Outdated Laws Should Expire (Full Version)

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Termyn8or -> Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/23/2016 4:46:52 PM)

I just brought this up because my sister has to get rid of a refrigerator, but I have thought of it before. As you know kids used to climb into refrigerators and close the door, those doors had latches on them and would not open from the inside and kids died. So they said you have to take the door off when you throw it out. Well now they all use embedded magnets in the seal so itt is easy to push the door open from the inside. Of course with the gross neglect today some kids might not realize the have to breathe and just stay in there.

But I reminded that one state had anti-Gay laws as late as a couple of years ago and actually had sting operations with undercover officers busting people for it. People were up in arms about Russia's law, which only says you cannot promote homosexuality to minors. I guess the won't be watching Sesame Street over there not that Bert and Ernie are more than just roomies.

There are laws against sodomy, and no exclusion for your Wife, if she happens to be willing. Laws against French kissing. Laws that say it is only legal to beat your Wife on Sunday.

So anyway, it should be that all laws expire in say, six years. Make these fucking legislators WORK. I mean even murder. The declaration says you have the right to life, but it is congress which determines the punishment for those who take that right from others. So some people want the death penalty and others don't. Well the legislators should represent you every six years or whatever whne they rewrite the law against murder.

The PATRIOT ACT had a built in expiration date. But they renewed it. Now it falls on them, not just the peope who passed it the first time.

There is a joke floating around on the internet something like "Number of words in the Ten Commandments, number of words in the Bill of rights, number of words in the regulations regarding the sale of a head of cabbage".

Make them rewrite that shit every six years and I bet it gets trimmed to the point we can understand it. There are times when you are in court and can go up to the judge with the exact text of the law and ask "Just what the fuck does this mean ?" and he cannot tell you. And he is supposed to make a decision that greatly affects your future based on a law he does not understand ?

Sounds like congress with this "We have to pass it to see what's in it" bullshit. There should have been riots. In fact when they made keeping gold illegal there should have been riots. In fact Women went out in the streets protesting the US' involvement in WW2, know what happened to them ? They got thrown in jail. But the laws under which they were incarcerated still exist today.

As does the Alien And Sedition Act. That got passed when the ink on the Constitution was not even dry.

So I propose that laws, ALL LAWS expire in say six years. That way congress has to maintain law and order otherwise theft and murder become legal, and they will not have time to fuck up more things.

What's more, each bill/law is ONE page. Single spaced with 12 point bold text. That is all you get. If ignorance of the law is no excuse then make the law understandable, instead of referring to page 1,247 for an exclusion or some shit. If ignorance of the law is no excuse, what does that mean ? We all need a law degree to walk down the street ? We all need law degrees like Obama who has no fucking idea of the spirit and/or intent of the Constitution ?

And this election. I bet neither candidate has ever read the Constitution that they will swear to uphold. And congress, how come it is OK to bribe them ? You bribe a city inspector they go to jail. (if they get caught) How is it that it is OK to bribe congress ? What the fuck ?

T^T




CarpeComa -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/23/2016 4:59:10 PM)

Six years is way too short, but I do generally agree that sunset provisions should be automatic. I would probably expect more on the order of 15 to 25 years for a statute and 50 years for a constitutional amendment (for amendments 11+). Agency regs should never carry the force of law without a vote for ratification. I am also keen on the idea of a maximum amount of law, such as the Federal level gets no more than 1,000 pages (with specifics on typeface, page size, etc). If ignorance of the law is no excuse, it isn't a just system if knowing the laws one is subject to is nigh impossible.




Edwird -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 5:08:39 AM)

I agree with the overall spirit of the OP in eliminating outdated laws, but they never seem to do that.

It's popped into my head before that there should be a rule that no new law can get passed before eliminating five old useless laws. Even then it might take ten years.

But I have to say; if I were a female, I think my nipples would get elongated if driving a car in California with my bathrobe on, exactly because the law against a woman driving a car while wearing a bathrobe is still on the books in California.




MrRodgers -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 5:38:59 AM)

Well I think you still are not allowed to fall asleep in your bathtub in Michigan. So be careful when going through the water, winter...wonderland.




RottenJohnny -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 7:05:12 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Well I think you still are not allowed to fall asleep in your bathtub in Michigan.

Only if you have a pet badger.




DesideriScuri -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 7:55:01 AM)

http://www.dumblaws.com/

What's truly worse about some of these laws, is that there was, at some point in time, a good reason to pass the laws. It's sorta like the stupid warning labels that are required nowadays.

http://www.forbes.com/2011/02/23/dumbest-warning-labels-entrepreneurs-sales-marketing-warning-labels_slide.html




ifmaz -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 9:16:40 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
...
What's more, each bill/law is ONE page. Single spaced with 12 point bold text. That is all you get. If ignorance of the law is no excuse then make the law understandable, instead of referring to page 1,247 for an exclusion or some shit. If ignorance of the law is no excuse, what does that mean ? We all need a law degree to walk down the street ? We all need law degrees like Obama who has no fucking idea of the spirit and/or intent of the Constitution ?


Even better, read the bills aloud in Congress before they are allowed to be voted on.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
And this election. I bet neither candidate has ever read the Constitution that they will swear to uphold. And congress, how come it is OK to bribe them ? You bribe a city inspector they go to jail. (if they get caught) How is it that it is OK to bribe congress ? What the fuck ?

T^T


You act as if there are only two candidates.




WickedsDesire -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 11:06:47 AM)

good points are good points residentevil - I will need to think about that one..are threats free speech? I will expand later.

The amendment as adopted in 1791 reads as follows:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[1] as a rough guide only

So, say I hate gays, or straight people, or Muslims or Christians or shifty looking darkies who should be shot on site by our death squads ( I fuking hate tomatoes and eggs myself) - for my mind is wired exactly that way and that is what I firmly believe.

Saying I hate tomatoes(raw) is free speech and I do so loathe them and death too all raw tomatoes. One is free speech the other is a threat, I think their is a clear distinction.

I think it can and should exist, even the guff that abhors my mind.

No two humans are the same and I am a twin so I accept all of us are different, and minds...sure there is upbringing, conditioning, what the mind absorbs in its lifetime - and I usually fall back on the word rainbow (its a good word), or electromagnetic spectrum for I believe it simply better by a huge margin.


At the moment we have:
Yes 8 people
No 7 people
Yes 7 but with conditions


Anyone care to change there minds? and why? I am still firmly yes....yes it took me a few years t come to that conclusion. previously I thought yes but with conditions




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 11:46:55 AM)

I also agree that all laws should have a sunset expiry date.
6 years is a bit short; maybe 10 or 15??
That directive should include everything on the constitution too!

What they also need to fix is the stupid two-tier law structure that you have.
One set of laws for the state and another set for the federal system.
WTF is that all about?? Just plain stupid and confusing.
Abolish all state laws and have a single set of laws that cover every state from coast to coast.
That would avoid all confusion - same laws no matter where you are in the US.
It would stop states trying to get around federal laws by making up their own.
If state laws were abolished, they would have no powers to make 'state' laws.


But.... nobody has the balls to make such radical changes in the US. Nobody.
Even if you found someone with enough gall, the senate or congress would stall it and kick it down the road forever more... for decades.




BamaD -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 12:37:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

I also agree that all laws should have a sunset expiry date.
6 years is a bit short; maybe 10 or 15??
That directive should include everything on the constitution too!

What they also need to fix is the stupid two-tier law structure that you have.
One set of laws for the state and another set for the federal system.
WTF is that all about?? Just plain stupid and confusing.
Abolish all state laws and have a single set of laws that cover every state from coast to coast.
That would avoid all confusion - same laws no matter where you are in the US.
It would stop states trying to get around federal laws by making up their own.
If state laws were abolished, they would have no powers to make 'state' laws.


But.... nobody has the balls to make such radical changes in the US. Nobody.
Even if you found someone with enough gall, the senate or congress would stall it and kick it down the road forever more... for decades.


This post only demonstrates that you do not understand Federalism.
To do this they would have to repeal the Constitution.
Maybe while they are at it they could apply for out colonial status to be re-instated.




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 2:21:14 PM)

I understand federalism quite well.
What I'm saying is that it doesn't work very well in the USA.




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 2:24:01 PM)

And as I said in that post - the constitution should be subject to sunset expiry too.




WickedsDesire -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 2:30:52 PM)

I am the last of my kind and in 12 teats n this site only one genuine soul mailed me




BamaD -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 2:31:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

I understand federalism quite well.
What I'm saying is that it doesn't work very well in the USA.

Then what is the crap about nobody having the "balls" to, for all practicle purposes, aboboshing the states, rewritting the Constitution and forming a completely new form of government? You realize that you are advocating the overthrow of our government? As I said, you might as well ask us to apply to have our colonial status re-instated.
As far as ubderstanding the US it is abundently clear that you don't have a clue. But you are a superman who can hit a target further away that the air rifle you are using can travel.




ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 2:59:00 PM)

quote:

You realize that you are advocating the overthrow of our government?

So? It's not like he is the only one, I seem to recall Jefferson being in favour of doing so periodically.




Edwird -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 3:26:34 PM)


It's a different situation nowadays.

There weren't 320 million people and the largest economy in the world back then.

Let's overthrow the corporations first, which is actually what the colonists did.





BamaD -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 3:30:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

And as I said in that post - the constitution should be subject to sunset expiry too.


Which proves you don't understand the concept of a constitution either.




igor2003 -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 3:59:40 PM)

--FR--

Considering the extreme partisanship shown by congress, and the extreme lack of truly qualified people that have run for presidency the last few elections I can't think of anybody that could be trusted with changing laws every few years, and I especially wouldn't want them to get their hands on any part of the Constitution. Well, MAYBE some state laws could be changed at a state level.




BamaD -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 4:07:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

--FR--

Considering the extreme partisanship shown by congress, and the extreme lack of truly qualified people that have run for presidency the last few elections I can't think of anybody that could be trusted with changing laws every few years, and I especially wouldn't want them to get their hands on any part of the Constitution. Well, MAYBE some state laws could be changed at a state level.

In 2000 we changed the (long unenforced) law that prohibited mixed marriges, which required a vote of the people. Nobody enforced the law, like the one in MA that requires you to carry a rifle to church, in case of indian attack.
Some laws need to be repealed, but to allow laws to automatically expire is stupid. Do we really want the laws for murder, rape, and treason to expire?
This is why all laws don't have a sundown clause on laws. And when you talk about sundown clause for the constitution that is just crazy.




BamaD -> RE: Outdated Laws Should Expire (7/24/2016 4:10:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick

quote:

You realize that you are advocating the overthrow of our government?

So? It's not like he is the only one, I seem to recall Jefferson being in favour of doing so periodically.


And he understood that the price of failure was death.
Maybe we should execute people who want to repeal the constitution.
Why is it that non Americans think they know so much more about the U S than Americans do?




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