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RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 3:38:32 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


I completely agree with your point about confronting people (especially at gunpoint) who are not "active shooters" as you put it.

Why exactly do cops pull their weapons at unarmed drivers at DUI checkpoints just because they are refusing to comply and show their licence and insurance? If you can't deal with a gobby member of the public who isn't physically threatening you, you're in the wrong job.



There are a couple of reasons, most common sense when you think about it.

1) The officer has no clue if there is or is not a weapon in the car, and considering how many officers have been shot or injured in routine traffic stops, you cant blame the procedure.

2) When someone refuses to comply with an officer's instructions, they are committing a criminal act, and depending on the severity of the individuals actions could be as minor as a misdemeanor or as major as a felony.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to longwayhome)
Profile   Post #: 121
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 4:24:09 AM   
longwayhome


Posts: 1035
Joined: 1/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


I completely agree with your point about confronting people (especially at gunpoint) who are not "active shooters" as you put it.

Why exactly do cops pull their weapons at unarmed drivers at DUI checkpoints just because they are refusing to comply and show their licence and insurance? If you can't deal with a gobby member of the public who isn't physically threatening you, you're in the wrong job.



There are a couple of reasons, most common sense when you think about it.

1) The officer has no clue if there is or is not a weapon in the car, and considering how many officers have been shot or injured in routine traffic stops, you cant blame the procedure.

2) When someone refuses to comply with an officer's instructions, they are committing a criminal act, and depending on the severity of the individuals actions could be as minor as a misdemeanor or as major as a felony.


We're all on the same place with a suspect waving a gun around. No matter what you are doing with the gun, if you get shot by the police, you were doing something so risky you can hardly complain.

But am I really the only person who thinks it's not okay to point a gun at someone just because they have broken a minor law?

Couldn't it just be a bit counter-productive?

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 122
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 5:08:28 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyDemura

Why again are officers allowed to confront suspects at all without a legal council mediator? Seems like this would resolve this issue...and make the department pay for the fees if the suspect is not convicted...they just need to stop confronting people that aren't a real threat period, I get active shooters are something different, but if they haven't shot a civilian and are of no threat to civilians, why not require legal council to be the first contact, and TV news to be there if there is a confrontation so we can get a good camera angle...


And just how are you going to make the suspect sit still while waiting for those folks to show up? Or perhaps you think the cops should stay away from the situation until they show up? And if they kill a few people in the mean time, no worries right? As long as they don't shoot the suspect it's all good.

_____________________________

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This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


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Profile   Post #: 123
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 5:38:07 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


We're all on the same place with a suspect waving a gun around. No matter what you are doing with the gun, if you get shot by the police, you were doing something so risky you can hardly complain.

But am I really the only person who thinks it's not okay to point a gun at someone just because they have broken a minor law?

Couldn't it just be a bit counter-productive?


In most cases, the officer never pulls his weapon. In fact, in 5 years in law enforcement, I pulled my weapon a total of 5 times, I have known officers go 20 years and pull a weapon maybe 10 times total.

However, that was some time ago.

Today, unfortunately, things are different.

This year alone, over 10 officers have been killed in ambush situations and the year is not over. Last year, 16 were killed in ambushes.

The problem is two fold, cops who are on edge because they cant be sure a call or minor traffic stop is not going to escalate, and people who are just plain stupid and try to run over cops with cars, pull guns on an officer who pulled them over for a routine traffic stop.

Then there is the final problem, police departments are under staffed. Where two officers were assigned to patrol units in many major cities, you have one. So you have a single officer, first on the scene and has to act not only to keep himself safe, but to protect the public.

Hence the rise in dash and body cams, which does a fat lot of good if the officer comes up on a bad situation alone and is killed in the process.

Finally, there is a good reason there seems to be more bad or trigger happy cops. The pay sucks. Good cops can make more in the private sector than working for a police department. Rookies that meet the minimum standards in all respects are getting badges while people with the best qualifications are going elsewhere.

Then you get situations like we seem to be having a epidemic of.

So when people are screaming why cant we get better people in the job, the answer is simple, when the city says they need to raise taxes to pay cops a decent salary, the citizens say NO.

The reason I left law enforcement was the pay. Straight salary and after figuring the hours worked, it boiled down to less than minimum wage. Officers routinely work 50 or more hours a week and the pay is just not worth it.

You got seven hours on patrol, then you got paper work, training sessions, briefings, etc. By the time a day is finished you may have put in 11 to 14 hours.

Of course, when one cop screws up, every cop is a screw up, maniac with a badge and a gun, etc.

Sorry, but to be honest, many cities and towns get EXACTLY what they deserve.

No one ever holds rallies for a cop that saved a life, went out of his way to help someone, but one screw up by one bad cop and suddenly you have a riot.




_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to longwayhome)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 8:02:28 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


We're all on the same place with a suspect waving a gun around. No matter what you are doing with the gun, if you get shot by the police, you were doing something so risky you can hardly complain.

But am I really the only person who thinks it's not okay to point a gun at someone just because they have broken a minor law?

Couldn't it just be a bit counter-productive?


In most cases, the officer never pulls his weapon. In fact, in 5 years in law enforcement, I pulled my weapon a total of 5 times, I have known officers go 20 years and pull a weapon maybe 10 times total.

However, that was some time ago.

Today, unfortunately, things are different.

This year alone, over 10 officers have been killed in ambush situations and the year is not over. Last year, 16 were killed in ambushes.

The problem is two fold, cops who are on edge because they cant be sure a call or minor traffic stop is not going to escalate, and people who are just plain stupid and try to run over cops with cars, pull guns on an officer who pulled them over for a routine traffic stop.

Then there is the final problem, police departments are under staffed. Where two officers were assigned to patrol units in many major cities, you have one. So you have a single officer, first on the scene and has to act not only to keep himself safe, but to protect the public.

Hence the rise in dash and body cams, which does a fat lot of good if the officer comes up on a bad situation alone and is killed in the process.

Finally, there is a good reason there seems to be more bad or trigger happy cops. The pay sucks. Good cops can make more in the private sector than working for a police department. Rookies that meet the minimum standards in all respects are getting badges while people with the best qualifications are going elsewhere.

Then you get situations like we seem to be having a epidemic of.

So when people are screaming why cant we get better people in the job, the answer is simple, when the city says they need to raise taxes to pay cops a decent salary, the citizens say NO.

The reason I left law enforcement was the pay. Straight salary and after figuring the hours worked, it boiled down to less than minimum wage. Officers routinely work 50 or more hours a week and the pay is just not worth it.

You got seven hours on patrol, then you got paper work, training sessions, briefings, etc. By the time a day is finished you may have put in 11 to 14 hours.

Of course, when one cop screws up, every cop is a screw up, maniac with a badge and a gun, etc.

Sorry, but to be honest, many cities and towns get EXACTLY what they deserve.

No one ever holds rallies for a cop that saved a life, went out of his way to help someone, but one screw up by one bad cop and suddenly you have a riot.




7 cops were ambushed in one day and what did they do to bring it on themselves, they were protecting a BLM demonstration.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 9:04:52 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
but you are passing along the lie.

Its a myth.

The state has no obligation to protect you, the courts have ruled it countless times.

Cops work as chartered corporations no different than any other mercenary for hire.

Their duty is to prtect the state, not you.

They violate your 'inherent' right to travel every time they interfere with or arrest your movement, without probable cause and a warrant.

Turning on their red lights to pull you over on the street 'without an emergency' is a violation.


Morpheus: The Matrix is everywhere, it is all around us, even now in this very room. You can see it when you look out your window, or you turn on your television. You can feel it when you go to work, when you go to church, when you pay your taxes. It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth.

Neo: What truth?

Morpheus: That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born into bondage... born into a prison that you cannot smell or taste or touch. A prison for your mind.



The Matrix is all around you Neo.


Protect BLM? Get serious.




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 10/1/2016 9:10:33 AM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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Profile   Post #: 126
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 9:17:50 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Sorry, but to be honest, many cities and towns get EXACTLY what they deserve.

No one ever holds rallies for a cop that saved a life, went out of his way to help someone, but one screw up by one bad cop and suddenly you have a riot.




yeh whats not to love, just look how well protected these people are:





_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 9:39:30 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
All that said, as I said earlier, sending in the standing army, that runs in complete violation of the constitution, by our now militarized corporate thugs






to 'help' a man who is grief stricken and probably suicidal in the first place is insane.

That said as much as I hate to see this sort of thing, the cop in this case was justified in shooting, however this is not the way to handle these types of situations.

The cop had no reason to go any further than tell the guy to get his ass of the street, however its standard police procedure to stick their heads up your ass and count the peanuts in your shit, and that is where the problems arise.

the courts support the abolition of the 4th amendment in support of state tyranny.

My gut says its a ticking time bomb and if they dont wake their asses up and fix this shit they are setting this country up for another civil war.

and the irony is that they will remain in control and we think the 14th is bad I cant even imagine the shit they would come up with now days.




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 10/1/2016 9:46:37 AM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 9:45:16 AM   
Termyn8or


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"This year alone, over 10 officers have been killed in ambush situations and the year is not over. Last year, 16 were killed in ambushes. "

And they have killed thousands. I am sure that many times it is justified but other times it is not. What we need is for the good cops to stop covering up for the bad cops.

"The reason I left law enforcement was the pay. Straight salary and after figuring the hours worked, it boiled down to less than minimum wage. Officers routinely work 50 or more hours a week and the pay is just not worth it. "

i don't know about what kind of Mayberry RFD you worked in but here they get serious good money and a benefit package you wouldn't believe. Plus if they kill anyone they get two weeks off with pay. Maybe things are/were different there but today, up here in the city, being a cop pays pretty good.

"No one ever holds rallies for a cop that saved a life, went out of his way to help someone, but one screw up by one bad cop and suddenly you have a riot. "

Tell that to Al Sharpton. And that is a damn shame because i am sure many White cops have saved Black people maybe kids, maybe from their own Parents.

While we do have to get rid of bad cops, I do understand how they get fucked in the head. Walk into an apartment and there are cockroaches walking all over a baby. The place is filled with smoke. Nothing i the fridge. A 9 mm. on the coffee table. And they are still having kids ?

There is much worse, I have heard too much of it. I can understand why cops go off the rocker. Just hearing about it from them I think maybe I would too and see some people as not human and worthy of a taxpayer supplied bullet. And that has nothing to do with race. One of my Dad's best friends had a family that lived worse than any n____ you ever could find. the dog, the cats and the rats were fighting over the bag of dog food. And roaches, we had to do a shakedown before getting into the car to leave.

Bottom line though, cops are getting paranoid and something should be done. Bodycams that do not turn off will do alot to stop BLM and Al Sharpton from inciting riots. And they are public employees. People whio operate a cash register at the grocery store are on camera ever minute the work. So, we just let these people loose with guns ad can shoot anyone they want ? I understand why BLM is pissed off. But if they had evidence EVERY TIME that the shooting was justified there would be no problem, and no riot.

Accountability is the answer. Nixon erased 18½ minutes of tape he was not required to even record, but 33,000 email don't matter.

This is progress.

T^T

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 129
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 9:59:15 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Accountability is the answer. Nixon erased 18½ minutes of tape he was not required to even record, but 33,000 email don't matter.

This is progress.

T^T


The message in that little bottle of course is that the reprobates also benefit or are involved.

We have the fox guarding the henhouse (scrotus included), the constitution lays the responsibility of its protection to the jurisdiction of the civilian militia which has been not only abolished but laws (insurrection) have been passed to insure a militia can never again be created in this country. and now they have tanks and armored vehicles. (for the protection of the 'citizens' right jlf, Bama?)

They have all the bases covered.



< Message edited by Real0ne -- 10/1/2016 10:04:50 AM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 10:04:29 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

7 cops were ambushed in one day and what did they do to bring it on themselves, they were protecting a BLM demonstration.


Dont matter, cops lives arent worth two cents when compared to black lives, at least that is the why I am beginning to read it.

So far for 2016, 38 officers shot dead in the line of duty.

And while people take to the streets to protest the killing of a black man in the US, how many of those people take to the streets to protest killing a cop.

The Black Lives Matter movement has yet to denounce the New Black Panther's call for blacks to kill cops, have not denounced the people who kill cops from ambush, and only a small percentage of the marchers on the streets the night that 7 officers were ambushed and killed even bothered to show up for the memorial.

How about this solution.

Repeal the Posse Comitatus Act, bring all troops stationed over seas home, and let those guys police the cities where they seem to celebrate a cop getting killed.

Either that or eliminate police patrols in any neighborhood or community where a cop has been killed and none of the citizens seem to give a fuck.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 131
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 10:13:08 AM   
Nnanji


Posts: 4552
Joined: 3/29/2016
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


I completely agree with your point about confronting people (especially at gunpoint) who are not "active shooters" as you put it.

Why exactly do cops pull their weapons at unarmed drivers at DUI checkpoints just because they are refusing to comply and show their licence and insurance? If you can't deal with a gobby member of the public who isn't physically threatening you, you're in the wrong job.



There are a couple of reasons, most common sense when you think about it.

1) The officer has no clue if there is or is not a weapon in the car, and considering how many officers have been shot or injured in routine traffic stops, you cant blame the procedure.

2) When someone refuses to comply with an officer's instructions, they are committing a criminal act, and depending on the severity of the individuals actions could be as minor as a misdemeanor or as major as a felony.


We're all on the same place with a suspect waving a gun around. No matter what you are doing with the gun, if you get shot by the police, you were doing something so risky you can hardly complain.

But am I really the only person who thinks it's not okay to point a gun at someone just because they have broken a minor law?

Couldn't it just be a bit counter-productive?

Really, what do you define as a minor law? Maybe we should abolish those nanny state laws that aren't worth enforcing. Why don't you name them for me.

Let's see, you enter my property in the middle of the night to take things that I've traded parts of my productive life to acquire. How about that?

Maybe, you confront me and/or my family and threaten physical harm in order to literally frighten me into giving you stuff that I've worked portions of my life to have. How about that?

(in reply to longwayhome)
Profile   Post #: 132
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 10:15:05 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Either that or eliminate police patrols in any neighborhood or community where a cop has been killed and none of the citizens seem to give a fuck.



How about fixing the courts and stop passing on state lies. They built a house of cards that eddie craig and others have proven in court. Its not what the law really is its what they can get you to believe it is. Then harrass you with umpteen court appearances to defend a 30 dollar traffic ticket that in many cases they dont even have the 'legitimate' authority to gove you in the first place. Its a war against the people by extortion to insure their constant expansion. Just like this shit they call 'affordable' health care and social 'insecurity' that is precisely the opposite that the queen of england had her filthy mits in the center of.


FEDERAL JUDGE STATES IN COURT THAT HE GETS HIS ORDERS FROM ENGLAND

[quoting]

During the trial of James and Sharon Patterson, (Case 6:97-CR-51) William Wayne Justice, Judge of the United States District Court Texas-Eastern Division when presented with law stated:

"I take my orders from England. This is not a law this court goes by."


For all of those who did not believe that the United States was under Great Britain here it is straight from the mouth of a Federal Judge. How much more evidence 'do you need?' America has never been Free. The Revolutionary war was a fraud perpetrated on the American people. The war's purpose was to centralize power and make the people easier to control.

All Federal Judges, Congressmen, U.S. Attorneys, State Judges, Legislators and most Attorneys know this.

The police do not know that they work for Great Britain they too have been deceived so don't attack them.

http://university.ucadia.info/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.87


< Message edited by Real0ne -- 10/1/2016 10:36:41 AM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 133
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 10:21:29 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji

Let's see, you enter my property in the middle of the night to take things that I've traded parts of my productive life to acquire. How about that?

Maybe, you confront me and/or my family and threaten physical harm in order to literally frighten me into giving you stuff that I've worked portions of my life to have. How about that?


simple:

The Second Amendment of the United States Constitution reads: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Nnanji)
Profile   Post #: 134
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 11:40:01 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Finally, there is a good reason there seems to be more bad or trigger happy cops. The pay sucks. Good cops can make more in the private sector than working for a police department. Rookies that meet the minimum standards in all respects are getting badges while people with the best qualifications are going elsewhere.

Then you get situations like we seem to be having a epidemic of.

So when people are screaming why cant we get better people in the job, the answer is simple, when the city says they need to raise taxes to pay cops a decent salary, the citizens say NO.

The reason I left law enforcement was the pay. Straight salary and after figuring the hours worked, it boiled down to less than minimum wage. Officers routinely work 50 or more hours a week and the pay is just not worth it.

You got seven hours on patrol, then you got paper work, training sessions, briefings, etc. By the time a day is finished you may have put in 11 to 14 hours.


I can agree with you on this. The national annual median salary for a patrolman is about $62,000. There is a wide disparity among the states. In California and New Jersey the AMS is the highest at $92,000 and $89,000 respectively. Mississippi is the lowest with an AMS of $33,000. Texas was just below the national median. That's all very pathetic pay for people to work long hours and to risk their lives. New Jersey and California are high taxation and cost of living states, of course. Except for the New Jersey governor the state legislatures in those two states are controlled by the Democrats. I'm guessing the low pay of police is part and parcel of the war against public employees waged by right of center, small government politicians these past several decades. Just my guess.

_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 135
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 11:52:01 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji

Let's see, you enter my property in the middle of the night to take things that I've traded parts of my productive life to acquire. How about that?

Maybe, you confront me and/or my family and threaten physical harm in order to literally frighten me into giving you stuff that I've worked portions of my life to have. How about that?


simple:

The Second Amendment of the United States Constitution reads: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

As I posted earlier the Second Amendment was born of thirteen states who did not trust each other and who lived in fear of Britain and of France. From that view of history it is an antiquated concept. Other than hunting, sport, and bank robbing I fail to see its utility after the closing of the western frontier at the end of the 19th Century. The self protection paranoia is nurtured by the availability of so many guns. Now, please, I am not advocating the taking of all guns. I think we are past that remedy. And I can understand the hunting and sportsmanship aspects. I can feel that. But the self defense against the Washington "dictatorship" is just bullshit, imo.

_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 136
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 12:55:46 PM   
WickedsDesire


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Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline
The second amendment is an archaic concept - what does it truly mean, I have cited it half dozen times in the last two weeks? becuae it became clear to me amost no americans knew what it actually said, or truly means.

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bare ( I like bare) arms shall not be infringed.

Fifty-five men attended most of the meetings, there were never more than forty-six present at any one time, and ultimately only thirty-nine delegates actually signed the Constitution = 71% fair enough

If you would like to arm a bear(tis why they are armless-harmless, with a tommy gun and the coherence to utilise it then I am all for "sport"

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 137
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 1:12:45 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji

Let's see, you enter my property in the middle of the night to take things that I've traded parts of my productive life to acquire. How about that?

Maybe, you confront me and/or my family and threaten physical harm in order to literally frighten me into giving you stuff that I've worked portions of my life to have. How about that?


simple:

The Second Amendment of the United States Constitution reads: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

As I posted earlier the Second Amendment was born of thirteen states who did not trust each other and who lived in fear of Britain and of France. From that view of history it is an antiquated concept. Other than hunting, sport, and bank robbing I fail to see its utility after the closing of the western frontier at the end of the 19th Century. The self protection paranoia is nurtured by the availability of so many guns. Now, please, I am not advocating the taking of all guns. I think we are past that remedy. And I can understand the hunting and sportsmanship aspects. I can feel that. But the self defense against the Washington "dictatorship" is just bullshit, imo.



So why did you impasse the premise?

Have you read and do you understand the declaration of independence?

You can wipe your ass with a declaration, kingy never signed off title to anything lol


The history of the present King of [USA] is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these [people] To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

1) [The US and its states] has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

2) [The US and its states] has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

3) [The US and its states] has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

4) [The US and its states] has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

5) [The US and its states] has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

6) [The US and its states] has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

7) [The US and its states] has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.

8) [The US and its states] has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers.

9) [The US and its states] has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

10) [The US and its states] has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance.

11) [The US and its states] has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.

12) [The US and its states] has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power.

13) [The US and its states] has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:

14) [The US and its states] For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

15) [The US and its states] For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

16) [The US and its states] For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:

17) [The US and its states] For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

18) [The US and its states] For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:

19) [The US and its states] For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences

20) [The US and its states] For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies:

21) [The US and its states] taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:

22) [The US and its states] suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.

23) [The US and its states] has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.

24) [The US and its states] has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.

25) [The US and its states] is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.

26) [The US and its states] has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.

27) [The US and its states] has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

28) In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our Brittish brethren.

29) We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here.

30) We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.


There you go, lets see how many you can come up with that have NOT occurred in todays gubblmint. I even numbered them for you to meake it easy.





< Message edited by Real0ne -- 10/1/2016 1:16:43 PM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 138
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 1:20:29 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


I completely agree with your point about confronting people (especially at gunpoint) who are not "active shooters" as you put it.

Why exactly do cops pull their weapons at unarmed drivers at DUI checkpoints just because they are refusing to comply and show their licence and insurance? If you can't deal with a gobby member of the public who isn't physically threatening you, you're in the wrong job.



There are a couple of reasons, most common sense when you think about it.

1) The officer has no clue if there is or is not a weapon in the car, and considering how many officers have been shot or injured in routine traffic stops, you cant blame the procedure.

2) When someone refuses to comply with an officer's instructions, they are committing a criminal act, and depending on the severity of the individuals actions could be as minor as a misdemeanor or as major as a felony.


We're all on the same place with a suspect waving a gun around. No matter what you are doing with the gun, if you get shot by the police, you were doing something so risky you can hardly complain.

But am I really the only person who thinks it's not okay to point a gun at someone just because they have broken a minor law?

Couldn't it just be a bit counter-productive?

No we aren't, ML thinks that waving a gun around is ok if you are i an op0en carry state.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to longwayhome)
Profile   Post #: 139
RE: Yet another unarmed black man shot to death by police - 10/1/2016 1:22:44 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedsDesire

The second amendment is an archaic concept


Of course what vince is not saying is that "thou shalt not commit murder" is also an archaic concept. Following his logic should we abolish it too? Murder is an acceptable practice as long as its state sanctioned?

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to WickedsDesire)
Profile   Post #: 140
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