longwayhome
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quote:
ORIGINAL: respectmen
longwayhome
quote:
The irony is that my post indicated how comfortable I am with changing gender roles and how little anxiety I would have about living in a world where there was genuine equality and sensitivity to the needs and status of women. I was questioning why RM felt so angry and frightened.
The total fucking irony I see here is people such as your self being so fucking afraid of the other side of the story, while on the other hand, claiming you're about equality... which comes with equal empathy regardless of gender or race. In other words, you seem afraid of equality where both genders are considered instead of forcing kids to learn one side of the story while leaving the other side of the story in the dark.
My stance, why not tell BOTH sides of the story? Why leave consideration for one gender out of it? That's female favoritism and female chauvinism, not equality.
My stance and awareness's stance is wanting equality, your stance, Lucy's, Peons, and the rest of the fuckwits in here want female favoritism.
I wonder who is on the higher moral standing ground here?
No RM, I precisely see both sides.
On a personal basis, I don't want to be caught in some time warp male stereotype, any more than I want women to be stifled by traditional female gender roles. I do not agree with feminists who want female separatism (although looking at some of the male backlash I can understand that) so I don't agree with all strands of feminist thinking. What I believe is that greater equality of opportunity and a proper regard for both men and women is good for men too.
I'm not quite sure that you and "Awareness" do quite agree with each other about everything. I can see that you both hate feminists, but while he thinks that anyone who cannot see that male and female roles are set by biological determinism is a moron, you appear to be personally upset about the bad things the "feminazi" conspiracy has done to you.
What both both of you tend to do is to take every gendered issue that is brought up and say that men have it worse. Well that's generally just not true.
Domestic and relationship violence disproportionately affects women. It also affects a smaller number of men. Raising awareness of this issue involves highlighting those facts. Yes men who suffer domestic violence should be supported, but it doesn't change the fact that violence against women is the overwhelming majority of these cases. Teaching young people about domestic violence in the hope that it is less likely to be part of their lives, or that they will seek support if it is, is a perfectly sensible thing to do. The only men this disadvantages are the ones smacking their partners - as I man, I have no problem with that. Making men think about their role at home and in wider society may be uncomfortable for some but it's hardly unfair or abusive.
Men suffer plenty of violence, especially young men, but they tend not to suffer it in private behind locked doors. Tackling the causes of this type of mainly male on male violence requires different approaches, such as looking at personal safety, alcohol consumption patterns, better policing of public places, weapon control as well as tackling gangs and gang culture.
Both approaches are required, and asking people to look inside themselves and look at what they do and how they do it is a perfectly legitimate approach. It is the same with sexual violence where a mixture of personal safety and assertiveness is required, alongside raising awareness of behaviours, consent issues and respect. I don't see anyone saying that violence against men is okay or less traumatic for any individual male victim of violence, than it is for a female victim.
I am failing to see how a set of common sense approaches like that is a problem.
What you are doing is picking out the stuff that makes you feel uncomfortable as a man. You may not sexually assault people or beat your partner, but the overwhelming majority of people who do are men. Unpleasant but true. Once again, whilst the majority of sexual assault is against women, I don't see anyone in this or other threads saying that sexual violence against men is okay or any less traumatic for any individual male victim of that violence.
There's a big difference between accusing someone of being an abuser and asking them to think about their own approaches, and then do the right thing as a consequence. The majority of the attackers are men however and highlighting that is not being unfair to men. It's recognising reality.
I don't know about where you live, but where I live, male victims of violence are offered support as well as female victims. The majority of the resource for domestic and sexual violence is orientated towards female victims for practical reasons, but there are pathways for male support. Most people are unaware of them until they need them but they are there.
Sorry for the long response but its just too easy to fling a couple of swearwords or insults to rubbish what people are saying.
I do get the impression however that when you advocate for awareness of men's issues, you see it as some kind of binary opposition to respecting the experience of women. It isn't as simple as that, but in your rejection of every thing that looks feminist, I think that you are sometimes missing the point that women's issues actually need to be addressed, for the advantage of everyone in the community, including men.
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