have little or no knowledge of the field to back up their bluster. In other words they are trying to force their ill-informed and ill-conceived, often ridiculously stupid opinions on everyone else. They are ignorant bullies pretending to be knowledgeable, who are only interested in ventilating their own pathetic hates. They offer nothing positive to the conversation.

WhoreMods -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 4:47:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sloguy02246 FR - For what it's worth (and these are not my words): Experience is still the best teacher because unlike classroom learning, with experience the test always comes first and then the lesson comes afterward. Of course, one of the things that distinguishes us from every other animal on earth is that we're capable of learning from other people's experiences, as well as our own. Strange how some find that concept so offensive, isn't it?

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:15:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness For fuck's sake, bitch - I'm a man. Try acting like one instead of a whiney little bitch, then. Hush, little one - men talking. Really? Because that sounds like a bitch talking to me. You leave Peon alone. He can't help the way he is.

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:17:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness Christ Peon, you are such a fucking girl. [:D] What can I say, A? When I'm naked and look down, I see a penis, so I'm persuaded I'm male. When was the last time you could do that? [;)] And yet, despite all that, you still behave like a girl. Christ, and you wonder why submissive men are regarded with contempt.

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:22:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nnanji I've seen some very inflexible people with a lot of experience, the same experience over and over. I've seen some real eggheads with Phd's that couldn't produce a product in their field to save their life. I think, in the end, it's the person. But, regardless, some education is always required, even if it's an apprenticeship in a profession. Also, in the end, everything must be practiced to develop a proficiency. Proficiency is an aspect of ongoing and continual employment of a skillset. This is the kind of thing you're only going to find in a STEM degree. Arts degrees generally don't have any proficiency associated with them, particularly - as Peon has ably demonstrated - when their focus is upon rote memorisation and regurgitation, rather than the acquisition of tools and techniques which can be practiced, honed and utilised to good effect.

WhoreMods -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:23:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness For fuck's sake, bitch - I'm a man. Try acting like one instead of a whiney little bitch, then. Hush, little one - men talking. Really? Because that sounds like a bitch talking to me. You leave Peon alone. He can't help the way he is. He's not the bitch here, you whining little sissy.

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:24:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer I mark thousands of essays per year of candidates in exams who've said the sort of stuff that's been said here. It fails, because it's fail-quality, and that is that. There really, really is no alternative to going away and learning. Oh don't be fucking ludicrous. You're failing people for not subscribing to the prevailing academic orthodoxy - nothing more. Good grief - you really are hopelessly mired in an astonishingly backward world-view.

WhoreMods -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 9:27:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness Good grief - you really are hopelessly mired in an astonishingly backward world-view. [img]https://trinitycomics.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/irony.jpg[/img]

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 10:15:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness Good grief - you really are hopelessly mired in an astonishingly backward world-view. [img]https://trinitycomics.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/irony.jpg[/img] Speaking of which, why the fuck aren't you back in the kitchen?

WhoreMods -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 11:43:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness Good grief - you really are hopelessly mired in an astonishingly backward world-view. [img]https://trinitycomics.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/irony.jpg[/img] Speaking of which, why the fuck aren't you back in the kitchen? Because I'm not a "real man" like yourself who likes to do the dishes while crossdressed as a maid and lick his lips thinking about his boyfriend's cock.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 3:35:50 PM)
Oh dear.

Nnanji -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/18/2016 10:27:33 PM)
Concur

tweakabelle -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/19/2016 7:55:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer I mark thousands of essays per year of candidates in exams who've said the sort of stuff that's been said here. It fails, because it's fail-quality, and that is that. There really, really is no alternative to going away and learning. Oh don't be fucking ludicrous. You're failing people for not subscribing to the prevailing academic orthodoxy - nothing more. Good grief - you really are hopelessly mired in an astonishingly backward world-view. Once again you are being dogmatic and categorical on a topic that you seem to know very little about. Why am I not surprised? If an exam question is "define and discuss 'feminism' ", or "define and discuss 'fascism' " and the candidate's response was along the lines you and RM have consistently advanced here, then no responsible examiner would have any option other than to mark the paper as a "FAIL". It is not a matter of "prevailing academic orthodoxy" as you wrongly assert, it is a simple matter of accuracy, appalling content and maintaining academic standards. However, if someone had problems with the standard definitions of 'feminism' or 'fascism', the proper course of action open to them is to post the standard definition, and then post a grounded argument detailing why the candidate feels that definition is inaccurate. If their argument is solid and rational, then their paper will be marked appropriately. My students are encouraged to challenge orthodoxies and advised they will be marked on the strength of the paper they present not its political bias or lack thereof. This is what really happens in academia, not your gutter press-level (mis-)understanding of it.

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/19/2016 3:03:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WhoreMods Because I'm not a "real man" like yourself who likes to do the dishes while crossdressed as a maid and lick his lips thinking about his boyfriend's cock. So basically, you hate gay people. C'mon, let it all out.

Awareness -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/19/2016 3:10:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tweakabelle Once again you are being dogmatic and categorical on a topic that you seem to know very little about. Why am I not surprised? If an exam question is "define and discuss 'feminism' ", or "define and discuss 'fascism' " and the candidate's response was along the lines you and RM have consistently advanced here, then no responsible examiner would have any option other than to mark the paper as a "FAIL". It is not a matter of "prevailing academic orthodoxy" as you wrongly assert, it is a simple matter of accuracy, appalling content and maintaining academic standards. So you're expecting me to believe that a PolSci degree is going to ask questions about dictionary definitions? Do we have that clear? Because that sounds like a pretty fucking useless education. quote: However, if someone had problems with the standard definitions of 'feminism' or 'fascism', the proper course of action open to them is to post the standard definition, and then post a grounded argument detailing why the candidate feels that definition is inaccurate. If their argument is solid and rational, then their paper will be marked appropriately. My students are encouraged to challenge orthodoxies and advised they will be marked on the strength of the paper they present not its political bias or lack thereof. This is what really happens in academia, not your gutter press-level (mis-)understanding of it. Bollocks. Peon has repeatedly demonstrated an inability to advance an argument which isn't based on either the True Scotsman fallacy or an appeal to authority. If this is the academic standard to which you're referring, then it's a pretty fucking dire one. The idea that you have students is phenomenally fucking amusing.

littleclip -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/19/2016 3:40:51 PM)
in college the clubs can be anything they like i was in student gov and we found we could not have the clubs be exclusionary to anyone. so the harvard clubs can be whatever they like but has to accept all members. for example the lgbt clubs can not restrict to only lgbt members has to accept any who apply no matter the orientation. its part of the rules for having a club on campus, so the order to have the all male clubs accept non male members is only following the rules. my personal opinion on the exclusionary clubs is it only promotes hate and discrimination instead of promoting acceptance and tolerance.

Aylee -> RE: Feminists Want Harvard’s All-Male Clubs Punished—But Not All-Women’s Clubs (5/19/2016 4:18:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: littleclip in college the clubs can be anything they like i was in student gov and we found we could not have the clubs be exclusionary to anyone. so the harvard clubs can be whatever they like but has to accept all members. for example the lgbt clubs can not restrict to only lgbt members has to accept any who apply no matter the orientation. its part of the rules for having a club on campus, so the order to have the all male clubs accept non male members is only following the rules. my personal opinion on the exclusionary clubs is it only promotes hate and discrimination instead of promoting acceptance and tolerance. These are clubs OFF campus that if students join they will be penalized ON campus. But. . . since you say that sex segregated groups promote hate and discrimination, are we opening football to the ladies and volleyball to the gentlemen?* Let's put men in the women's choir! De-segregate basket ball! *I have no idea what sports Harvard actually has.

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